Michael Mann's MIAMI VICE (merged) - Page 10

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Caught this over the weekend. I went in with slightly lowered expectations based on some early reviews, but I got to say...I really dug it. Yeah, the middle was a little slow while they were building up the Isabella and Crockett relationship, but that was really the only moment I could point out. And as far as Crockett and Tubbs and their relationship....I don't know, these guys are portraying real hardcore undercover vice cops. This isn't Lethal Weapon 4. I don't thing we needed to see them in any sort of chummy pal moments. Like was mentioned earlier...this was basically a typical mission for them and they acted appropriately. At least for me, they seemed to act the way two partners would act. Minimal interaction, yet each knew everything they needed to know. They've done this together for so long they pretty much know what the other is thinking and doing...they're together in this, yet I don't think we needed to be hit over the head with their relationship. Anywho...needless to say, I feel like I got the movie. Plus there's just something to the way Mann audibly gets things across with the weapons in his action scenes. The 50 cals in the beginning and the whole final scene. Just really great stuff reminiscent of Heat. Heat is still a much better film but I would easily put this one on par with Collateral.

I went with my wife and she was really not looking forward to it. She expected some sort of over the top action sequence summer blockbuster (i.e. Bad Boys 3) and thats not really her deal. She also is really a movie buff and didn't know what to expect with it being a Mann movie. Anyway...she dug to...and now she's interested in watching Heat this week to catch up on the genre. Its nice not to have every summer movie be a summer blockbuster type.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

I wouldn't dream of comparing the directors I love. They are all quite different in terms of approach, focus, themes, etc. But the best directors are natural storytellers, and bless them for it.

I expected a lot from Vice, and I got it and more. I didn't expect such excellent action scenes (I expected good ones) and I didn't expect to be terribly interested in the Crockett/Isabella stuff. But I was. I was never bored.

The opening bit appeared to be a Vice operation against a high dollar pimp (Neptune). Something happens, they can't complete it, so Neptune gets away for the time being. There is even dialogue to that effect.

To go back to Crawdaddy's issue, I think undercover is about results more than protocol. This team gets results and is still alive, so their leash is long and loose. Like some government agency NOCs (non-official cover), a wide latitude is given to the individuals because of the stress of their job, and their inherent skill sets.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

you know, i found this to be true, also, though i realize in retrospect that my lack of expectation in this regard was simply the result of not having really thought about this feature of the movie at all; i had straightforwardly forgotten how unglamorously spectacular mann's action choreography is (part of this was a conscious effort to minimize my expectations for a movie that had been getting mixed reviews). if i'd spent any time considering this, i may very well have expected exactly what we got in this film: immediate, urgent, lean, and very, very tight sequences.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

"I didn't expect such excellent action scenes (I expected good ones)"

I did. The gunfight at the end as well as the trailer scene - Mann is the master with this stuff. Dont know if anyone else mentioned this but also the scene in the car when the Aryans snipered the russians was amazing as well.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

I won't call this a "good" review. That would be presumptuous. I will instead call it one I agreed with.

Beaks

The trailer scene was masterful. They were all masterful, but that one was...something else.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

One of the things I like about the film is that Mann never really "deals" with the informant. Crockett and Tubbs do their job and narrow it down to the FBI Washington office and that's it. Most other films would feel compelled to offer some sort of reveal or closure, and since we only have one FBI guy in the film, Cirian Hinds would have ended up a villain almost by default.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

i agree with nathan and many other's sentiments. in fact, i'd venture to take it 1 step further, this is the best film i've seen this year. thank you for smoking comes close... but this one takes top honor cause of the action scenes.

a few things:
1. when gore happened (like the torso scene or the headshots), the audience was clapping and laughing and some even yelled, "more". i dunno if i should feel pity or hilarity for them.
2. forgot who mentioned it but someone in this thread said that mann's films demand multiple viewings for people to "get" and that the first time is often the worst experience. it did for a lot of people in this thread.
3. it'll be interesting to search for threads in HTF when collateral or ali came out, you'll see many similar responses, but when the DVD comes out, there are more praises =).
4. also someone else pointed out in this thread about small character moments (like in heat). i really noticed it when gong li's character used her hand to feel sony's stubble/beard with her left hand. that was a really nice touch. it's very small and almost a throwaway, but it makes the film... er. video.
5. like many have said, we're fed so many expository films that when films like these come along, we have an allergic reaction to it. star wars is a good example of minimal exposition. they throw you in medias res and keep on trucking until the end. they show you what's going on in the world instead of telling you. same with lucas's THX 1138. same with many foreign classics (like Kurosawa films).
6. most of the "character" developments were done with the eyes and the face. no dialogue neccessary. take a closer look next time and you will get it, if you don't already.
7. there will be many people quoting from this film for yeras to come =). this is a resounding classic in the highest order.

PS the fbi thread is just not relevant. it's a glimpse into lives of undercover agents and the seediness of their work. like an episode of cops, you're allowed x # of minutes, by the end you may or may not know what happens afterwards, if they lived or died, or if the fbi informant story thread was found and resolved. perhaps director's cut? who knows.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

another scene that shows mann's marksmanship on character building is (spoiler time):

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

PS i imagine li and mann discussing isabelle's english. i imagine that mann+li would say that isabelle's spanish has to be better than both chinese and english in that order. so, those of you that speak spanish natively is that true? i wonder what spanish would sounld like accented? hrm. therefore, i think it's a good move. on the other hand, i think if they went that direction, they should have had sony ask, "what" a few times to let audiences know... maybe it's deleted scenes?

nath,
since there's no important films coming out this weekend, i think it's a good time to check out MV again and again and again. =).

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

This seemed like a more free roaming Mann film than most. His past few pictures have had a clearer narrative, especially Collateral, which was very, very tight.

Mann's visual style has been evolving quite a lot. Films from 20 years ago like Thief (not mentioned much during any Mann discussion) and Manhunter are still very similar in their feel compared to MV, but the look is significantly different. Some of the images captured here are just amazing.

--The night time city background in the beginning with the partners on the rooftop

--The camera going left to right with the water and blue sky when Gong and Farrell go to her home

--The overhead shot of revealing the waterfalls and eventually the boss's house


Gong Li is incorrectly credited as Ms. Li during the "assistant to X" portion of the end credits.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

How so? To me, many of his films are more for fans of MTV, especially Miami Vice.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

I thought Miami Vice really took its time setting everything up. I didn't think it was fast-paced at all. I would think fans of MTV would rather see Bad Boys II than Miami Vice.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

"Ms. Li" is correct. Li is her surname. Shouldn't you know that, Mr. Tsai?

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

In MTV's defense, there is some seriously impressive technique going on in the shooting of Laguna Beach and The Hills. (Er, not that I've ever seen them. )

It's in service of vapidity, unfortunately.

PS: Gong is the surname. Good catch.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

No, Li is her surname. Her Chinese name is Li Gong, surname first. Chinese names are flipped when Westernized.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

I wrote that before I saw your edit or I wouldn't have contradicted without a source, but here it is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gong_Li. Also, IMDb has it as Li Gong and they use the Western order I believe.

PS again: Which all goes to show how annoying the inconsistancy of the flipping is. I still don't know what Takashi Miike's first name is. I should look that up.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Augh. Never mind. Gong is her surname. I just know too many people with the surname Li, it really confuses me.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

either way, as long as the ms. is correct, we can all keep dreaming... i'll stop there.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Whatever the proper surname, the woman gave a great performance and looked unbelievably attractive. Just stunning.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

You're right, I should know, and I do know. She was, and probably still is, the most famous Chinese actress (not true in the West, though, since no one is close to Zhang Ziyi). She is a household name, and no one would ever call her Li Gong. The name "Gong" is not one of the biggest family names in the language, but it's not an obscure one either.

Personally, I didn't find her speech as hard to follow as some have written in this thread, but I might be more used to accents. In comparison, I thought the witch lady in POTC: DMC more difficult to understand.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Just got back from seeing the flick. As this was my most anticipated flick of the summer, needless to say I had very high expectations. Unfortunately I don't think the film lived up to them. I'm not saying it was a bad movie and there are things I liked about it, but overall I didn't enjoy it as much as other Mann flicks like Heat and Collateral.

The first major problem I had was that at least half the dialogue in the movie was completely unintelligible. I wasn't the only one who thought so either as the people I went with had the same problem. And it wasn't just the foreign actors either as I had trouble with a lot of the stuff Foxx and Farrell were saying. When I could understand the dialogue, I thought a lot of it was very bad. Who the hell talks like this? I know it's Mann trying to be authentic, but some of the lines they delivered were truly laughable. The only other gripe I have is that the middle of the film seemed to slow almost to a complete halt. I know they had to throw in the relationship angle with Crockett and Isabella, but it really just seemed to kill the movie IMHO.

Having said all of that, I did find a lot of positives. Obviously Mann's trademark shooting style was in full force here and it showed. The visuals were great plain and simple. Also, the final shootout was another signature Mann piece and is one of the best action scenes I've witnessed in a long time(too bad it was the only one in the movie). I also really liked the guy who played Yero(sp?) and thought he was a great villain, much better than the lead baddie.

Overall I'd give it a B- and I'll certainly revisit it on DVD in a few months. Hopefully I'll be able to understand some of the dialogue better the second time around..........if not there's always subtitles.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Might have been the sound system the theater had. I didn't have a problem understanding most of it where I saw it.


Anyone know what the black car at the end of the movie was? I thought it was a Dodge Charger, but it looked like it only had 2 doors. ??

I liked the original TV series, although I thought it started to go downhill, coincidentally enough, after the Daytona Spyder got blown up. (A quick google search yielded an F430 as the new one. Never liked the white Testarossa.) And I liked this movie. A nice evolution from the TV series.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Enjoyed the first 20 minutes and last 45 or so. The middle really, really dragged poorly at times. And it didn't feel long, either - I felt it may have been better if it were LONGER. There's a lot to like here, but it really could have been tweaked more in parts. Yeah, yeah, everything done was done intentionally, etc - but that doesn't mean it couldn't have been done better. There were parts that needed to be both expanded or contracted. If it were 20-30 minutes longer, it would have been better, and if it were 10 minutes shorter (mostly some stuff in the middle being cut), it would have been better. But there are definate problems here.

Still dwelling on it, but my initial rating is somewhere between a C+ and a B-. For the record, I'd give Collateral a very solid A.

And as someone who lives in Miami, I was pretty bummed with the lack of action that actually took place there.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

real undercover agents. i've got a friend who knows a few in DEA. fairly authentic is right. one of the reasons why it's hard to grasp is the # of slangs and references to real police work.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

The dialogue is perfectly fine.

It's not as if Heat didn't have some similar lines:

"You don't live with me, you live among the remains of dead people. You sift through the detritus, you read the terrain, you search for signs of passing, for the scent of your prey, and then you hunt them down. That's the only thing you're committed to. The rest is the mess you leave as you pass through."

And that was a trailer line. I loved the middle portion of MV. I loved the relationship.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

I don't think it was the sound system as the theater I saw it in always has excellent DTS audio. I just think the accents of characters like Isabella and Yero are tough to understand. I also think Foxx and Farrell spoke very low and even mumbled some of their dialogue. I've heard these complaints in other reviews so I know it wasn't just me.

As for the car at the end, it was a 4 door Charger SRT-8. I could tell because of the hood scoop(yes, I'm a big car nut). The F430.......well it speaks for itself and was a great replacement for the old Daytona Spyder.

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Well, I have to disagree. I didn't find portions of dialogue in Heat to be as laughable as some of the lines delivered here. I mean, there were two variations of rhyming crime and time: "don't do the crime if you can't do the time" and "they didn't do time with us, they're not doing crime with us". Come on!

Re: Michael Mann's Miami Vice (merged)

Then we disagree. I heard all the dialogue fine, and all of it made perfect sense for undercover cops posing as ex-cons to say. They aren't Harvard grads. Brevity and directness count. But I probably would have understood the entire film with nary a word of dialogue. The visuals illustrated every relationship perfectly.