Home Theater Forum › Home Theater Forum › Other Diversions › Computers and HTPC › Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

post #1 of 68
2/4/07 at 11:31pm
Thread Starter 
The ads, while funny, seem to alternate between gross simplifications and outright fabrications. Why does Microsoft let Apple swindle its marketing base away without choosing to be a part of the discussion? Is it that arrogant? Is it that inflexible?
Reply
post #2 of 68
2/5/07 at 5:12am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

My guess is that with 95% of the market, it's not worth their money. Plus, acknowledging them would give them credibility.

I haven't seen most of the ads since I pretty much only watch sports on TV; but I'm curious what you feel is fabricated.
Reply
post #3 of 68
2/5/07 at 9:31am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Whenever Bill Gates opens his mouth, he does so wide enough to comfortably accommodate his own foot. Notice his recent statements that Mac exploits come out every day, yet Windows exploits appear only once a month.
Reply
post #4 of 68
2/5/07 at 10:24am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Microsoft has been too busy empowering its users with fuzzy-headed passion pleas while calling them walnut-brained dinosaurs to counter slick Apple ads.

What was that full "our passion" logo: "Helping you help us help you do what you want to do?" Something crazy like that.

Microsoft is genetically incapable of producing cogent ads for its business software. Forget about countering pop-culture Apple
Reply
post #5 of 68
2/5/07 at 11:09am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

My main problem with the ads is that they would be just as funny if they didn't oversimplify and possibly even misrepresent the facts. But of course it wouldn't be to Apples benefit to admit that the Windows based PC is the only sensible choice if you want to play games on your computer, for instance...
Reply
post #6 of 68
2/5/07 at 11:10am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Gardiner
Whenever Bill Gates opens his mouth, he does so wide enough to comfortably accommodate his own foot. Notice his recent statements that Mac exploits come out every day, yet Windows exploits appear only once a month.
that's a larf. news about windows exploits are only RELEASED BY MICROSOFT once a month. i know youre not arguing this point, but sadly, there are those who buy into that crap.
CJ
Reply
post #7 of 68
2/5/07 at 11:55am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
But of course it wouldn't be to Apples benefit to admit that the Windows based PC is the only sensible choice if you want to play games on your computer, for instance...

Hyperbole? I'm almost finished with the new Age of Empires III. It may be a year late, but I, and my extensive games folder, would disagree that the PC is the only sensible choice.

I don't really see a lot to disagree with the Mac/PC ads, though I am admittedly biased. I think the best ad that Jobs & Co. could run right now would be a variant on "Redmond, start your photocopiers" that they did a couple years back at WWDC.
Reply
post #8 of 68
2/5/07 at 2:38pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

I'm not talking about games that are ancient history for PC gamers, I'm talking about playing the new stuff as it comes out. I'm talking about getting your hands on Crysis as it comes out sometime this year and being able to play it, to pick what is probably the most eagerly anticipated and the largest DirectX 10 title. I'm talking about Supreme Commander, which will be out any day now, and doing some really ground-breaking RTS battling. I doubt those two for instance will ever be on the Mac, and if they are it will be at a time when PC gamers are already playing the next generation, most likely...

The PC is the only sensible choice (besides consoles) for people who want to game new titles as they come out more or less painlessly, full stop.

I'm not saying you can't game on the Mac, I'm saying that you'll always be way behind the PC on availability and probably also 3d performance/quality, so a person with gaming as a very high priority would have to be on crack to go with a Mac.

Oh, and by this criterion and by the criteria used by Apple for the ads, a Mac becomes a PC the instant it boots Windows, and thus if you're gaming using Bootcamp for instance you count as a PC gamer...
Reply
post #9 of 68
2/6/07 at 5:39am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

I'd like to see Microsoft have a little fun with the commercials too. Let's just have a second commercial from Microsoft following up on the one about the Webcam. The point Mac makes is that it's comes with the monitor, built in, where if you own a PC you have to purchase it seperate.

Follow up commercial:

Webcam breaks/malfunctions/doesn't work...

PC Guy: Man, I've been working my butt off for the past 2 weeks getting stuff done with video conferencing, how about you Mac.

Mac: Well, my web cam broke, and since it's part of the monitor, I had to send the whole monitor back to get looked at, they said I would be able to get back on my Mac in 6-8 weeks. So, I've been reading a book a lot. Holds his head down and walks off.
Reply
post #10 of 68
2/6/07 at 7:20am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Microsoft is the leader. Anytime you're on top, you're going to have the competition try to take you down.

It's that simple. Microsoft doesn't need to couter act because it will make them look like the bully.

And of course the Mac ads are simplications of concepts that are easier on the Mac...but if you want 100% truth in advertising, then why doesn't Microsoft come right out and say Vista is shit?
Reply
post #11 of 68
2/6/07 at 7:49am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

As for gaming on a Mac I don't think Apple cares that much. Really how many gamers do you know who buy OEM systems? Every one I know custom built their PC so they aren't interested in buying a Mac...or Dell, HP etc.
Reply
post #12 of 68
2/6/07 at 7:52am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Also, most gamers know how to use a computer. The Mac ads are geared toward 'nubes' by getting them to buy a Mac because it's easier to work with right out of the box, without a lot of computer knowledge.

That's the true basis behind these commercials. Not which is better (whatever that exactly means ) but which one is easier to use for someone without any real knowledge.
Reply
post #13 of 68
2/6/07 at 8:25am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
The Mac ads are geared toward 'nubes' by getting them to buy a Mac because it's easier to work with right out of the box, without a lot of computer knowledge.
I had to smirk when I saw a Mac ad years ago that had a woman saying proudly "I don't know anything about computers".
Reply
post #14 of 68
2/6/07 at 11:53am

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Pratt
As for gaming on a Mac I don't think Apple cares that much. Really how many gamers do you know who buy OEM systems? Every one I know custom built their PC so they aren't interested in buying a Mac...or Dell, HP etc.
All of them. Over the years, my good friend / hardcore gamer bought high-end Falcon systems. My other friends have OEM PCs for school / work / home and play games on the side.

I believe it would help Apple in the marketplace to offer video cards suitable for gaming for the iMacs (something like a nVidia 7600 or 7900). This is the biggest anxiety I have about getting an Apple: no more PC gaming. I loves me some gaming after getting a new computer.

And don't forget about the great mass of people who play "leisure" games, like The Sims and Civilization, and who might don't need cutting edge hardware, but know they want to play games once in a while. And may think a Mac is no good for that.
Reply
post #15 of 68
2/6/07 at 12:26pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
I had to smirk when I saw a Mac ad years ago that had a woman saying proudly "I don't know anything about computers".

Why? Because in your mind it makes you feel superior to this woman? You can chuckle at her expense because she's not the computer "expert" that you are?

99% of people in the world don't give a fig how their computer works, only that it does and does so reliably. And given those criteria, she made the correct choice by choosing Macintosh.

But that's ok, you can always comfort yourself with the understanding that you're a superior computer user when you're editing your registry or cleaning up that pesky virus.
Reply
post #16 of 68
2/6/07 at 12:40pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveF
I believe it would help Apple in the marketplace to offer video cards suitable for gaming for the iMacs (something like a nVidia 7600 or 7900). This is the biggest anxiety I have about getting an Apple: no more PC gaming. I loves me some gaming after getting a new computer.
The real issue probably lies in the fact that most games are developed for PC's and the Mac versions must be converted. I mentioned this in the other Mac thread, but Macs are powerful and they are killer when it comes to design, grpahics, HD and other high end "Art" apps, but when it comes to intense CPU/Mathematical computing, PC's have the edge.

That's why PC's are king in the games department. Macs aren't exactly built for hard core gaming (or any sort of high end 3D, period).

I guess it's like buying a sports car and wondering why it can't go off roading. PC's are built for off roading...Macs aren't.

But there again is why I love having both a Mac and a PC. They are becoming very similar every day, but there are specific areas in which one wins out over the other. You just have to decide which areas are most important to you.
Reply
post #17 of 68
2/6/07 at 12:58pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Why?
Because I see nothing virtuous about ignorance. Having an "I know nothing, I pay others to know it for me" attitude is not something to be proud of.
Reply
post #18 of 68
2/6/07 at 1:09pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
Because I see nothing virtuous about ignorance. Having an "I know nothing, I pay others to know it for me" attitude is not something to be proud of.
But was she really bragging about her ignorance (I don't remember the ad)? From what you describe, it almost sounds like she saying that she was proud that she was able to work a computer even though she knew nothing about them? That's surely something to be proud of.
Reply
post #19 of 68
2/6/07 at 2:03pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkHastings
The real issue probably lies in the fact that most games are developed for PC's and the Mac versions must be converted. I mentioned this in the other Mac thread, but Macs are powerful and they are killer when it comes to design, grpahics, HD and other high end "Art" apps, but when it comes to intense CPU/Mathematical computing, PC's have the edge.

That's why PC's are king in the games department. Macs aren't exactly built for hard core gaming (or any sort of high end 3D, period).
This may have been the case when G5, PowerPC, or Motorola 68030's CPUs battled against 486 and Pentium chips; and when Apple had its own type of video card versus PC's VESA and AGP.

But now Mac's and PC's are the same. Different soul, but same brain, organs, and skeletons.

There is no reason why a Mac can't game as well as a PC. Except that Apple has decided its customers don't want / need a GPU suitable for mid-range gaming. And even if OSX is intrinsically incapable of running games, Boot Camp would enable it...should Apple deem to sell its users a suitable graphics card.

Clearly Apple believes there's inadequate profit doing that. I (ignorantly) posit it would only help their revenues by offering gaming-suited video cards as upgrade options.
Reply
post #20 of 68
2/6/07 at 2:16pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
Because I see nothing virtuous about ignorance. Having an "I know nothing, I pay others to know it for me" attitude is not something to be proud of.

I suppose you fix your own automobile then? Do all of your own home repairs (appliances included)? Diagnose your own medical conditions and prescribe your own medication?

You know another attitude that's not something to be proud of? Hypocritical elitism.
Reply
post #21 of 68
2/6/07 at 2:19pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

I still don't think it has much to do with the video card as it does the translation between the video card and the CPU, but I don't have much proof in my theory - I'm just going by the little I do know about Macs capabilities in the 3D realm.

I believe it might have something to do with Direct X. I don't think Mac has anything similar to Direct X and that's why PC's can compute massive 3D environments in real time (i.e. as in games).

I know this is an old article, but HAS Direct X ever been successfully implemented into Macs (for porting of hard core games)?
http://www.macworld.com/news/2002/04/17/macdx/
Reply
post #22 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:02pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
I suppose you fix your own automobile then? Do all of your own home repairs (appliances included)? Diagnose your own medical conditions and prescribe your own medication?
I certainly wouldn't proudly say "My doctor operated on me and I have no idea what he did or why!", or say "I took my car to be serviced, and I have no idea what was done or why!". Not having the same skill or knowledge as others doesn't equate to complete ignorance, nor does not enjoying being so equate to "elitism".
Reply
post #23 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:08pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

I think a more appropriate comparison would be this:

Let's say my cars engine stopped working. I did something to it and it started working again. If someone mentioned how hard it was to work on car engines, I would say (proudly): "I fixed my car and I don't know the first thing about auto repair".

Or let's say I was really sick and a friend of mine had the same sickness. This friend goes to the Dr.'s and gets medication and after a week, they feel better. I (on the other hand) don't go to the doctors...instead, I create my own remedy that cures me just as fast as my friend.

If my friend said "After taking the Dr.'s advice, I got better" - To that, I would say (proudly): "I don't know the first thing about medicine and I cured myself."


See how one can be very proud of ignorance.....well, it should actually be "Proud of getting the job done, despite being ignorant." - Now that's something to be proud of.
Reply
post #24 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:15pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Macs aren't exactly built for hard core gaming (or any sort of high end 3D, period)
You can get a Mac Pro with a Quadro FX 4500, which nVidia markets as "ultra-high-end" workstation graphics. The ATI X1900 XT is hardly a slouch, either. They also have x16 PCI Express slots, like any other PC.

Lack of DirectX is a big issue. Macs support (industry-standard) OpenGL; Direct3D is the counterpart in DirectX (which also includes APIs for sound and controls). ATI recently released porting tools to convert Direct3D to OpenGL.
Reply
post #25 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:21pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

It wouldn’t make sense that the remedies you mentioned were picked out of thin air, though, Mark. If, for example, you felt better after thinking and acting on the idea that the flu is caused by wearing badly coordinated clothes (some weird feng shui idea), that would be nothing to be proud of. You’d have to have SOME idea of the processes involved.
Reply
post #26 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:23pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Well, anyone who actually uses a computer successfully can't exactly say they don't know anything about computers either. The commercial wasn't meant to be litteral. I still think it was meant to show how proud this woman was that she was able to use something that she didn't think she had the knowledge to use.

i.e. Macs are so easy to use that even if you think you don't know a damn thing about computers, you will be amazed at how proficient you actually will be while using a Mac.
Reply
post #27 of 68
2/6/07 at 3:33pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Actually, Mark, the woman was acting like she was proud that she had no ideal how to deal with computer problems (she was talking to a PC guy struggling with something).
Reply
post #28 of 68
2/6/07 at 4:05pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
Actually, Mark, the woman was acting like she was proud that she had no ideal how to deal with computer problems (she was talking to a PC guy struggling with something).

And why exactly shouldn't she be "proud" to not have to know how to deal with computer problems?? Why should she have to deal with them at all??

Spoken like a true Windows user who has come to accept that dealing with computer problems is a fact of everyday life... how sad.

99% of the population use computers as a tool to get their work done. They should have no need at all to "fix the tool", and to have to do so is not something that one should necessarily be "proud" of.

Regardless, your comment about "smirking" because this woman had no desire to understand how her computer worked speaks volumes about you.
Reply
post #29 of 68
2/6/07 at 4:19pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Spoken like a true Windows user who has come to accept that dealing with computer problems is a fact of everyday life
If you're claiming that Macs are problem-free, I'd say that's not true. And yes, I do have disdain for the clueless ("don't bore me with that home theater stuff. Just give me the cute Bose cubes that fit my decor").
Reply
post #30 of 68
2/6/07 at 4:47pm

Re: Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertR
Actually, Mark, the woman was acting like she was proud that she had no ideal how to deal with computer problems (she was talking to a PC guy struggling with something).

I always saw it akin not to the mechanic or doctor thing, but "I don't know how to drive so I bought this Lexus!"

As for misrepresentation, the one where the guy is so proud of the fact Apple bundled all those wonderful apps....Microsoft was sued because of that!

Or the "talk" camera thing. My PC talks to any camera plugged into it as well.
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Computers and HTPC
Home Theater Forum › Home Theater Forum › Other Diversions › Computers and HTPC › Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?