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Blu-ray / HD DVD War...the end is near:  

post #1 of 6252
10/6/05 at 9:32am
Thread Starter 
http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...9074_tc024.htm



Outstanding article. Not only about the current situation, but also about the history and motivations behind the various parties involved.


Blu-ray! Blu-ray!





some other recent links of interest:

http://www.homemediaretailing.com/i...d=2&newsid=8085

http://www.businessweek.com/technol..._6128_tc024.htm

http://www.homemediaretailing.com/n...article_id=8068
post #2 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:13am
Yeah, that is a really good article. Very interesting what is going on behind closed doors too. And the intrigue with the different CEOs calling each other up and asking for support, hilarious. It's like there is a war going on, and 9 months before product hits we're seeing who's allied with who. Bluffs are being called. Entire corporate agendas are being railroaded. Toes are being stepped on. I'll bet a lot of people on the HD-DVD side are not sleeping well these days.

This will get even hotter in the next few months, but in the end I think this war is essentially over before product ever hits.

Regards,
Dan
post #3 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:15am
And there you have it. Looks like the war's over.
post #4 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:28am
How many months ago did I predict this?

Some people don't get credit.
post #5 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:34am
Thread Starter 
I give you credit.

post #6 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:41am
It certainly appears that the end is near. I do have one question, though.

It seems as if all of the major studios are going to be releasing product on Blu-Ray. Obviously Warner and Universal have not yet announced this, but it seems like they are close.

Conversely, HD-DVD only has the support of three of the major studios, which is just less than half. If this turns out to be true, would HD-DVD even bother bringing it's product to market?

This war is about content. I can't see them having any amount of success with less than half the available titles. It seems like they should just cut their losses now (or soon).
post #7 of 6252
10/6/05 at 10:56am
Its like many have said all along. We should have been Boycotting HD-DVD and Supporting Blu-Ray to speed up the titles coming to us and the format suceeding since Blu-Ray has long been the eventual winner just due to the superior number of hardware supporters and now with Support from all movie studios it will be only a matter of time. HD-DVD should cut its loses now and make some kind of merger.
post #8 of 6252
10/6/05 at 11:27am
It's hard to "boycott" a non-existent product. Boycotting isn't just another word for "protest", it means "not buying something you want to prove a point to those who are selling it".
post #9 of 6252
10/6/05 at 11:32am
Quote:
HD-DVD should cut its loses now and make some kind of merger.
Except it's too late. The Blu-Ray folks have no reason to deal now.
post #10 of 6252
10/6/05 at 11:37am
Yes, it IS hard to boycott a product not yet available.

But some people (& websites such as Digital Bits) have been calling for a boycott of both formats.

My point was that if we threw our collective weight behind Blu-ray that it would speed an end to any potential format war, plus ensure Blu-ray's success in the marketplace. The studios would see which way the wind was blowing and adopt Blu-ray as a standard as well.

Which is what is happening now. Blu-ray's momentum is impossible to ignore and studios such as Warner and Paramount don't want to risk losing millions of dollars in revenue. If Toshiba can suck it up there might be a royalty deal that they can work out with the others to save some face.

PS: Thank you DaVid :-)
post #11 of 6252
10/6/05 at 12:16pm
Well this is good news. If the article is right about Warner, then it will be over.

-Reagan
post #12 of 6252
10/6/05 at 12:31pm
Uh! Guys! The Boycott is in reference to the one that Ron was starting here suggesting a Boycott of both formats.
post #13 of 6252
10/6/05 at 12:35pm
Well, despite all this, I have a question:

Assuming Blu-ray is the disc of choice, what will it be called in the marketplace? Blu-ray? Or will "DVD" be incorporated into the product name somehow, even though it does not bear any relationship with the current DVD format and isn't even part of the DVD Forum?

My point is this: Manufacturers have to go easy on the general consumer, for whom all this is confusing. Too, news articles repeatedly refer to both technologies -- Blu-ray and HD DVD -- as "next-generation DVD."
post #14 of 6252
10/6/05 at 12:57pm
Thread Starter 
Jack,

good call. Personally, I like the name "HD DVD" because it sounds like what it is (as far as consumer perception is concerned). Perhaps this could be the perfect way to "unify" the two formats...take Sony's disc and brand it with Toshiba's name. PERFECT!

post #15 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:00pm
Quote:
Well, despite all this, I have a question:

Assuming Blu-ray is the disc of choice, what will it be called in the marketplace? Blu-ray? Or will "DVD" be incorporated into the product name somehow, even though it does not bear any relationship with the current DVD format and isn't even part of the DVD Forum?

My point is this: Manufacturers have to go easy on the general consumer, for whom all this is confusing. Too, news articles repeatedly refer to both technologies -- Blu-ray and HD DVD -- as "next-generation DVD."

I don't see any need to incorporate "DVD" into the name. If anything that would simply add confusion. I'm sure there will be ample marketing from multiple fronts (PC industry, electronics firms, game industry, home video industry, retailers, Best Buy newspaper flyers) that will effectively tell everyone exactly what it is. And if things play out as expected, the news stories will have less and less of "HD DVD" anyway.

Jeff
post #16 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:05pm
Quote:
Personally, I like the name "HD DVD" because it sounds like what it is (as far as consumer perception is concerned)

Similarly, "4 door sedan" describes exactly what a car is, but the consumer can handle: "Audi A4 Quattro." I don't know if Sony & the Blu-ray group could stomach a name change to HD DVD and Blu-ray sounds a hell of a lot cooler (to me anyway. )

Jeff
post #17 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:29pm
I don't care what system is finalized. All I want is a player that is backward compatible with my collection of DVD's and that I can play them on my 65" RP-HDTV with component only inputs...which is only 2 year old!

If not, then you have locked out millions of potential customers!
post #18 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:40pm
Quote:
my 65" RP-HDTV with component only inputs...which is only 2 years old!


Why did you buy a RPTV with NO DVI input? They had those 4 years ago.
post #19 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:44pm
You will be able to get component outs in high-def on your Blu-ray disk player. However, it will be up to the individual studio (not Blu-ray specs) whether you are getting 1080i native or 1080i upconverted from 960x540.
post #20 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:47pm
Good news!

Thanx, Dave!
post #21 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:50pm
PeterTHX

My Mit 65711 came with only component in 2004. The models for 2005 did have DVI, but the set was all silver and I didn't like it. At no time was I aware that that would be a problem. I hope Mit will come thru with their promise on upgrades.

Again, millions of lost customers if they don't do something for us. J6P could give a crap!!!
post #22 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:54pm
Maybe a dumb question here I have a Hitachi 70" 70VS810 purchased in December '04. It's HDMI-ready, but the specs say that it will run 1080i, 720p, 480i, and 480p. To date I've never seen HD on it since I don't have an HD cable hookup; basically I use it only for DVD viewing.

Is there such a thing as a future firmware upgrade that will allow it to run 1080p, or am I limited to the present specs?
post #23 of 6252
10/6/05 at 1:58pm
I'm so glad that things will soon come to an end with this format war. It'll be interesting how these companies will handle the "spoils of war." To think that all of it could have been avoided months ago. Is it to early to say that the consumer will be the real winners?
post #24 of 6252
10/6/05 at 2:05pm
David,

I think you should be changing your HD-DVD petition title to Blu-Ray! (at the bottom of your posts)

...relating to that, I also believe MLP is dead as a lossless audio compression format. DD will favour their lossless audio over MLP and we also have DTS with their lossless technology on Blu-Ray.

...if that is the case, then DVD-Audio is dead...and it'll be interesting to see what the music industry does with Blu-Ray as an audio format. To me, that is very exciting. Sony's catalogue is readily available and Universal Music Group has joined the Blu-Ray disc association. It'll be interesting if we hear anything from them soon as far as releasing titles.

As a music-only format, with the option to play back WITHOUT relying on video, I think the storage capacity of Blu-Ray can hold enough information beyond the 2-channel mix-down. Storing music data on a disc right from each individual track as if we were hearing it off the soundboard would be ideal...so I'm told by several musicians...I haven't actually heard it that way, but apparently there is no comparison.

Mike
post #25 of 6252
10/6/05 at 2:06pm
Danny Burk

You can get HD on your set. Buy Zeniths OTA Digital Indoor Antenna at Frys/Best Buy/etc. for about $29-39. The box is shaped like a x-mas tree.

If the stations in your area broadcast in HD, you can pick them up! Wait until you see them...awesome!!!

I can't answer your other question.
post #26 of 6252
10/6/05 at 2:27pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Is there such a thing as a future firmware upgrade that will allow it to run 1080p, or am I limited to the present specs?

Doubtful. Most consumer HD televisions weren't designed to handle 1080P input even via HDMI. That's starting to change...Sony's Qualia 1080P SXRD projector can be upgraded to accept full 1080P 60Hz via HDMI, and Sony's new sub-$10K 1080P projector will support that resolution right off the bat.

I think my BenQ will only take 720P or 1080I via HDMI...not 1080P.



Michael Osadciw,

I'm totally with you on the music thing...as you say as long as music content can be accessed without needing to turn on the display to navigate a menu. I do this now with my Diana Krall live-in-paris DVD...I have it memorized...I let the disc cue up and then hit Play which starts the disc...then I toggle audio options until I get the DTS...yummm...

Personally...I always thought that the notion of SACD and DVD-A were just stop-gate measures. To me...the promise of a high-bandwith HD video format that could allow for transparent/lossless/high-res mutli-channel (and 2-channel) audio could easily act as a "universal" disc for both movies and music. Why not?
post #27 of 6252
10/6/05 at 3:16pm
I'm officially starting to get excited now. 1080p displays are here, and we are at the point where technologies like SXRD and such are overcoming some of the performance hurdles of early generation HDTVs. Add to that Blu-Ray movies with 1080p content (hopefully), and I am ready to make the jump to HD. Gonna graduate to a nice 70" 1080P display and Blu-Ray next year if all goes well.

Fingers crossed.

Regards,
Dan
post #28 of 6252
10/6/05 at 3:49pm
Quote:
I also believe MLP is dead as a lossless audio compression format. DD will favour their lossless audio over MLP

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Dolby's new lossless format just MLP retooled as Dolby TrueHD?
post #29 of 6252
10/6/05 at 4:34pm
Quote:
"Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Dolby's new lossless format just MLP retooled as Dolby TrueHD?"

You are correct sir (Phil Hartman doing Ed McMahon voice).
post #30 of 6252
10/6/05 at 9:15pm
as far as I know, Dolby says they took the best of MLP structure and "improved" on it. Did they deviate far from it? Probably not. I'm not sure what they did really, but MLP as a buzz word is dead...actually, it never did take off in a marketing standpoint anyways...

Mike
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