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Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released? - Page 20

post #571 of 650
6/15/07 at 4:03pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Well, things do change Albert. It can get worse but it can get better too.
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post #572 of 650
6/15/07 at 7:49pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Hey Albert, hungry for some delicious filet mignon? Well, I've got some spam I'll sell you. Hey, it's better than nothing, right?
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post #573 of 650
6/17/07 at 9:47am
Thread Starter 

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Albert_M
It's like this thread never existed. It's not going to happen folks. It's simply cost prohibitive to get the music. Be insulted if you want, but if my choice is never having it - and rarely seeing it on TV for that matter - and having this - I'll take this as I did and still enjoy them as flawed as they may be.

Why did and do people tape shows from TV despite the garbage on the screen, commercials, disrupted credits and other annoying things (including cut episodes)? So they can watch the shows in some fashion as opposed to not at all.

We get it - it sucks. But it's not going to change.

FIANLLY!
Someone who get's my point.
The episodes I taped on TV many years ago were all butchered up anyway. So to me, spending the $30 on this set is worth it, if anything then to have the episodes cleaned up at bit. I think it cost me more than $30 in the '80's just to buy blank VHS tapes top put WKRP on. And now they are barely watchable.\
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post #574 of 650
6/17/07 at 11:51am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

i'm sure there are plenty of people who get your point.

but a place like HTF isnt going to be as agreeing to this point.
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post #575 of 650
6/17/07 at 3:18pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I get both sides of this. But what I don't understand is why so many people demand the studio absorb whatever cost it takes to release the DVDs in their original broadcast state, but tolerate the broadcasters continuing to butcher the episodes to fit in more commercials, which clearly is NOT their original broadcast state. The consesus seems to be, "Well, they have to do that for economic reasons," so it's accepted. But that's riduculous. That's the same argument they reject from the studios. Why demand "no alterations no matter what the cost" of the studio, but tolerate it of the broadcaster? They begrudge one their extra profit, but allow the other one the exact same profit by altering the original episodes. AND more people will see the altered episodes in one airing on a broadcast than will ever buy all the DVDs put together. Doesn't that make it MORE incumbent on the broadcasters to reflect the episode makers' original work?
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post #576 of 650
6/18/07 at 7:14am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Hey Albert, hungry for some delicious filet mignon? Well, I've got some spam I'll sell you. Hey, it's better than nothing, right?

If you are trying to make an analogy, one that is logical might be attempted as the one above makes no sense on many levels.
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post #577 of 650
6/18/07 at 12:55pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Actually Albert, it makes much sense on many levels.

What's so hard to understand about the analogy? Cutting out significant scenes, and replacing original music with crappy replacements, is like taking a filet mignon and replacing it with a piece of spam. Pretty simple and logical.

You may think your spam tastes as good as the filet mignon, and is better than nothing, but that doesn't make it so, nor does it invalidate the analogy.
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post #578 of 650
6/18/07 at 2:37pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I think what needs to happen is that;

1. This topic needs to be closed,
2. HTF owners should direct the execs at FOX to read this topic from beginning to end,
3. Fox needs to participate in this topic and get with fans on how they should handle the future releases since they aren't likely to repress the first season with corrected disks ...

The reason I say closed is that messages seem to convey the same message over and over again and the topic isn't going anyway constructively.
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post #579 of 650
6/18/07 at 7:18pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

About the analogy, filet mignon and hamburger would be a better comparison. They both come from the same material, but are made differently.

It would be like if HTF was a food site. Filet Mignons would be the expectation. But, if someone starts to talk about the hamburgers at McDonalds, even though millions eat them every day, you can expect it to not be well received here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Talmadge
I think what needs to happen is that;

1. This topic needs to be closed,


The reason I say closed is that messages seem to convey the same message over and over again and the topic isn't going anyway constructively.

I'll second that.

It keeps going around in circles. We know why those who refuse to buy it feel that way. We know why Fox cut it the way they did. Nothing anyone says here is going to change that.
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post #580 of 650
6/18/07 at 11:47pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I agree that this thread is played out. But even if FOX execs were to read this what difference would it make ? Studios do not care about "fanatics" who know a show inside out. They only care about selling to Billy Bob Lawnmower who won't notice if it's a faulty product.

Trying to make us happy is simply too difficult and too costly.
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post #581 of 650
6/19/07 at 8:11am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Martin
I'll second that.

It keeps going around in circles. We know why those who refuse to buy it feel that way. We know why Fox cut it the way they did. Nothing anyone says here is going to change that.

You're probably right that nothing anyone says here will change Fox's actions for now or the future.

However, what was said here DID change my decision (& probably many others too).

I had pre-ordered the set, but when I learned about this, I cancelled my purchase before it shipped.

While the "circle" may continue, the thing will be for sale for a long, long time.
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post #582 of 650
6/19/07 at 10:58am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

No it’s simply a bad analogy. It’s not logical. One can purchase whatever meat they choose. However, reagarding WKRP, the criteria that makes the music cost prohibitive to consumers has no “meat” correlation. Additionally stating that I think that they “taste” the same in this bad analogy, is incorrect. I have made it abundantly clear regarding the differences and my desire for the original episodes. I, however, can see the reality that original episode sets is a fantasy.
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post #583 of 650
6/19/07 at 12:08pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I'll stay out of this disagreement.

I did want to add this, while I posted earlier reactions to the discs due to the music changes as I have been watching them, one thing I have not said. The last two shows I saw, "Who is Gordon Sims", and "I do....I do", still retain a power and energy to them that goes beyond the music issue.

Getting right down to the heart of the show, the acting performances in Gordon Sims is as powerful as it was originally. And the comedy and heartfelt story of "I do... I do" still ring true. The later half of the first season is as strong as it was new. Good bye Johnny, Johnny Comes Back, Never Leave Me Lucille, I want to Keep My Baby, A Commercial Break (Ferryman!) and the above two shows are really good episodes and the actors are gelling and working well together to make this show what I remember as so great as I saw them in 1979. I look forward to the next 3 shows as the season concludes.
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post #584 of 650
8/9/07 at 10:35am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Bumping thread, two months later.

I was curious if there's any news as to whether the second season of these flawed DVD sets of WKRP is planned, or near release?

I know some were curious how the sales figures were for the First Season set as an indicator of how well they did with the music alterations. I don't know where to find that info, that would be interesting to know.
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post #585 of 650
8/9/07 at 6:15pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Flawed or not, I say bring on Seaons 2!!!
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post #586 of 650
8/9/07 at 8:08pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

If season 2 is going to be more of the same edited and music replaced crap, I hope it rots in hell.
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post #587 of 650
8/9/07 at 10:19pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I am wondering if anyone has considered this as a compromise: Many times in WKRP, we even see Fever or Venus in the booth saying things like "Now here's a tune from Earth, Wind, and Fire" or some such dialogue, then a hit song starts to play. I was wondering, instead of replacing the hit song with generic garbage, couldn't they say... replace the hit song with an obscure album track by the same group? Surely a song that was never released as a single and was never a hit record doens't cost nearly as much to license, wouldn't that be a possibility? And I also have a quesiton. I have seen so many posts here saying that the music rights for WKRP is prohibitively expensive to license. The show was quite popular and lasted for a long time, how is it that music licensing for that show is too expensive, but yet it's not too expensive to license the music for Captain And Tennille, Music Scene, Hullaballoo, Tony Orlando And Dawn, Barbara Mandrell and the Mandrell sisters, and Dolly?
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post #588 of 650
8/9/07 at 11:54pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by george kaplan
If season 2 is going to be more of the same edited and music replaced crap, I hope it rots in hell.

I'm afraid there are already three spaces reserved next to Hitler, Stalin, and Saddam Hussein.

What has been released of the musical variety shows alphanguy mentioned is compilations of a few episodes or musical clips, and not of the same songs. The evidence as to whether Fox even asked the publishers of the songs before going ahead with this insult of a DVD set, is elusive.

And artistic merit or popularity has never entered the equation. There is no difference in the eyes of the law, BMI, or ASCAP (the last two are our only hope, perhaps they can be petitioned to set a standard rate for home entertainment) between a good or bad song, a #1 or a #40 or an album cut.
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post #589 of 650
8/10/07 at 6:23am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I know there's no difference in the eyes of the law in relation to a hit song or a flop. BUT... I just assumed there was a difference in the price due to the marketplace, the same way a mercedes commands a higher price than a honda.
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post #590 of 650
8/10/07 at 10:48am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I'm sorry I opened old wounds regarding this release. I know that it hurts and a lot of people are not happy the episodes have altered music. It is what it is as of now.

That said, the first release was still a lot of fun to see again and I really am curious about the second season.
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post #591 of 650
8/10/07 at 8:05pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I'd at least hope they put a little more effort into season 2 just because the edits are a lot more damaging this season than they are in others. The whole stretch in God Talks To Johnny that originally had "Arrow Through Me" was just horribly done, with long chunks of replaced dialogue. Just cutting it would gut the show, but they shouldn't release it with the replacement as-is.

Judging from the season one set, they used the same versions of the shows that were sent out to the Comedy Network in Canada plus additional cost-cutting edits: both Hoodlum Rock and A Date With Jennifer were short in that run too. Unfortunately, if they use the same package for season two that means a lot more will be shorter syndication edits: "Baseball", "Jennifer Falls in Love", ""Bad Risk", "Carlson For President", and "Les' Groupie" all were cut down. Some good stuff was lost. As the show went on, entire scenes were beginning to be scored with music too.

For all the effort Jaime Weinman's put into research Fox might as well hire him as a consultant on the set...but they'd probably need the money to clear every sample the Simpsons uses next season.
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post #592 of 650
8/11/07 at 9:48pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Do the syndicated episodes for WKRP still have the music? I'm sure if some premium cable station would air them without commercials and uncut that a lot of people could simply use their DVRs until a suitable compromise is found. Not to rob anybody of any sales (not in the slightest), but in this particular situation it might make everybody happy.
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post #593 of 650
8/12/07 at 6:19am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

As I have said, the original broadcast licenses for the music used have expired as well. They can not use it in any form without re-negotiating with the artists.
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post #594 of 650
1/12/08 at 8:26am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Anyone heard if a Season 2 is forthcoming?

Or was the butchering of the first season enough to tank this series from going any further?
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post #595 of 650
1/12/08 at 11:31am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Deeb
Anyone heard if a Season 2 is forthcoming?

Or was the butchering of the first season enough to tank this series from going any further?

I think it's a tough call. S1 did pretty solid numbers, but are they enough to offset the bad press that Fox will get if S2 is more of the same?
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post #596 of 650
1/12/08 at 2:09pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Levine
I think it's a tough call. S1 did pretty solid numbers, but are they enough to offset the bad press that Fox will get if S2 is more of the same?
What kind of numbers are we talking about, David? And, how do they compare to some of the other MTM shows that Fox appears to have abandoned?
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post #597 of 650
1/12/08 at 3:27pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pitchman
What kind of numbers are we talking about, David? And, how do they compare to some of the other MTM shows that Fox appears to have abandoned?

WKRP sold better than the other MTM series -- even with all the (deserved) negative publicity, the first season was one of the top twenty DVDs for its first week of release (none of the other MTM shows even came near that chart). I hear that based on the sales there were plans to do the second season.

But seasons 2 through 4 have more music than season 1 and more scenes where music underscores dialogue. (Remember, most episodes don't have separate tracks for music and dialogue: you cut the music, you cut the dialogue that goes with it.) Fox can't release season 2 unless they're willing to a) pay for the music or b) cut out whole scenes. Unless they're prepared to approve an actual music budget, there's a stalemate because they don't want to face negative publicity again (and frankly I would not buy season 2 if it chopped out entire scenes).
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post #598 of 650
1/12/08 at 5:28pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

I've got the perfect name for it:

WKRP in Cincinnati: What's Left of the Second Season
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post #599 of 650
1/12/08 at 9:14pm

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MatthewA
I've got the perfect name for it:

WKRP in Cincinnati: What's Left of the Second Season


Funny but quite true. With all of this WKRP talk I actually pulled out my old tapes and was quite surprised to see that except for 3rd season, I have almost every episode from off CBS broadcasts. So, Fox can take their butchered episodes and stick 'em where the sun don't shine. Besides, WKRP is probably a little too intelligent a show for Fox's usual DVD audience, the Buffy crowd. Actually, it's too bad Fox can't figure out a way to tie the release into Buffy somehow. I bet then they would find a way to pay to license the music.
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post #600 of 650
1/13/08 at 7:44am

Re: Enough already Fox. Are we EVER going to see WKRP released?

WKRP in Cincinnati: What's Left of the Second Season

Well the good news about that is that it'd be quite cheap. I mean how much can they charge for just one disc when they only use part of one layer?
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