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Fossils Just Confuse People  

post #1 of 51
9/14/06 at 4:53am
Thread Starter 
and no greater an authority than Bishop Adoyo of Kenya http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world...868904,00.html says so.
post #2 of 51
9/14/06 at 6:59am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Thanks for the link Chu.
post #3 of 51
9/14/06 at 10:57am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

That reminds me of a scene in Liar Liar.

Jim Carrey: I object!
Judge: On what grounds?
Jim Carrey: It is devistating to my case.
post #4 of 51
9/14/06 at 11:52am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Harbaugh
That reminds me of a scene in Liar Liar.

Jim Carrey: I object!
Judge: On what grounds?
Jim Carrey: It is devistating to my case.
Still a very funny movie.

I think this illustrates a tendancy of organized religion, the supression of other points of view.
post #5 of 51
9/14/06 at 1:11pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
In a move that has stunned scientists, senior clergy have demanded that the bones and skulls currently exhibited in Nairobi's National Museum of Kenya be removed from display to prevent young Africans from being corrupted

While they're at it, they might as well hide the night sky. Who knows how corrupt their young would become if they were to comprehend the basics of stellar evolution?!?
post #6 of 51
9/14/06 at 1:24pm
Thread Starter 

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Well, it's not an uncommon thought. Guess who said this?
Quote:
"When we bring people only knowledge, ability, technical competence and tools, we bring them too little,"
post #7 of 51
9/14/06 at 1:51pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

"Organised" religion? Hardly. The world's most organised religious body, the Roman Catholic Church, counts among its clergy numerous respected scientists, including evolutionary biologists (the Thomistic philosophy of the Unity of Truth comes into play here). These evangelicals are a prime example of disorganised religion, the kind that burns witches.
post #8 of 51
9/14/06 at 1:52pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Why all the arguments and fighting? Why not do like they do with the constitution and amend the bible to correlate with scientific discoveries?

AMEN to AMEND!
post #9 of 51
9/14/06 at 3:04pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
When we bring people only knowledge, ability, technical competence and tools, we bring them too little
Well, I don't think the museum is trying to prevent religion being brought to the people. Scientific knowledge does not exclude the posibility of a deity. On the other hand, this religious person would like to exclude at least some scientific knowledge.
post #10 of 51
9/14/06 at 3:47pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Pratt
Thanks for the link Chu.

I'll second that.

If posters would avoid the breaking of Rule #5 perhaps other curious and inquisitive free thinkers could enjoy this thread.
post #11 of 51
9/14/06 at 6:09pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

I didn't think much else needed to be said.
post #12 of 51
9/14/06 at 8:55pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Ignorance is bliss. Blindly accepting cetain writings/teaching literally is a better alternative to actually thinking about these same teachings and what they imply for many people.

J
post #13 of 51
9/14/06 at 10:33pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
When children go to museums they'll start believing we evolved from these apes
of course we came from the apes, but as time goes on, i'm not convinced that much "evolving" occurred.
Quote:
When museums put it out there that man evolved from apes, theologically they are affecting many people who are Christians, who believe God created us
i just dont get it. has nobody thought of the possibility that God may have created a universe where we have evolved from apes? evolution doesn't disprove God at all.

CJ
post #14 of 51
9/15/06 at 4:26am
Thread Starter 

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
has nobody thought of the possibility that God may have created a universe where we have evolved from apes?
Not Bishop Adoyo.
post #15 of 51
9/15/06 at 6:02am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai
Not Bishop Adoyo.
apparently not. people want to stir up religious controversy by disputing scientific fact. believe what you want to believe, but God isn't automatically invalidated because of evolution. my view is, SOMETHING created the universe, and evolution is a part of what was created. as a people, i don't think we don't have to fight about this as much as we are.
post #16 of 51
9/15/06 at 6:17am
Thread Starter 

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Well then, one might wonder when scientific matters that are rather reasonable, consistent, and replicable are looked upon to be hidden by Bishops, Popes, Rabbis, Ayathollahs, and others if they are serving God or serving themselves?
post #17 of 51
9/15/06 at 7:33am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

FWIW, I teach evolutionary theory at university level as part of an animal behaviour course. I'd been giving my lectures on Evolution 101 for a couple of years without any problems when after one lecture a student came up to me and said that her father was far more extreme than me. I asked what her father did (imagining that he was a rabid follower of Richard Dawkins or similar) and got the reply 'he's a bishop'.


So please don't automatically equate organised religion with ignorance and a blinkered mentality.
post #18 of 51
9/15/06 at 8:54am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrew markworthy
So please don't automatically equate organised religion with ignorance and a blinkered mentality.
I probably tend to do that. I do know that there are those that believe in a deity and believe in evolution, or at least believe everyone has a right to choose.

There's a national organization dedicated to the separation of church and state that I believe is headed up by a pastor or similar religious official. In fact it may be a religious based organization.

However, the history of religion contains a substantial amount of suppression of other points of view.
post #19 of 51
9/15/06 at 9:03am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Angell
I think this illustrates a tendancy of organized religion, the supression of other points of view.
I think you could say the same thing of science, and the popular scientific community.
post #20 of 51
9/15/06 at 9:35am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

The history of humanity in general contains a lot of suppressing of other points of view. If you could magically erase religion and science from the world right now, people would just make up some new reasons to kill each other.
post #21 of 51
9/15/06 at 9:41am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Well, the scientific community once believed that the world was flat.

But at least with science, most are willing to revise their former beliefs when new (and updated) information is handed out. I wish religion would do the same...update the stories to reflect modern times.
post #22 of 51
9/15/06 at 9:43am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by James D S
I think you could say the same thing of science, and the popular scientific community.

Oh please... Your argument seems to be an argument for ignoring both science and religion. On a fundamental level, science is not about "pulling the wool over the eyes of the unwashed." And if you look around, I'm sure, you can find religions that similarly respect the intellectual capacity of their adherents...
post #23 of 51
9/15/06 at 9:47am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
I think you could say the same thing of science, and the popular scientific community.
You could say it, but I daresay you'd be wrong.

I'm not denying that certain scientists have indeed covered up info, falsified records, etc. But science as a discipline does NOT in anyway promote or allow suppression of information. The scientific method is all about testing, reviewing, updating hypotheses and sharing information all in the name of honing in towards a theory that stands up. A proper scientist wants others to poke holes in their theories because it leads to better understanding in the end.

You can't blame "science" for scientists who don't follow the tenets just like (as Andrew so appropriately pointed out) you can't blame all religions because some leaders try to suppress ideas.

I have to step aside now...I think I hear Jeff Gatie about to rumble into this thread.
post #24 of 51
9/15/06 at 10:08am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

and we wonder why religion is a no-no around here
Quote:
But science as a discipline does NOT in anyway promote or allow suppression of information. The scientific method is all about testing, reviewing, updating hypotheses and sharing information all in the name of honing in towards a theory that stands up.
Very true. A true scientist is willing to revise his/her view (of something that he/she believed was true) when presented with new data. Imagine if we had to adhere to the scientific beliefs, presented 2000 years ago without ever investigating further?
post #25 of 51
9/15/06 at 11:12am
Thread Starter 

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Didn't the Greeks figure out the earth was round and even measured its circumference to a fair degree of accuracy?
post #26 of 51
9/15/06 at 11:20am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai
Didn't the Greeks figure out the earth was round and even measured its circumference to a fair degree of accuracy?
within 2%.
post #27 of 51
9/15/06 at 11:24am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai
Didn't the Greeks figure out the earth was round and even measured its circumference to a fair degree of accuracy?
but they didn't have the internet to pass their findings around such globe.
post #28 of 51
9/15/06 at 11:55am

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkHastings
Well, the scientific community once believed that the world was flat.


Veeeerry sneaky Mark. Using the same ole stuff the "scientists know nothing" crowd spouts just to lure me into a theological discussion. Well, you've participated in enough of those for me to know you are being facetious (the was my first clue). You aren't going to lure me in here with that feeble attempt at subterfuge.




. . . Ooops!
post #29 of 51
9/15/06 at 12:04pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkHastings
Why all the arguments and fighting? Why not do like they do with the constitution and amend the bible to correlate with scientific discoveries?

AMEN to AMEND!

I have a question. If The Constitution is a "living, breathing document", how come they locked it up in a sealed, airtight display case?

http://www.archives.gov/press/press-...1/nr01-45.html
post #30 of 51
9/15/06 at 12:05pm

Re: Fossils Just Confuse People

Quote:
have to step aside now...I think I hear Jeff Gatie about to rumble into this thread.

Nahhh, you are doing just fine. This "Lapsed Catholic" (patent pending as soon as I get my tax exempt status) is going to stay away from the theological.
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