Sight and Sound (2002) Greatest Films Club - Page 10

I've seen several films since my last update bringing my total to 75

Seven Samurai - A+
Singin' in the Rain - A-
Trouble in Paradise - A
His Girl Friday - A
My Neighbor Totoro - B
Throne of Blood - A+
Stray Dog - A-
Hidden Fortress - A

Saw three Kurosawa films in the theater over the weekend.

Stray Dog – I’ve seen all of the pre-Rashomon Kurosawa films I can find and this is my favorite. Lots of parallels with Drunken Angel but this is a much tighter story. Kurosawa nicely lays out the plot to show the methods the detectives use. Very good photography in the slums of Tokyo. Shimura and Mifune both put in wonderful performances.

Throne of Blood – Had no idea what to expect but completely loved this film. Has to be one of the best adaptations of Macbeth. I am definitely going to preorder the Criterion dvd.

Hidden Fortress – It’s been a while since I’ve seen this and this is a first on a big screen. I have a love/hate thing with this film. I love Mifune. The role of the general serving the princess is one of his best. The scene where is chases the scouts that leads to the duel is a classic. However, the peasants begin to grate on me after a while. They go through the greed / stupidity / begging cycle a few too many times. It was a treat seeing a very clean print in widescreen format.

agreed

A bit of a [rant]rant[/rant] here.. Sorry, I've been a bit dispirited by some recent discussions (off the forums.. damn real life. )

I think in the main you're preaching to the converted with the regulars in this thread.

What's most depressing is that the attitude which dismisses the expression of these elements crops up almost universally.. Only the other day I heard La Dolce Vita & Rashomon were rejected out of hand as "Dreary bollocks the like of which only you and a few pretentious film students could bring themselves to watch and claim they enjoyed".

That by a friend who is far from poorly educated or unintelligent. Granted he's got an economics degree which tells you something I suppose but even so I'd have expected him to take them on their merits.

I think we really have to ask, would Bergman, Fellini or Kurosawa have attained the success and status they did if they were starting out today. I doubt it.

Yes, this is quite typical of every Marx Bros film, though films like Duck Soup, Animal Crackers and Night at the Opera have better "connector" plots than some of their other films.

In the end the pleasure comes from their gags, songs, and musical performances. The rest of the people are just props and story devices.

Personally I find Animal Crackers to have the sharpest wit of all their films, but this is a point that is often debated by Marx Bros fans. Their humor is much more sophisticated than non-viewers would expect from the era, but then that's true for several other great early comedy talkies too. My point being that they could come back today and pack audiences in IMO, and without having to go a lot dirtier.

Was he describing EVERY SINGLE DISCOURSE on economics?

Educated or not, let's keep things in perspective, you must have a certain mindset to major in econ. I'm not saying econ guys are all uptight money-grubbing frumps with no sense of artistic value...but then I'm not NOT saying it either.



j/k


But would the artists achieve those levels today? Yes, because its incorrect to think that the eras in which the "masters" were doing their work was anymore receptive to high art than now.

Example, Sunrise and Metropolis both took bad hits in the BO, and Sunrise won an Oscar as well as lots of other critical praise. Even in 1915, 1925, 1935 filmmakers had to concern themselves with the idea of high art vs. popular entertainment. And in a slight bit of irony, UFA and the German filmmakers of the mid 1910's were actually trying to establish their works as higher art (by means of using more literary sources for films) in order to attract more middle-class business. Before then the cinema was seen as a seedy place filled with lusty, uncouth men lying in wait in the dark.

Now its screaming little brats and cell phones. Not all that different of an experience, eh.



edit - and its not like Kane was a BO hit either. Not sure about 2001 but I believe it was not a big hit.

I knew my line on pretentiousness would get a few reactions. To clarify (don't see much misunderstanding, BTW), I did not mean the film is pretentious. Rather, it is my own way of discussing the film. This happens when I know it didn't connect with me on a personal level, but then to discuss it, I must use very large themes to talk about it. Therefore, it is myself that becomes pretentious since I would talk about grand themes that I don't necessary believe in, or have connected with.

Brook, I didn't think of the boy going through with the construction of the bell as based on his faith. I thought of it as his way of proving himself, on a youthful, brave, and naive basis. But your reading of the boy gives Andrei's final actions better logic.

Chris, isn't Stray Dog great? I've heard of comparisons making this Kurosawa's Bicycle Thieves, and it sort of makes sense. And that finale, wow!

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Kirk - completely understood what you meant. At work I try to post something short and quick, then I’m usually out and seeing a film and by the time I get home to post it is late and I feel that whatever I’m writing is blather. Even now I’m writing this after midnight while watching Cowboy Bebop so if I tried to put add my views on something like Rublev it would seem pretentious.

Hey, my best field is an econ major. Seriously, we met because it seemed like the only two people in college that thought there was more to life than our major. It’s the same with all aspects of art, not just film, many people I know have that mainstream only mentality. That’s why I love it when I meet someone who has lots of interests.

Stray Dog was really good. I’m 6 films into the 13 film Kurosawa festival here and loving every second of it. After seeing Drunken Angel last week I was expecting another good film that still hinted at everyone’s potential. I was nicely surprised. I’m also reading the book “The Emperor and the Wolf” and the second on Stray Dog includes and interesting discussion of Kurosawa and his cameraman walking through the slums with a hidden camera to get the walking through the crowd shots.

Last night I watched The Red Shoes. (A)
Which together with Truffaut's Jules et Jim (B+) (which I watched later on Monday night than was wise ) makes my total 106.

I had a tougher time with Jules et Jim. Possibly because I just kept thinking 'Give it up guys, it's never going to happen!' and possibly because it was just too late on the last day of the public Easter holiday to really appreciate the film.

On the other hand I think J&J will benefit from a second watching so maybe I'll revise my opinion later. :b

Yeah, that's what I thought you meant, which is why I responded. I thought it was interesting that you were describing your language as pretentious. I guess I'm just not sure what that means. Effectively discussing Art (acknowledging all of the critical problems that attend the use of "Art" with a capital A) demands a certain vocabulary -- one that extends beyond the stuff of popular film criticism, with its often gross reductions of large ideas down to soundbites and snippets. I get frustrated when I hear that vocabulary described as "pretentious" (and this is a larger issue of mine, so I'm not directing any of this specifically at you, Kirk).

Anyway, sorry for hijacking the thread. I've seen a few interesting films lately, but none of them are on the list. I do have a rental copy of The Wind Will Carry Us at home, though, which I look forward to watching.

We get the Kurosawa-Mifune films in June and July here. I've already seen most of them, but other than Ran, haven't seen any Kurosawa in a theater so I'm really looking forward to being able to see as many as my schedule allows. And Stray Dog is one I haven't seen so I will definitely make sure to catch it.

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Stray Dog which I also saw last weekend. The Kurosawa/Mifune retrospective is just such a great opportunity to see these films on the big screen. A police procedure film in structure, film noir in feel, but of course another exercise in Kruosawa’s humanism. Fine work indeed.

And just to put in my 2 cents, I find Duck Soup to be the best of the Marx Brother’s films.

But as to the comment on plot, while there is something in that they are just devices on which to hang jokes and bits, I find this film to be of more serious intent. It is, in my view, quite the anti-war film. Or perhaps more exactly, it is a film that espouses pacifist views.

This is what makes a horse race, as I think The Lady Eve to be hysterically funny. I suppose that if you don’t like screwball comedies, then there is not much that I can write that would change anyone’s mind. But for me the actors in this film flawlessly deliver flawless lines.

Granted, the artifice of the situation and the suspension of disbelief necessary to enjoy this film (indeed all screwball comedies—and many, many other types of films) is great. But, for me the rewards in so doing are even greater.

Aside from that, I would contest John’s assessment of Henry Fonda as an ‘ignorant fool’. He is in fact an innocent, not at all ignorant (he is after all a scientist) nor a fool, except to act foolishly when smitten by a beautiful woman whom he rightly considers out of his league.

It is fairly standard practice (and not just in films) to portray young men hopelessly in love as acting foolishly (and not without reason), but given that Jean Harrington falls for Hopsie, he cannot be completely hopeless.

Finally as to the honest people being “ignorant and easy targets’ and those with intelligence being ‘rude and cold-hearted’, I think that we saw two different films.

The one I saw had honest Horace Pike (Fonda’s father) as no ones fool—although he may have been long suffering, he clearly knew everything that was going on—he was just willing to put up with it. And the coldest heart (Eve/Jane) melted at the end—in fact even at the beginning she was not nearly so calculating as the idle, rich young women on the boat. And don’t forget that in the end, Eve is going to go through the divorce with no monetary gain. Even ‘Colonel’ Harrington accedes to this.

I could go on, but suffice to say that I think that your characterization is off the mark.

i don't think my characterization is off the mark. but yes i do believe that i can not handle screwball comedies that well. watching the protagonists fail miserably. and to be hopelessly watching the events play themselves out just make me squirm in my seat. screwball comedies have a good heart, and the ending is always as planned with everyone, just about, making ammends.
I know that it is hard for me to watch screwball comedies period. maybe there are some that i do like, but on the whole it's a genre i don't like.
Meet the Parents, i thought it was funny, but i barely made it through the first time i saw it and can't stand watching it anymore. I just can't stand watching the protagonist make mistake after mistake.
and to just say "he's a scientist" doesn't make someone intelligent in all that they do. i find it to be an annoying disclaimer, 'how could he be a buffoon?! he's a scientist" making someone seem justified to portray someone a certain way.
blah I just don't like screwball comedies very much, period.

Lew, hadn't thought of the ideas of Duck Soup before, thanks.

The Lady Eve has a running subtext that is very intriguing. The snake, apple, the innocent Fonda coming from the Amazon, and of course the name Eve, all pointing to a question on the value of truth vs. innocence. Once Fonda finds out that Jean is a con, he rejects her despite the bliss he felt. Which is more important?

To put aside such seriousness, I love the picture because it is just damn funny. I agree that screwball comedies can be predictable, but when the process is executed well, the joy during the ride is still great. Barbara Stanwyck and Fonda are priceless, and somehow Sturges makes even the falls funny.

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Throne of Blood, a film that I find to be one of Kurosawa’s best. I just saw this as a part of the Kurosawa/Mifune retrospective currently showing in Dallas. This is a film that I find benefits from being shown on the big screen and in a theatre, where I always find it easier to suspend my disbelief (makes the ‘evil spirit’ scenes all the better). Toshirô Mifune, as usual comes so close to overacting, but in the end I think that he gets Macbeth’s descent in madness just right.

And Isuzu Yamada is an appropriately, cold and calculating schemer, bent on achieving her ambitions through Mifune. A chilling performance.

And I think that the cinematography by Nakai is just outstanding, as are the sets.

Kurosawa is his usual masterful self in handling the big battle scenes and contrasting them with the quiet but tension filled, sparse interior scenes.

A Woman under the Influence

I had enjoyed most of Cassavettes' films but this is one of the few that I hadn't seen. It might even be his best. Peter Falk is better than ever and Gena Rowlands is brilliant as always (in a movie made by her husband, at least). The scene in which Falk tries to bond with his kids and gives them beer is priceless. A

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First prize is you get the girl.
Second prize is this dummy imitation of Cesare.
Third prize is he kills you.

Or something like that.

Watched 3 over the last week:

All About Eve - (A) - Bette Davis puts the B in Bitch!

L'Atalante - (A-) - Vigo was ahead of his time, some of the best visuals for a film of that age, Dita Parlo is easy on the eyes as well!

The Best Years of Our Lives - (B) I can see how this would of been such a powerful film for it's time. It did get sort of sappy though, and personally I feel it was a little too melodramatic.

Brings my total from 101 to 104.

I'm a bit hesitant to come in hear and say what I really think about some of these films (I can hear Brook berating me already ), but perhaps I'll put together a list of what I've seen that I consider masterpieces, which would only irritate people by omission. Interesting idea Arman.

I'm ready to berate!!

Thanks for picking up the slack on The Lady Eve, Lew. I thought about jumping in but didn't know if I could resist ranting. Barbara Stanwyck gives one of my all time favorite acting performances and Preston Sturges' writing is typically brilliant.

Roger Ebert did a great review of The Lady Eve for his "Great Movies" page.

hey, i am not trying to say everyone else isn't justified in their liking The Lady Eve. i was just saying i didn't like it, and that it's hard for me to like any screwball comedies on the whole