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The Shield: Season Six - Page 3

post #61 of 189
4/11/07 at 8:42pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Brennan
I don't like the way Kavanaugh left the show at all... it seemed more convenient from a writing standpoint than a realistic character development. Having said that, great episode... another home run... and I'll miss Whittaker on the show.

It does seem convenient but I totally bought the execution. In particular, the scene with Dutch watching Kavanaugh break while watching the interrogation sold me that he realized that he was in over his head. Whittaker has been fantastic all along but I thought that moment was one of his best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holadem
No mention of the grizzly crime scene from last week eh? Too much to deal with I guess.

It was mentioned several times but, yeah, no real progress. I'm guessing that with Kavanaugh out of the picture and Vic off the hook that the mass murder will become Dutch's lead case.
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post #62 of 189
4/11/07 at 9:11pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holadem
My favorite scenes were between Claudette and Dutch as they smell foul play in Kavanaugh's story. The quiet conversation between these two upstairs showcases them both at their very best, her relentless pursuit of truth at all cost (including her chance at a promotion a season or two ago) and his superlative intuition. They are truly the best of the barn.--
H

I totally agree with this. The writers have done an amazing job over the years developing all the characters on this show and the scene you mentioned is such a perfect example of that. It was exactly how you'd expect Dutch and Claudette to approach the investigation. I don't think any show, not even the Sopranos has managed to develop and maintain the characters so consistantly.

Count me among those sorry to see Forrest Whittaker go. He's a great talent. Did anyone else happen to catch his appearance on ER this season? He was ridiculously good in that show too.
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post #63 of 189
4/12/07 at 12:40am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

I thought it was a good, logical ending to the Kavanaugh storyline, and it was nice to see Whittaker underplay it in the last few scenes instead of flipping out as he has in the past. I hope his prediction about Vic getting his in the end is accurate, as I've always thought that would be the best way to end the show. I'll admit that I'm a bit worried because I'm still unsure as to how far they can take this storyline once Vic finds out it was Shane, and they still have 7 episodes + next season left...
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post #64 of 189
4/12/07 at 10:38am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

I'll just throw my .02 in as well .... not that I needed any more convincing, but this last episode really cemented my opinion that this show is the best on TV. There aren't any better developed characters anywhere. I wasn't quite sure how Vic was going to get out of it, but (as Vic mentioned at the end of the episode) Kavanaugh just couldn't play on the same field as Vic.

While most everybody is sorry to see Forrest Whitaker go, my wife (who I've converted into a Shield fan) had the exact opposite reaction. She was glad to get rid of him (not that she didn't like Whitaker, but the Kavanaugh character). As mentioned on a number of the Season 5 commentaries, if Vic is an "anti-hero" , then Kavanaugh is the "anti-villian." You *should* like him, but just wanted him to get out of the picture and let Mackey be Mackey.

Can't wait to see how Shane handles the growing guilt .... (and how Vic responds when he inevitably finds out!)
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post #65 of 189
4/12/07 at 1:31pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

As a quick follow-up to what we've been talking about...

From the official "Shield" FX blog:
Quote:
Baptism by Fire. Episode 613.
Written by Scott Rosenbaum. Writer/Executive Producer

There are times as a writer when the demands of a script not only excite you, but scare the hell out of you as well. Writing Jon Kavanaugh’s send-off episode of The Shield was exactly one of those times. The stakes were high. Forrest Whitaker’s portrayal of Jon Kavanaugh had been utterly compelling and a joy for all of us to be a part of. How would we say goodbye to him? Would we send him off with a bang, or as Vic Mackey would like it -- a whimper?

It shouldn’t have surprised me that the answer was neither. The Shield has never been about black and white – always about the grays in between. Kavanaugh began his quest to bring down Vic as a cop with a strict moral code; dedicated to the letter, and spirit, of the law. But like all those who enter Vic Mackey’s orbit, he found himself sucked into Vic’s vortex of corruption, lies, and deceit. There’s a saying “to hunt a fox you must become the fox.” Yes, Kavanaugh became the fox and for a moment, appeared ready to follow Vic down into the foxhole, abandoning the moral code he spent his entire life abiding by. Ultimately he refused to enter the moral black hole and walked away.

A bang or a whimper? You decide. I can still see Vic Mackey’s self-satisfied smirk from the day we shot the final scene; Vic staring at Kavanaugh sitting in a jail cell, basking in the knowledge that (in his mind at least) he’d won. Did he? The scorecard at least says so. Kavanaugh lost his job, his wife, his attempt to bring down Vic and the Strike Team. Yet by confessing to framing Vic, and clearing his conscience, Kavanaugh won something very important; his humanity. So, who really won or lost? You’ll have to wait till season 7 to find out, but I assure you it’ll be worth the journey.

Nifty.
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post #66 of 189
4/18/07 at 5:56am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Another stellar episode. Seems to me that Vic got a little sloppy in that he killed Guardo with his own gun. If the police ever find the body, then forensics could probably link the bullet to Vic. Everyone at the Barn already knew that Guardo was a suspect in Lem's death. It wouldn't be hard to put two and two together.

Another thing that could happen is Shane eventually can't take the guilt anymore and confesses not only to Lem's murder but gives up Vic as well to avoid the death penalty. It's going to be fun seeing how all of this plays out.
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post #67 of 189
4/18/07 at 6:51am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Agreed. Another stellar episode.
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post #68 of 189
4/18/07 at 7:02am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Another great episode, as expected.

First time though I actually looked at Vic less as a bad guy hero and more as just a bad guy as he tortured the wrong guy. I do not know if it was intentional, but us knowing who really is the killer and letting Vic go so medieval, it will ease his potential upcoming down fall. Shanes's reminder that Guardo killed kids with his grenades may take off some of the horror of his torture, but Vic looked less like Robin Hood and more like the guys he hunts last night.
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post #69 of 189
4/18/07 at 9:53am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Watching this season, I'm reminded of the the old line about how copies are just not as sharp as originals. Shane has learned the "ways" of Vic and has emulated him right through offing a team member as a means of protecting himself. The greatness of this season has been Shane's apparent inability to harden his heart as Vic can.

If the show is a gritty life-in-the-streets drama, it will somehow end with one turning his back on the other. If it is an opera, there will be the standoff between the two: The gunshot followed by the tears.

Either way, I will be watching!
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post #70 of 189
4/18/07 at 10:40am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Steve was killing me in this episode. Shane's going to lose it quick. Seeing Ronnie as supercop was sort of funny as he probably had more lines in this episode than collectively over the series run.
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post #71 of 189
4/18/07 at 12:19pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Seeing Ronnie as supercop was sort of funny as he probably had more lines in this episode than collectively over the series run.

I was thinking the same thing, Patrick.

Who knew the guy spoke?
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post #72 of 189
4/18/07 at 12:20pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Yep ... another great episode ... Shane is losing it .. and quickly I still think that eventually he's gong to have to confess to Vic about what he did. Vic obviously thinks he's gotten Lem's killer, but I don't think he'll overlook (what I will assume to be) Shane's increasing guilt.
I have to say I never really gave Walt Goggins much credit for the character of Shane .. in previous seasons, he seemed to pretty much be portrayed as a bit of a redneck-stereotype who (most of the time) was just emulating Vic. But his performance at the end of last season and so far in the current set of shows has really impressed me.
And I too loved Ronnie's "supercop" role ... it was like he had to slow everything down for Dutch and Billings, like a "Strike Team for Dummies" ...
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post #73 of 189
4/18/07 at 1:24pm
Thread Starter 

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Man, Vic was brutal. I'm bummed that there's only seven more episodes.

Walton Goggins continues to stand out in a cast of great actors.

I love seeing Dutch and Billings together (especially since they've made Billings less of a bungler but he's still Billings). They give the show much needed comic relief.
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post #74 of 189
4/18/07 at 4:21pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

This is easily the best drama on TV and has gotten better episode by episode while the Sopranos have spiraled downward.

I don't know where the Sopranos went so wrong but I'm tired of being let down by that show and have decided to stick to the cream of the crop. I haven't been let down by this show yet as they remember story lines and effectively bring a conclusion to them and their characters.

Everyone pretty much feels that there will be a showdown between Shane and Vic but I don't know. Shane has done some strange things in the past and I wouldn't put it past him to do something off the wall to exorcise his guilt AND pin it on someone else.
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post #75 of 189
4/18/07 at 6:24pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu
This is easily the best drama on TV and has gotten better episode by episode while the Sopranos have spiraled downward.

Amen to that. Not to turn this into a "Sopranos bashing" thread, but I'm just glad that show is going to be over soon as I'm tired of the constant disappointment. I remember when The Sopranos used to be as good as The Shield is now..........man, those were the days.

Just got around to watching last night's episode and I agree with everyone that is was stellar again(not that it should come as a surprise at this point). Vic busted out some torture that would make Jack Bauer proud and I was sitting there watching with my mouth basically hanging open at what he was doing to Guardo.

Most importantly, did Dutch Boy actually have a shot with the hot cop before things got interrupted?
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post #76 of 189
4/18/07 at 6:31pm
Thread Starter 

Re: The Shield: Season Six

I think I'm still most struck by the fact that The Shield has always been good but everything from Season Four and up has just been amazing. Even with shows that I love, I almost always feel that their earlier years are their best.

And for the record, I think The Sopranos is a masterpiece and one of the best shows ever on TV.
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post #77 of 189
4/18/07 at 7:19pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Man what an episode...... Wow... The torture scene was intense.. I could see shane starting to crack.. it is only a matter of time before he explodes.

I can't wait to see how this whole story ends... but at the same time I don't want it to end.

R~
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post #78 of 189
4/18/07 at 7:20pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Man, great stuff. I thought they might lose a little bit of momentum for an episode or two with the close of the Kavanaugh arc but they didn't miss a step.

Liked Ronnie's bigger role here. I've always liked him and as sad as it is to have Lem out of the picture hopefully it will let him come into focus a bit more. He's always been a bit of a cypher- he generally seems like one of the most "decent" members of the team but tonight he didn't even bat an eye when Vic tortured and killed Guardo.

Quote:
First time though I actually looked at Vic less as a bad guy hero and more as just a bad guy as he tortured the wrong guy.

That's what I love about this show- it can so easily switch your impressions of a character from like to dislike and back while remaining true to the characters. As much as I hated Shane for what he did to Lem (and some of the stuff he pulled in Season 4 and with Tavon), he's coming off more sympathetic now than Vic is.

And sometimes it takes an episode like this to remind you that Vic and Shane killed another cop in cold blood way back in the pilot.
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post #79 of 189
4/18/07 at 10:24pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Grey
Liked Ronnie's bigger role here. I've always liked him and as sad as it is to have Lem out of the picture hopefully it will let him come into focus a bit more. He's always been a bit of a cypher- he generally seems like one of the most "decent" members of the team but tonight he didn't even bat an eye when Vic tortured and killed Guardo.

And don't forget, he was totally cool with the whole money train idea from the start. Ronnie's been on Vic's side more often than anyone.
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post #80 of 189
4/19/07 at 1:29am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Agreed, another stellar episode (which I watched last week and had to resist posting on till now...)

Billings is just so full of it. He's always had a rather inflated sense of self-worth, and it was just so funny watching him working with Dutch. And (belatedly) attaboy Dutch for figuring out Kavanaugh's scheme. Showing that he and Wyms are the only really good (in both senses of the word) cops in the barn -- the truth is paramount, even if in that instance they exonerated Vic.

I was wondering, any likelihood that 'Hernan', the FBI mole, was Guardo himself? Very unlikely I think, since under that much torture he probably would've cracked and revealed his identity to try save himself from being killed by cops, but not impossible?

And Vic's dealings with the Mexican cop were quite funny as well; "waiving his cut" seemed to work wonders on the Mexican cop's reluctance, showing that he was driven solely by money, whereas Vic was driven by revenge and money was now irrelevant.
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post #81 of 189
4/19/07 at 6:40am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yee-Ming
I was wondering, any likelihood that 'Hernan', the FBI mole, was Guardo himself? Very unlikely I think, since under that much torture he probably would've cracked and revealed his identity to try save himself from being killed by cops, but not impossible?

What I think will happen is that Hernan will inform Dutch that Guardo disappeared across the border when someone kidnapped his girlfriend. Dutch will track down the girlfriend and she'll tell the whole story and describe Shane and Vic as the perps. Or hell, maybe she'll just come in voluntarily when Guardo never shows up again.
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post #82 of 189
4/19/07 at 6:46am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Anyone else hoping that the future episode in which the truth comes out about Lem's murder is titled "Fun With Vic and Shane?"
NOTE: The above isn't a spoiler, I'm just guessing that it has to happen eventually.
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post #83 of 189
4/19/07 at 6:55am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
If it is an opera, there will be the standoff between the two: The gunshot followed by the tears.
I dunno, we've kinda been there already with these two. Hopefully it comes to a head in fresh exciting way. I've yet to be dissapointed by this show so I have faith.

--
H
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post #84 of 189
4/19/07 at 3:28pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Holadem
I dunno, we've kinda been there already with these two. Hopefully it comes to a head in fresh exciting way. I've yet to be disappointed by this show so I have faith.

I agree, I really don't think they'll have Vic kill Shane. Obviously he'll fly into some type of a rage and do something to someone. Or maybe just turn him in. But then Shane knows so much dirt on Vic he could drag him down with him. So I'm hoping for something in between, whatever that might be.
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post #85 of 189
4/19/07 at 7:01pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

It might be possible that Shane just turns himself in and takes the blame for lots of the stuff that the Strike Team has been suspected of and clear Vic and Ronnie.
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post #86 of 189
4/19/07 at 7:31pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian.L
I agree, I really don't think they'll have Vic kill Shane. Obviously he'll fly into some type of a rage and do something to someone. Or maybe just turn him in. But then Shane knows so much dirt on Vic he could drag him down with him. So I'm hoping for something in between, whatever that might be.

I think Vic is going to find himself in exactly the situation Shane was in with Lem. Shane is going to be so guilt-ridden that he's going to turn himself in but he'll promise not to rat out Vic. But the DA will probably offer up some kind of deal (does California have the death penalty? Maybe that will be a bargaining chip) if he'll give up Vic. So Vic's faced with seeing his life destroyed if he lets Shane go to prison and find exactly the same dilemma that Shane had.
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post #87 of 189
4/20/07 at 8:36am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
And don't forget, he was totally cool with the whole money train idea from the start. Ronnie's been on Vic's side more often than anyone.

The intrigue to me in all this is how it will end for Vic. I didn't really think about it until Brian mentioned it but Ronnie could be Vic and/or Shane's downfall. He sides with Vic now but doesn't know that Vic killed a cop in episode 1 nor does he know how Lem really died. It may be a tug of war between Vic and Shane using Ronnie as the rope.

On the other hand, with Dutch in his hated position in the shadows last week and his continuing investigation, he may end up with a big part at the end of all this.
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post #88 of 189
4/20/07 at 10:32am

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielCo
He sides with Vic now but doesn't know that Vic killed a cop in episode 1 nor does he know how Lem really died.

Am I the only one who didn't realize until last season that Lem and Ronnie didn't know that Vic and Shane killed the cop in the pilot?

And, yeah, I think Dutch will play a major role in Vic's downfall. I think Vic and the team are kind of blind to him- they know he's a good detective but I don't think they give him the credit he deserves due to his passive nature. I think Vic was very sloppy in how he handled Guardo and that's going to lead Dutch right onto the trail.
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post #89 of 189
4/20/07 at 3:20pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Grey
(does California have the death penalty? Maybe that will be a bargaining chip)

Yes they do. However even if applied it takes about 20 years to carry it out.
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post #90 of 189
4/20/07 at 6:35pm

Re: The Shield: Season Six

Does anyone believe that Vic will actually go to prison?

I think he will probably go out in a blaze of glory. In a shootout with drug dealers, a hostage situation, something that will allow him to redeem himself even though the walls are closing in on him and he knows it.
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