SOPRANOS Season 6: Season Finally!!!.. Episode 12: "KAISHA" - Page 31

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

No Doubt... some people on here need to "get a room"

(hint... None of the rest of us care if any of you might be partially right or wrong on your theories so please leave it alone or take it somewhere else.

Put another way, even if you are more right than the next person - do you win some large trophy or does this add to your personal legacy?

er... no...

Supplementing rhetoric with personal attacks in a public forum is beyond childish... it causes others to question the social intellect of the contributors.)

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Now, I too agree this is a different series from previous seasons. I expected as much. To wrap up a season requires a number of episodes creating mini-events that will ultimately explain the master set of eventual circumstances.

The theme of the season appears to me that Tony has now "seen the light" and he is trying to sooth his soul and create a legacy through several contradicatory acts.

It's clear that he is struggling with the fact that that one piece of goodwill is always at the expense of some other party's loss.

E.G.
Johnny Sack is salvaging what he can in a hopeless situation.
Tony is playing the Samaritan to Johnny Sack on the front end yet supplementing this with distasteful business practices - i.e. greater cuts, taking the house at a discount.

The entire season should be entitled "House of Cards". To me, Chase demonstrate a message that the family foundation is extremely fragile and on the verge of collapse - through internal and external pressures.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

No Doubt... some people on here need to "get a room"

(hint... None of the rest of us care if any of you might be partially right or wrong on your theories so please leave it alone or take it somewhere else.

Put another way, even if you are more right than the next person - do you win some large trophy or does this add to your personal legacy?

er... no...

Supplementing rhetoric with personal attacks in a public forum is beyond childish... it causes others to question the social intellect of the contributors.)

---

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Sadly, you're right and that's my main problem with the show nowadays. It didn't used to be a "soap opera", it was just a powerful and gripping drama. It's definitely not a positive in my eyes when you can lump The Sopranos in with soaps like Desperate Housewives and f***ing Grey's Anatomy instead of great drama like The Shield. Oh, and "I love you Johnny Cakes" has got to be the worst line of dialogue uttered in the history of the show.

BUT, I'm still hoping tonight's next-to-last episode of the season is good.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Been doin that for a while now.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I thought tonight's episode was really good. Frankly I didn't care for any of Carm's stuff in Paris. However, Tony's side of things are shaping up for what I think is a full out war between Jersey and New York.

Could somebody tell me if there was a previous for the final episode, and if so, what it showed?

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Yeah...what was that all about? Just more evidence that Chase is limping to the finish line. The rest of the episode was okay, nothing great.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Well I'm assuming the extra 8 episodes will be for a war between Jersey and New York. I haven't seen the previews for the last episode, so I don't know. I could probably see 2 episodes worth of stuff being skimmed from this season in order to make everything a little tighter, but overall I'm very happy.

I just think Carm's new found depression and uselessness is being poorly executed, and placing her in Paris hindered that story line furthur.

I know many people here have complained about the focus on second teir characters like Artie and Vito this season, but I think they've been nice little side stories to push along Tony's road to recovery and the losening ties between Jersey and New York. As a whole I think this seaosn is very strong and a lot has happened. The gaps in between episode airings can damage this perception (I've learned to deal with this from previous seasons), so I think many people will have a change of heart when rewatching this season on DVD.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I Figured the "Whacking" Crowd would like it. It was an all around good episode and the "Carm" stuff continues Carm's Eventual Path, what with seeing Adrieanna which leads to her talking to Tony Next week. I Know are expecting a war but be prepared Chase may do this off screen between the break and pick up with the final Eight dealing with the Aftermath. And I'll know they'll be screaming bloody Murder around here if that happens.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Well I don't know if I want to "see" the war so much as see it's aftermath or what it does to these two families. It's a really cool concept which Chase and co. have been dangling in front of us for quite some time now. And it the opportunity seems more then ripe - particularly since we know this is the end of the series.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Solid episode. At least, I won't have to read about Vito's storyline ruining the show anymore.

I find Carmela much more interesting than in the last two seasons. Now that her marriage is (sorta) better, she's much less of a shrill bitch. Tony's poor treatment of her was a good reason for her to be that but she irritated me when all's her character was scream and shout at Tony.

It was funny seeing Silvio and Carlo kill Fat Dom with a hand vac and a butcher knife. And Sil's line about not wanting to cut him up in Satriale's because of "all the DNA" was great.

I'd be surprised if there was any type of mob war next season. It'd be cool to see but I don't think it'll happen.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

As someone who finds the Shield totally unwatchable, I would take that as a compliment

Tonights episode of Sopranos was damn near perfect for me. This entire season has been phenomenal. Tonight's episode was a series of "what ifs" that played out, and we were able to see how they effected the lives of the characters.

Vito had episodes away, where he could have lived a happy life, but he couldn't give up his old life.. and when he comes back, not only is he killed, but his death is the catalyst for more killing. First, as we saw last week, a man who he hit with a vehicle, then another made man with Silvio, and a brewing conflict with New York. The use of his family (SIL) being placed in their home as a reminder of how cruel the whole situation played out was brilliant, IMHO.

I thought it really played out a nice commentary on the entire Johny Cakes storyline. Of all the people who were around Vito, his own family had no love lost for him ("He'll go to Hell") and were willing to kill him (Phil) but Vito's death immediately followed his rejection by Johnny Cakes, someone who loved & accepted him. I thought that was utterly brilliant.

I thought the Carmella storyline was also very strong; by trying to get away from things she realize she never really could get away. Her high school/college ambitions of being an educated socialite were thrown in her face when Meadow rejected it to follow a man, and following when she couldn't drag herself to speak french while in France, despire her having bragged to Tony that she had taken several years of french. I see other people portraying it as a depression, I didn't see it that way. I felt as though she had come to reality. She realized that she had been living vicariously through Meadow and Meadow's successes in school, and when Meadow turned her back on it, it was crushing to her.. and Tony just fell asleep. When she went away, she realized she too had made basically the same choice. Her nest was going to be empty of the one she put the most faith in. All those little lies you tell yourself about who you think you are; Carmella realized she was not that person. I thought placing it in France made it far more powerful, not because of the depression, but because as early as Season 2, Carmella had talked about "seeing the world" and becoming more high-society. When she actually does it, she realizes it's not the person she is anymore. Brilliant.

I get it, I see people in this thread who want to attack each other, fine. If you enjoy the show or not, that's fine. I don't care. I personally enjoy it. And I have found the writing, the nuance, and the storylines of this season to be better then almost anything else on TV. Period.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Since this is a Sopranos thread, I'm not going to debate the greatness of The Shield with you. All I'll say is that I think it's the best written/acted show currently on TV and it's been as consistenly compelling as The Sopranos used to be.

As for tonight, I thought the episode was much better than the last few weeks and I was glad to finally see SOMETHING happen. I thought the Carmella in France stuff dragged a bit, but it was tolerable because everything else about the episode was so good. I definitely give it a strong .

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I tend to agree with everything you said Chris. Good write up.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Damn !!!
And I thought I watched tonight's episode.

well done and thank you.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I thought the epsiode was average. Maybe the Soprano's isn't for me. I hated the entire Carm storyline and fast forward(first time ever with the show) through a lot of her Paris trip.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I was cheering when Tony was reading AJ the riot act. Finally.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I thought the very last scene was pretty funny. It was a not-so-subtle reference to Chase killing off Vito's character for the actor Joseph Gannascoli doing Celebrity Fit Club. "Hey, I shot that guy for club fit!"

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

You sir, have 'owned me' and my intelligence. I bow to your greatness.

Reading that has given me a new found respect for Camela's storyline. Thank you.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I agree. I was particularly struck by her attention to the beauty of Paris, the ornate buildings, lamp posts, bridges, etc. That's a stark contrast to the flat, dull architecture of New Jersey and most of the modern world. Seeing those sculptures on storefronts made her realize what people of other cultures and other times valued in contrast to what the people she knows value, and it was obviously an eye-opening experience. She's not only not who she wants to be, she's not living in the world she wants to live in.

Great episode. Strong storylines all around, but particularly Carmela's.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Did you watch the episode? Bringing up Jackie Junior's death as a dinner conversation? That was absolutely UNBELIEVABLE!!!! Carmela is a hateful selfish bitch with absolutely no concern at all of anyone other than Carmella. She's deplorable. They all are. It's a wonder that Chase makes the story so compelling when all of these people are such complete swine.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Anyone else enjoy Phil coming out of the closet to watch Vito get whacked? It was worth a chuckle.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I found Carmela's story very visually interesting, but it seemed a little mis-placed in the story. Not complaining, as I did like it a lot. Great episode. I was half-horrified/half-cracking-up when Sil and Carlo were killing fat Dom.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Nice. I didn't catch that.

Carmella's delivery of the line about realizing that the deaths of many generations of people leaving no lasting impact seemed appropriate in light of the NY/NJ brewing storm.

After Tony drives the dancer home: "You're sweet" as she takes the cash.

Watching Vito's kids reading the paper was really hard.

"They found Vito."
"I wish I had borrowed money from him."

The other theme I liked in this episode was the Godfather references, "it's business, not personal." Tony, moreso than anyone, gets this. He always thinks about how his decisions will affect his business. Whether or not to bring Vito back was all about whether he could generate money, but the loss of Vito's ability to work with the construction guys was a problem. Then once they make the decision to get rid of Vito, but Phil beats him to it, the next discussion is how to best preserve the business. It's no longer about mocking Vito, or wanting him dead, or even thinking Phil did him a favor. It's now about someone killing a guy that was Tony's responsibility.

But he doesn't want war if he can avoid it. "Guys on the mattresses are not earning." ("Going to the mattresses" is another expression I first heard in Godfather.) Tony has to weigh the decision of which will be more costly, starting a war or losing credibility with NY as well as his own guys by not doing anything. When he decides to steal from Phil's "wire room" (what is that?) instead of an eye for an eye and killing a captain, the viewer is now fully aware that it's the smart, businesslike move. But then Fat Dom goes too far and we are now all bracing for what will come. Nice.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

A bookie joint. It's called a "wire room" because of all the phone lines that have to be run in. Christopher was running a "wire room" when he was in charge of the "Real Estate" company.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I think this was just another example of Carmella's lack of class and decorum. The whole Carm story in this episode dealt with her not being up to par with true wealth and elegance. She's mafia rich, and although all the Prada bags and designer clothes may say she has money, the lack of confidence in her French, the lack of class at the dinner table (along with Rosalie dropping 'F' bombs left and right) and her general lost look amongst some of the world's greatest architecture and art (contrasted by a stark look at the front of Satriale's) all say she is just a mob wife from Jersey.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Yes, I did watch the episode. And while bringing up Jackie Jr. was a terrible idea, it wasn't done to be mean spirited. She did it because she was depressed and incorrectly assumed that Rosalie was feeling the same way and wanted to talk about it. It was the wrong time and topic (to say the least) but she didn't bring it up to say "Haha my son is alive and yours is dead!", I think she did out of concern for her friend.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

I think Carm also sees the possibility of her nitwit son (A.J.) winding up in the rackets like Jackie Jr. did. Carm knows that A.J. is not that bright and wouldn't last long 'in the life'. That may be what keeps her thinking of Jackie Jr.

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

They made that pretty clear by cutting from Carmella staring at the ornate architecture on the bridge to Sil outside the Bing telling the guy cleaning the sign, "Make sure you clean that shit off her tit."

I thought Carm's storyline was brilliant this week with its contrasts to the mob life and meditations on death ala Tony's coma.

Rob

Re: SOPRANOS Season 6: New this week.. Episode 9: "The Ride"

Move along, nothing to see here...