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Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31 - Page 3

post #61 of 231
7/1/07 at 12:01pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Dalek
Is Popeye Meets Sinbad going to be Ultra Resolution?

WB's 1080p transfers of the color Looney Tunes are Ultra-Resolution, so the Technicolor two-reelers are probably the same.
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post #62 of 231
7/1/07 at 3:50pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Dalek
Is Popeye Meets Sinbad going to be Ultra Resolution?

I hope it looks better than the clip on the Droopy cartoon set. It didn't look much better than my old 16mm print, but maybe it was a pre-restoration clip.
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post #63 of 231
7/3/07 at 11:46am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Could anyone tell me, though there may be too many to mention, I remember when younger when seeing some of the earlier B/W shorts that Fleischer used constructed miniature sets dressed out in detail, filmed and then used as backdrops for the animated figures in the foreground. This might have been his answer to Disney's "multiplane"camera technique though I think these came first. One great example was in Ali Baba(?) Not sure. I was hoping to know if the first volume included these or did they come later in time.
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post #64 of 231
7/3/07 at 12:38pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles_Y
Could anyone tell me, though there may be too many to mention, I remember when younger when seeing some of the earlier B/W shorts that Fleischer used constructed miniature sets dressed out in detail, filmed and then used as backdrops for the animated figures in the foreground. This might have been his answer to Disney's "multiplane"camera technique though I think these came first. One great example was in Ali Baba(?) Not sure. I was hoping to know if the first volume included these or did they come later in time.
The technique you are talking about (called "Rotograph") is used prominently in the first color special 2-reeler "Popeye the Sailor Meets Sindbad the Sailor", which is definitely included in the set. Any prior uses will also be included since the set is chronological.

I believe the technique debuted on the "Out of the Inkwell" Koko the Clown series in the 20s, but I am not 100% positive.

Regards,
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post #65 of 231
7/3/07 at 7:28pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles_Y
Could anyone tell me, though there may be too many to mention, I remember when younger when seeing some of the earlier B/W shorts that Fleischer used constructed miniature sets dressed out in detail, filmed and then used as backdrops for the animated figures in the foreground. This might have been his answer to Disney's "multiplane"camera technique though I think these came first. One great example was in Ali Baba(?) Not sure. I was hoping to know if the first volume included these or did they come later in time.
Fleisher's 3-D background technique predate the multiplane camera by at least 5 years.
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post #66 of 231
7/3/07 at 7:55pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

There's an excellent 1939 Popular Mechanics short on the making of the Popeye short "Aladdin and His Wonderful Lamp" that shows the Rotograph in action. You can see it on the Thunderbean DVD. What a fascinating process.
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post #67 of 231
7/3/07 at 7:59pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

The Somewhere In Dreamland set of color Fleischer's includes use of that 3D technique in a number of shorts. They are even more "eye-popping" than the Popeye examples imo. I could be wrong, but I think Rotographing was a method of rotoscoping used to translate live action to animation. The 3D technique was patented and went by another name which appears at the start of each short.
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post #68 of 231
7/3/07 at 8:04pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

...just checked, "Stereo-optical Process" is what the 3D technique was dubbed.
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post #69 of 231
7/3/07 at 8:51pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillardK
The Somewhere In Dreamland set of color Fleischer's includes use of that 3D technique in a number of shorts. They are even more "eye-popping" than the Popeye examples imo. I could be wrong, but I think Rotographing was a method of rotoscoping used to translate live action to animation. The 3D technique was patented and went by another name which appears at the start of each short.
The "stereo-optical process" was rotographing as it was achieved through the compositing of "live action" photographed background and foreground model elements with animation.

Regards,
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post #70 of 231
7/3/07 at 9:24pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

ok... so Rotographing was using Rotoscoping in a Stereo-optic Process? I found the term quoted on the back of the dvd case, haven't checked what the patent is in the shorts.
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post #71 of 231
7/4/07 at 3:00am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Awesome news. This will be a must buy for me.
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post #72 of 231
7/4/07 at 9:43am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillardK
...just checked, "Stereo-optical Process" is what the 3D technique was dubbed.
I'm not sure if thats accurate since the Superman shorts are credited for using the stereooptical process and do not utilize those 3-D models.
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post #73 of 231
7/4/07 at 11:11am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Well, I'm obviously uncertain about the terms (I should probably rewatch the documentary on the Dreamland disc). But at the risk of being overly pedantic, here's my understanding of the three processes used in varying combinations:

Stereo-optic - multi-planed sets to create depth

Rotoscoping - live action transcribed to 2D animation

Rotographing - essentially "stop-motion" use of 3D models

The notice at the start of the Color Classics is no help at all as it states "patent pending on special processes used in this production."
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post #74 of 231
7/4/07 at 12:00pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

The specific patent for the effect we are talking about is Patent number 2054414 "Art of Making Motion Picture Cartoons" - Filed on November 2, 1933 by Max Fleischer - Issued on September 15, 1936. Check it out on google patent search. It even includes drawings of the apparatus.

Regards,
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post #75 of 231
7/4/07 at 7:17pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Thanks for that link! I didn't realize you could google patents specifically.

A number of sites do refer to the device as a Rotograph, but just looking at the word itself (which I didn't see mentioned in the patent) leaves me skeptical. An explanation someone posted under a youtube Popeye clip sounds to me very plausable:

"The devise was referred to as The Stereoptical Process.
The Rotograph was an Arial Image process where live action was photographed single frame with animation cels to produce an animation/live action composite.
Fleischer was doing this in his silent OUT OF THE INKWELL films from 1921 on. The first evidence is in
the first film Fleischer produced when he went independent, MODELING (1921)."

...meaning that the Stereo-optical Process (the patented device) can be said to use the technique of Rotographing (compositing 3D models/live-action/stop-motion with 2D animation).

Conversely, Rotographing can be accomplished without using the Stereo-optical Process.

Also, unless you want to consider the 2D background planes as essentially 3D models, the Stereo-optical Process can be used without Rotographing.
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post #76 of 231
7/6/07 at 11:15am
Thread Starter 

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

First review? http://www.popsyndicate.com/site/sto...1938_volume_1/
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post #77 of 231
7/6/07 at 11:26am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

As for the first review,great but how could you not say anything about the
color shorts
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post #78 of 231
7/7/07 at 9:32am
Thread Starter 

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Screenshots: http://classiccartoons.blogspot.com/...-event-of.html and http://www.cartoonresearch.com/popeyedvd.html
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post #79 of 231
7/7/07 at 3:15pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Absolutely jaw-dropping clarity!
This set can't get here fast enough as far as I'm concerned!
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post #80 of 231
7/7/07 at 3:48pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

My god... that looks absolutely STUNNING! If only Warner's could get the rights to the rest of the Fleischer catalog =(.
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post #81 of 231
7/7/07 at 7:05pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Indeed. I want Betty Boop
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post #82 of 231
7/8/07 at 8:42am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Many thanks for both the review and the pictures!!! I want this set NOW!!!
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post #83 of 231
7/9/07 at 12:28pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Its a shame the same care and money didn't go into the Superman cartoons!
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post #84 of 231
7/9/07 at 1:23pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Am I the only one who thinks the colors on the actual animated characters look a little too day-glo saturated on the color stills? The backgrounds look very pretty, though.

Regards,
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post #85 of 231
7/9/07 at 6:40pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken_McAlinden
Am I the only one who thinks the colors on the actual animated characters look a little too day-glo saturated on the color stills? The backgrounds look very pretty, though.

Regards,
For all intent and purposes they probably had that look originally. On a related note, I was kinda surprised how blue Fleischer's Superman looked when watching the Ultra Res versions on the Superman box set for instance.
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post #86 of 231
7/22/07 at 12:02pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

I received my Popeye DVD the other day and I must say that this set is outstanding. This first volume contains some of the best Popeye shorts ever made, a lot of which I'd never seen before. If there's only one Popeye you'll ever own, then this is it. Luckily, there's more volumes on the way...
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post #87 of 231
7/29/07 at 4:02am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

I know alot of people dont like them, but at what volume do the color famous studios popeye will appear ? Volume 3 or is that too soon?
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post #88 of 231
7/29/07 at 7:18am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Zannikos
I know alot of people dont like them, but at what volume do the color famous studios popeye will appear ? Volume 3 or is that too soon?
Color Famous Popeyes don't start appearing until 1943 so yeah probably Volume 3.
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post #89 of 231
7/29/07 at 9:09am

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Thanks , cant wait !
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post #90 of 231
7/29/07 at 1:55pm

Re: Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1 (1933-1938) 7/31

Wow. I am surprised what they were able to get away with. Regarding Betty Boop.

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