NBA Basketball 2004-2005 thread - Page 11

My one word reaction to last night's Debacle in Dallas:

Ouch!

On to the off-season, where hopefully we can acquire a quality power forward - and keep our coach!! I wonder if Stern will indeed kick off the Van Gundy investigation now that the Rockets are out, or will he wait until the end of the playoffs.

Congrats to all the teams (and their fans here) moving on to Round 2.

Houston needs a 3rd scorer in the backcourt, preferably someone that can bring the ball up the floor and relieve T-Mac of that job. I would say that Kidd would be a good choice since he is unhappy in Jersey but he seems to be some trouble in the locker room. Maybe get Phil Jax and you guys will win it all.

Kidd just said last week that he'd like to play in Houston, but as great as he is I don't know if the oldest team in the league needs another old guy with creaky legs (not to mention his huge salary). They need to get younger and get a frontcourt enforcer to support Yao and more defense in the backcourt.

Yeah, Haggai, one thing I think most of us agree on, TNT Inside the NBA is one of the best shows on TV, period. I watch it even if I missed the game.

I'd love for them to dump Magic and move Reggie in there. Magic, well, good player but not a great nor fun communicator. He stands out badly. Meanwhile Reggie's attitude and knack for cutting up would fit in well.

Maybe nationally you guys haven't seen as much of this, but he has spent many a day in the studio with Bob and Tom (radio show, now nationally syndicated) cutting up with them and he's strong at it. Quick, can get his thoughts out, and a great sense of humor. Magic is weak in all those areas.


Anyway, I got my 6th row by the Pacers tunnel but then I've been holding out on a contact for better 4th game seats so I originally settled for 21st row, single. Upgraded to a pair just below that. Still way off my first 5 rows I normally get, mostly because we ran to Conseco to buy tix per local TV only to find out they didn't really open the box office, so we had to race back home and get online. Cost us 15 minutes of online buying time.


SA-SEA - looked like I expected, especially since I didn't expect SEA to be there.

MIA-WSH - also how you would expect it to go, though I think WSH can keep it tighter than that at some point

DAL-HOU - sure surprised me. I can see the DAL win, sort of, but with losing 4 of 5 you have to wonder if some of that came from the JVGundy distraction.

Maybe I just don't respect DAL enough, but I think PHX will roll through them. I only see the Spurs as able to slow them down.

A big surprise for me also. It almost seems like the Rockets used all their energy in game 6 and had none left for game 7. Avery Johnson said that Dallas had the defense that they had been looking for all series, but I kind of wonder how much of that was Houston just being flat.

For sure no one can lay this at T-Mac´s feet. For the first time, I really respect his play and conduct--even with a bit of the last game frustration.
Don´t forget that Van Gundy did not make that statement until after the Rockets had lost two at home. I think that Van Gundy´s complaints actually picked the team up.

But in the end, players like Bob Sura, wound up with series stats not much different than their carrear stats. If he were the player that he seemed to be in the first two games, he´d be making the really big bucks.

Last game--T-Mac and Yao combine for 60. The rest of the team scores 16.

I agree 1000%, while magic is not as bad as Shannon Sharpe or even worse Eric Dickerson he is bad. I haven't seen much or Reggie's commentating but his interviews are always good and he seems like he wants to be there.


** Side Note **

Can some of these second round teams show up to play? This is getting ridiculous with all the blowouts and I mean early blowouts...

I expect Indy to play much better in Game 2 on Wednesday. They were obviously tired from getting only one day's rest after their seven game series vs. Boston, plus they need to pick up their game a notch after playing a fundamentally poor Celtic team for seven games. However, if the Pacers lay another egg tomorrow night, this could be a short series.

Yeah, Pistons looked very good last night, and Indy completely sucked. Jermaine was good in the first half, and Foster's now hitting the boards very consistently, but nobody else did anything for them. Tinsley getting into quick foul trouble in the first half didn't help them, but it was a one-sided affair overall. I also think they'll play better, certainly with fewer idiotic turnovers leading to Detroit fast-breaks, a big key last night. But it did feel good to get a decisive win, especially with a really strong first half, something that was missing even in the first two big wins over Philly. Decent minutes off the bench in the 2nd quarter for Dice and Arroyo, and some really good contributions from Lindsey.

Question for anyone who stayed up watching the TNT coverage through the Suns/Mavs: after Rip had the embarassing play where he bounced a slam-dunk off his own head and back through the basket, Steve Kerr was saying that he'd never seen that before, but I'm 99% sure I remember seeing it happen in the late '80s to none other than...Charles Barkley! Did anyone in the TNT studio remember this and/or dig up the footage?

And then, the Van Gundy business...obviously nobody who has even half a brain is going to buy his claim that his mystery source was "[not] a working NBA referee... [but] an official with the league." Whatever. But Stern is satisfied with it, and now considers the matter "closed." My initial guess is that this was a mutually agreed excuse, with a possible scenario being that Van Gundy said, "I'm not going to back down from the whole thing, suspend me if you want," and then somebody suggested this silly compromise, which Stern was willing to accept. Mike and Mike on ESPN Radio had a quote from a spokesman for the NBA referees, who accused Van Gundy of telling "an egregious lie" in claiming now that he was never referring to any game referees. Maybe the whole thing'll go away now, but when the Rockets start next season, I have to think that they'd be facing all kinds of questions about Van Gundy and the refs before and after every single game. If so, maybe he won't be back coaching them.

I was just about to say... Blowouts all over the place

I don't mind Nash as the MVP but I wonder how Shaq might react if the Suns meet Miami in the finals, if he might go a little crazy to make a point. "He has my trophy."

The NBA dropped its case against Van Gundy. They're saying he made it up but they accept his apology, he's saying he didn't make it up but he's sorry about the misunderstanding, but the bottom line is he's not getting suspended next season.

On the end of Van Gundy-gate... If you look back at VG's actual words, he never did use the word "referee". So whether he was being careful at the time, or whether he was just lucky (I suspect the latter), the word game gave him & Stern a way out. Note that VG is not backing off his claim that specific instructions were handed down on how to officiate Yao:
So Stern gets to claim VG made it all up, but IMO the reality is after he cooled down he realized this was a can of worms he didn't want to open any further. The truth is, we'll probably never know the truth.
He'll be back. Van Gundy's stock has never been higher in Houston.

Yeah, I guess you're right about him coming back, as he's become a sort of folk hero in Houston, from what I understand. His statements were pretty absurd from the beginning, but I guess I can see how people there are rallying to him for apparently standing up to the league on behalf of his players.

His initial comments, as I recall, were that he had heard about the "Yao rules" from "an official who isn't working in the playoffs," which obviously means a referee, as people in the league office don't stop working once the playoffs start. And, of course, the firestorm for the past week has been all about referees, and Van Gundy didn't choose to make any "clarifications" about who his Deep Throat source was until now. So, it's obviously an invented way out for both Stern and Van Gundy.

Reggie is one of those players who has a very solid candor for commentating. He does a great job with presenting an argument and you actually want to listen to him. TNT has used him in the past, at times, and he's been excellent; his breakdowns of players/series/the NBA on Dan Patrick for ESPN is easily amongst the best.

I realize that he is the home-town herom Craig, but really--Van Gundy was either telling a lie then--or now.

The refs are not fooled (nor is anyone else outside of Mosquitoville )--they want him fired.

Man, am I pissed off with how the Pistons collapsed in the second half last night. They looked like freakin' Boston out there, taking horrible shots, getting outhustled, everything. I didn't even watch the last three minutes or so of the 4th quarter because I was too angry. Foster's playing great for Indy, so he's going to get a lot of boards in any event, but could they, you know, try to block him out? Like, sometimes? I'm pretty shaken how awful they were in the 2nd half, since I'm not sure that this fold-up might not rear its ugly head again at some point. Reggie probably doesn't have three more second-halves like that left in him in this series, but that's not the sort of thing I want to be counting on.

Phoenix has to be concerned with having Johnson go down, but as Marc Stein says today, "you're even tempted to wonder aloud whether Dallas can play Phoenix any better," and they still only won in the final seconds. Finley isn't going to drop 31 every night. On the other hand, Dampier certainly responded to Dirk's public throw-down, with 15 points and 12 boards. Good move by Avery Johnson after the game to take up the mantle of keeping the pressure on him, but from the more standard source of the head coach: "He's still playing catchup. He's still playing at a deficit. ... He has a lot of work to do to please his coach."

Haggai, I agree with your assessment completely. Indy played very well, but the Pistons appeared to stop playing after building a big first quarter lead, as if they thought the game was over. Detroit had a chance to take control of the series if they had continued playing hard, but they blew it big time. Now the Pacers are in the series for the duration. There is no way the Pistons should be giving up that many offensive rebounds.

Could we please get some consistent officiating in these games? Please? I mean, after the first half, the Spurs are getting called every time the Sonics trip on themselves (literally). The FT count was 23-6 in favor of Seattle at half time. Then, in the second half, it reverses, with a final tally of 34-33 in favor of SA. Sure it worked out in the end with more or less even numbers, but you can't get into a groove when things shift that wildly from one end of the spectrum to the other. Not that I'm blaming the refs for SA's loss, their own atrocious shooting from anywhere on the court sealed that, but it was still terribly inconsistent and prevents any sort of flow from moving in the games when it's that uneven. Favoring one team then the other is not balanced officiating.

Yeah, him with Dan Patrick is pure gold, very similar to what you get on TNT.

Sidenote, for Reggie's last game (regular season) they had tons of video tributes from people, plus a long ceremony afterward. DP had the first one and he talked about being the only guy at ESPN who liked this guy that everyone said was one dimensional, and after awhile he realized that maybe they were right, he couldn't jump, couldn't play defense, etc, but it didn't matter, he was HIS one dimensional player.

And for a great career, I thank you RIK SMITS.

Got a great laugh, no one saw it coming.



Love that game 3 win. I had the seat right next to the Pacers tunnel, front row against both rails (front and side), got high fives/fist pounds from all the guys (except Reggie and AJ). Also had to wait in line for the bathroom next to Bill Walton, who is so flipping tall in person its amazing. Quinn Buckner stood on the other side of the railing next to me much of the game. Killer seat. I could read Rick's lips when they were discussing plays.

We are pretty jazzed about game 4 around here. The wife and I will be behind the baseline in row 7 right next to the Pistons tunnel for that one.

Way more security than either previous DET game in Indy. 3 times as much. Very few Pistons fans in the place, they made a real effort to control ticket sales on this.

Stern got boo'd loudly the couple times he left his seat (with 5 bodyguards no less).

I can't believe Larry Brown is crying for the Hunter flop, after JO fouled out on a cheap foul BEFORE Rip got his 6th holding Reggie's jersey a minute or two later. Reggie got run right into on one rebound that gave him 2 FTs which was legit, Rip was clearly holding Reggie's jersey on his 6th.

Carlisle was great at shutting that crap down, poiting out that DET got more FTs, less fouls called on them and that "after this year, I don't want to hear it". Beautiful.


The mood here is happy but tentative. 2 more wins is a long way to go, but I think America just got reminded that what I said way back after the brawl is true. Even without Ron this is a pretty deep team with lots of defense.

Pacers points against and FG% against have been good all year, especially when Tins and JO and Foster and Fred Jones have been healthy. I think people forgot when so many guys were out hurt that this team was more than just a "feel good". This is still the team that held DET to 27 points in the first half of game 6 last year. These games should be the defensive battles that they have been.

During the first half of last night's game, I went from beyond anger to contempt. I didn't even watch the third quarter or the beginning of the fourth, as the Pistons weren't giving an effort worthy of watching. In the second half of Game 2 and the first half of Game 3, they suddenly turned into an expansion team on offense. Almost nobody went to the basket, and when they did, they'd dribble right into the defense and get stripped, or throw it directly into the arms of three defenders. Standing around on the perimeter and taking lousy shots, or standing around watching someone go one-on-one in the post and jack up an impossible turn-around. More turnovers than field goals for most of the first half. The Pacers were playing reasonably well, like the reasonably good team they are, with Tinsley and Foster and Fred Jones healthy enough to contribute, as Seth pointed out.

When I flipped it back on a few minutes into the fourth and saw the score a little bit closer, plus the free throw numbers in Detroit's advantage, I knew they were finally being smarter and aggressive in getting to the basket, so I stuck with the game. Suddenly the rally came, with Prince going to the hole, Rip going to the hole, Chauncey going to the hole. The defense got better, the Pacers got kind of frazzled, and it was a game again. When the Pistons took the lead on two free throws by Chauncey, I really thought they were going to win. But there were three plays down the stretch that were much more important than Reggie's last jumper: Rasheed airballing a three from the corner, Rip grabbing Reggie's jersey like a chump, and Rasheed missing another open three. The Pistons left themselves no margin for error in the last few minutes, and it wasn't enough.

If this team can actually play four quarters of decent ball--hell, even three out of four--they should certainly win, but with Indy playing well most of the time, especially with consistently high level play from Tinsley and Foster, there's no more room for mistakes. Lose on Sunday, and the season's over.

Ahhh, now that's what I'm talkin' about...four good quarters! Just what the doctor ordered. Good production from Rasheed and McDyess, and clear dominance from Chauncey over Tinsley. I was pulling my hair out after the first few minutes of the game, with all those bad turnovers and the fast start for Indy, but what a great run for the rest of that quarter. The defense really picked up, and though Indy missed a few open shots, most of their possessions in the first half ended without any good looks, with the significant added bonus of neutralizing Foster's dominance on the offensive glass. Of some importance for Detroit was the little recovery at the end of the 2nd quarter, when Indy cut it to 9 before going down again by 13 at the half. And then, of course, the big response to the Indy rally in the third, when they cut it to 6, before Detroit exploded to go back up by 20. Still concerned with some lousy turnovers, although Indy obliged by being even worse in that department. Need to shoot better as well, particularly Hamilton and Prince. Rip got going a bit in the second half by hitting some tough shots, but he's still not getting to the bucket or going to the line.

I missed both Friday and Sunday's games (had a lot going on this weekend), but I'm glad to read that the Pistons finally got their heads out of their a$$'s and played like they are supposed to again. I think this series is going seven games -- Indy's not going away without a fight.

I'm also tired of the "everything the Pacers have been through" business with reference to the brawl, but there is justification for saying that because they've had so many injuries on top of the suspensions. Coming back the way they have from the injuries is definitely worthy of praise.

So the West is heating up too, both series tied up. Stunning how many turnovers the Spurs had, but can Ridnour and Damien Wilkins (!) bring it for three more games? I'm still seeing a Phx/SA conference finals, but the rest of this week is going to be quite interesting.

meanwhile back at Stately O'Neal Manor....


Shaq rests...


Stay Tuned true believers...

Miami is really catching a break having swept the Wizzards and having some extra time to rest/hope Shaq gets healthy.

In a surprise to like nobody, Chris Webber was spouting off about playing with A.I. and how he wanted out of Philadelphia. Someone aught to explain to Webber the difference between him and A.I. which is that A.I. doesn't suck.

Miami also caught a break in getting to play the Wizards in the first place. They couldn't have asked for an easier opponent. Of course, they earned the spot by finishing first in the East. However, if Detroit and Miami had switched 2nd round opponents, the Pistons would be resting right now while Miami would be struggling with Indy.

Chris Webber is an ass. Always has been, always will be.

Miami obviously appreciates having the week off to rest Shaq, but this could be a pretty serious injury. He also had a week off after they swept NJ, while Washington and Chicago went 7, but it didn't seem to do him much good.

Didn't get to see the Pistons game last night, but they obviously played teriffic defense and dominated the boards, so that's pleasing to know. Arroyo has also gotten good minutes in the last two games, so hopefully Larry will stick with him from here on in. I really want them to finish this off in Game 6. Indy's got to be pretty shell-shocked after getting pounded twice in a row.

I did see the second half of Spurs/Sonics last night, teriffic stuff from Ginobli and others to lead the way on that huge run. The Sonics did get back to within 5, but then SA ran away with it again.

I don't know how many steals the Pistons had last night, but everytime I looked up (eating at a sports bar), a Pacer was trying to drive the lane, and was getting his pocket picked, and the Piston went down for easy buckets after the steals.

When the Pistons play active pressure defense and move the ball offensively like they did last night, they are very tough to beat. With Jermaine O'Neal still obviously not 100% and Reggie Miller pretty much out of gas, the Pacers do not have the horses to keep up with the Pistons when they are playing their best. If they can maintain that intensity in Game 6 and then vs. Miami, the Heat are in for a real battle. However, if Detroit becomes disinterested and stands around on offense and defense (like in Games 2 & 3), there will be a Game 7 at The Palace on Sunday.