Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last! - Page 3

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Can't turn off the subtitles, annoying, but they are in the black so I can stick a piece of black paper across the bottom of the screen while watching. Better than having the sides of the screen chopped off!

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

It says on the box it is digitally enhanced for 16:9 as well as 2.35:1 so you're probably ok if you buy a copy! I don't have a wide screen tv yet - must wait fr my current set to blow up before I get another!

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

ELC-CID is one of my husband's favorite films of all time. He imported the Korean DVD. But he and I will wait for High Def. We won't buy a standard def DVD, remastered or not. We want it on HD-DVD or Blu-Ray.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

I have the French release of 'Circus World' on DVD (and it's a very nice transfer), but will gladly double-dip when it becomes available in a deluxe R1 edition.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The French versions of El Cid and Fall are the best ones I have seen and I have seen 4 scope versions of each of these movies. They are anamorphic and from the same transfers as the other scope versins I have seen. The French company who made the DVD made the best out of the transfers though with regard to colors and contrast range.

It is correct that the subs are not that easy to get rid of.

El Cid and Fall come in a coffret Anthony Mann which is pretty nice by itself.

Regarding the Weinstein release: Does anybody notive that there is no talk about how these will be done with regard to the transfer used ? Don't be too sure that Weinstein is putting too much effort into these.

And I will gladly admit that I would absolutely love to be proven wrong when they come out wth spectacular looking editions of these movies

Oliver

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

It can't be worse than the VHS transfer. My copy was the worst of any VHS movie I ever saw.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Epics always look like crap on low rez formats - LD also did not do justice to any epic I saw in that format. Something like the Big Lebowski looks good on LD, but not Fall of the Roman Empire or El Cid.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Just took delivery of Steve Reeves "epic", or "peplum" as they call it in France, "Last Days of Pompeii". Gorgeous 2.35:1 transfer in both French and English versions. Why do the rest of us in region 2 (or region 1) not get such great transfers? Why are not more available? I know "Collosus of Rhodes" is available in France of the 60s Sergio Leone epics, but it seems the distributors don't think the rest of us respect Sergio (or Steve Reeves) like the French do!!!!

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Paul, Warner are releasing Colossus Of Rhodes on tuesday (26th June).

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Thanks Gordon. I see there is also a 3 dvd set called "Camp Classics" that promises along with Colossus, The Prodigal, and Land of the Pharoahs, all in 2.35:1!
Can't wait!

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

They're already shipping, or at least my copies of the Sci-Fi set and Trog already did.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Prodigal and Land of the Pharoahs will almost certainly both be 2.55:1.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Amazon says you are correct, but does this mean they were both released with magnetic sterophonic soundtracks then, making the width of the image slightly smaller?

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

As originally developed, Cinemascope was 2.66:1 AR (twice the standard 1.33:1) and some of the early screenings of THE ROBE were shown at that AR with an interlocked soundtrack.However Fox always intended to stripe the release prints with 4 magnetic tracks which they did thereby shaving the AR to 2.55;1.
The AR was again shaved to 2.23:1 a year or so later with the introduction of an optical track.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The general rule is that any CinemaScope film released in the U.S. before 1956 should have an aspect ratio of 2.55:1.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Here's the facts from the horse's mouth as it were, the AMERICAN WIDESCREEN MUSEUM

The CinemaScope Aspect Ratio
1953 - 2.66:1. During the developmental period of CinemaScope, and before it was in any way certain that it would be possible to put the stereophonic soundtracks on the same film as the picture, CinemaScope used a conventional film with an aperture size identical to the original silent film aperture. This format uses the absolute maximum available area on the film to provide optimum image quality. The sound was carried on a separate full coat 35mm magnetic film that ran in interlock with the picture projector. Warner Bros' Warnersuperscope, (which never really got off the ground), and Carl Dudley's short lived Vistarama both also conformed to the same 2.66:1 ratio with interlock sound.

1953 - 2.55:1. By the time The Robe was ready to premiere, 20th Century-Fox had solved the magnetic stereo sound problem on the picture film with the able assistance of Cinerama sound guru Hazard Reeves. Adding the four small bands of magnetic oxide required the use of smaller perforations and a slight reduction in the width of the picture.


1955 - 2.35:1. Exhibitor resistance to investing in stereophonic sound reproduction equipment forced the use of several different sound formats for CinemaScope. There was a mono magnetic sound stripe that was located in the same area as the optical soundtrack in standard films and there were optical mono soundtracks as well. In addition, MGM utilized the crummy Perspecta system to create ersatz stereo effects. These formats used standard film perforations and necessitated a reduction in image width to yield 2.35:1. In 1957, with the adoption of the magoptical sound track, which incorporated both a narrow optical mono soundtrack along with the four magnetic stripes, finally eliminated 2.55:1 as a ratio for CinemaScope and other anamorphic 35mm systems.

1970 - 2.39:1. The height of the CinemaScope image on film, (and all other clone systems), leaves no room between frames. Consequently, splices, both done in the lab and and in the theatre, would cause flashes of light at the top or bottom, or both, of the picture. Theatres took to masking the 2.35:1 frame down slightly to cover the splices. In 1970, the SMPTE set an "official" standard that reduced the height of the projector aperture to conform to the general practice that had been in use for several years. While 2.39:1 is a wider ratio than 2.35:1, the change represents a reduction in height not an increase in width. The difference in shape is inconsequential and thus the aspect ratio of anamorphic films is interchangeably referred to as either 2.39:1 or 2.35:1. This change represents no change in the production of the film, it's a change that is done in the theatre projector and screen masking.

This ratio applies to all present day 35mm 2x squeeze anamorphic prints, be they originated in CinemaScope, Panavision, Technirama, Tohoscope, Super 35 or any other clone of the CinemaScope standards set in the 1950s.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The screen caps on DVDBeaver look great. My copy of the box should arrive any day now. I've been wanting to see Land of the Pahraohs ever since I saw the excerpt in Scorsese's American Cinema documentary. Those shots of the pyramid being built are just amazing; I'll take that over any CGI infused epic any day!

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The final scenes inside the pyramid are amazing too! The movie has some good epics scenes too, with sets and people up on screen rather than CGI.
As for CGI, are there any scenes done recently that are as "gob smacking" as the first shots of the Roman Forum in FOTRE, the chariot race in Ben-Hur, or Cleopatra's entry into Rome?

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Just as well the film got cut, perhaps, although I think it's a terrible shame. Originally the subplot of Timonides (James Mason) and the Christians was much stronger. Poor Guy Rolfe as a Christian Roman Senator had his role cut down to virtually nothing so that all you saw of him was being burned aong with the Barbarians. I interviewed Stephen Boyd when he was making his last film, THE SQUEEZE, and he said that FOTRE was ruined when it was cut from five hours to three. I've never been able to establish that the film was intended to run that long but I think it most certainly would have run close to four hours before being cut down to three. Another vital scene that got lost was the murder of the old senator played by Finlay Currie. Curiously, the version released in the UK had differences to the one released in the USA. The version we now have on DVD and which is shown on British TV has a scene missing where Livius and Commodus search among the Barbarians for two women to keep them entertained. That scene was included in the British release version, while other little snippets were cut from the British version but are back in the DVD and TV version. If the film does get a proper deluxe DVD release, it would be nice to think that some if not all the lost scenes might be restored. There is a far more complex and fascinating film which, I believe, has never been seen by the public, although I doubt Stephen Boyd's Livius would benefit from it very much. Boyd really was at his best when playing villains although in life he was a genuinely nice guy and a good actor.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The London roadshow version is surely the only "complete version" we have. That had the "girl hunting scene" but not the death of the Finlay Currie character which has only been seen in a production still.I always thought the lack of christianity was one of this films best attributes showing that society can change without a religious (and especially a christian) base.
Was this added to the US release?
I always thought that that this version was the U K roadshow one less the subplot about Commodus's true father.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Many films have stories circulating about the "long version" which on investigation turns out to be just the rough cut, the Editor's first assembly of the material as per the script. Then, working with the director the film is fine tuned. I've never heard of a long version of either FOTRE or El Cid existing, though apparently the tale that Mankewicz wanted to release 'Cleopatra' as two 4 hour movies is true, and while watching the 4 hour version available now, it is obvious that a lot of material was lost along the way. Look at the money splashed out in extras in that opening scene. The battle of Phillippi was shot but is nowhere to be seen. A pity film makers in the 60s didn't know that dvd was coming, else full/long versions of many of good movie would be available to us now.
Re Stephen Boyd, I worked briefly with him in the 70s and, as you say, a nice guy, with the most arresting eyes!
Paul

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

James Mason, who played Timonides, also said that he filmed a whole lot more than was seen in the final edit of The Fall of the Roman Empire. I believe it was Anthony Mann's intention to have a much longer version than was premiered in London, but the industry was in a panic over long epics by that time and so the film ended up around three hours. The Christianity aspect of the film was to show that it was a part of the decline of the empire. After all, the film failed to show how the empire actually fell, and a narration was added at the end - spoken by a different narrator to that at the beginning - explaining that this was "the beginning of the fall of the Roman Empire." It was clearly a vast and complex project that Samuel Bronston and Mann were attempting to undertake and it might just have benefited from a different title because in this case it didn't do exactly what it said on the tin.

It's certainly true that the version of El Cid that was released was the edit that Anthony Mann wanted, so there are no missing scenes there. But, unfortunately, studios who finance films will have the last say on the final edit. J. Lee Thompson told me that Taras Bulba was heavily cut. It should have run about two and a half hours, and you can actually see where the intermission was meant to be - right at the end of the scene where the Cossacks meet on the road to Dubno. King of Kings was heavily cut and re-edited by MGM, adding a naration written by Ray Bradbury and spoken by Orson Welles to fill in the gaps. Screenwriter Philip Yordon was most peeved about that. They also removed a complete sublot about a Romanised Jew played by Richard Johnson who is fleetingly seen in long shot just as Christ is about to enter the temple. The Greatest Story Ever Told also suffered major cuts, but they were at least made by George Stevens but only because the distributor insisted on them after the panning the film received after its premiere. John Wayne did the same with The Alamo. Curiously, the restored version of The Alamo was released on VHS but has never appeared on DVD.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

The director's cut of THE ALAMO has not appeared on DVD because the 35mm material found and restored for that VHS release, was left in a non-climate controlled room by the idiots at Turner and when it was discovered by some people with half a brain, it had become completely unusable and may now be lost forever.

Thanks, Ted Turner.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

And Alec Guiness went on record to say he couldn't remember making it!!!
Funny thing memory

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Cassy_w wrote:
Here is a link to a Dallas Observer article about the discovery and subsequent deterioration of the 70mm roadshow version of "The Alamo":

http://www.in70mm.com/news/2002/alamo/index.htm

The 70mm print was found and sent to MGM/UA in 1991, well after Ted Turner had purchased the MGM library (1986 I believe). Turner had nothing to do with MGM/UA at the time, nor since.

I believe that Turner is regarded as an executive who did a lot for film preservation with his handling of the MGM library (his experiments with colorization notwithstanding).

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

I am not a fan of John Wayne at all and I can't stand Tha Alamo. However, I would donate $50 towards a 4-6K digital-to-65mm restoration. It's the principle of the matter. There are millions of Duke fans around the world who would donate cash in a heartbeat.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

Funny thing about Alec Guinness - he suffered from selected memory syndrome. He couldn't remember, he said, if he fell on that plunger by accident or on purpose in The Bridge on the River Kwaii. When I told him how much I admired his performance in Roman Empire, he said, "Oh, you can't have!" And when I asked him about the scene where he argued with his own off screen voice, he said he couldn't remember it. He also made a point of dismissing Star Wars and yet he actually loved the fact that he was in such a huge hit and became known to a whole new generation - and subsequent generations - of filmgoers. Some of those wonderful old time actors I got to know very well, but Guinness remained an enigma.

Re: Bronston epics and Land of the Pharaohs coming at last!

A lot of actors are quite bitchy about their own work. So,
I wouldn't take anything that Guinness said about 'FOTRE'
that seriously. He was very good in many scenes and the
script was far better than many other epics past or present.