Rob_Pierce

Girls and Video Games

Check out this article:

http://www.gamegirladvance.com/archi...ideogames.html

OK, I have to admit that the author does not take a feminist point of view and is very understanding of the current status of video games in the article. My question is this: does anyone really care that women are somewhat treated as sexual beings in video games?

To me, video games are one of the few areas of life that is relatively female free, an important characteristic for someone that is married and works with mainly females all day. Until females start putting up the bucks to purchase games for themselves to play, I don't see this trend changing. I sure hope Martha Burke doesn't turn this into a crusade after her Masters golf tournament disaster.

I don't really care for characters such as the prostitutes in GTA 3 or the terrible idea that is BMX XXX, but characters like the ones mentioned in the article are harmless and cater to the male audience that likes to look at breasts (how many threads on here have dealt with the DOA XBV topless "cheat?").

Any other opinions out there?

BertFalasco

I hate all activists in any way, those nature people, tree people and everything else. There are too many complexities in life for peoplem to bicker over a certain category.

What makes that one category so special that it should get attention, such as GLAAD and everything else, one is overfavored?

This kind of shit gets me so angry, such as homosexuals wanting a frigging holiday, are you fu**ing kidding me?
Life is a 1P game.

Greg_S_H

I didn't read the article, but the main thing I'm after is a good game. The first Tomb Raider was a good game and succeeded on that basis, historical revisionism notwithstanding. Yes, people noticed Lara was a female, but the main thing was the amazing (at the time) engine showing off all those new Voodoo cards. And, the gameplay was sensational. When subsequent TR entries failed to advance the game and fell back on sex appeal, they lost me and most other people, to judge from posts I've read and the fact that they have largely gone back to the drawing board for the upcoming title.

And then there's Metroid, where Samus is a female, but it isn't made into a big deal. I suppose a feminist would be upset about her being shown in skimpy clothing in the "good" ending in some of the earlier games (much as Stephen King is angered by Sigourney Weaver stripping down to her skivvies at the end of Alien), but that ignores the fact that the game basically (and not intentionally, I would imagine) boosts their idea of women being equal to men.

In the end, I'm probably right where you are, Rob. It's a case-for-case basis. If the women are there just for abusive purposes, I won't participate. But, something like DOA doesn't offend me. Hey, I'm geek enough to say that video game women can be attractive (yes, real is better; save your breath! )--who hasn't looked forward to a King of Fighters game mainly for Mia? But, like I said, there has to be a good game there.

Jason Seaver

Of course, why would women start buying games for themselves if they feel insulted by them?

To a certain extent, I don't care what the medium is - reducing women to nothing more than sex objects is something I'm not comfortable watching. And if the game puts you in a position where you're rewarded for participating in exploitation - or where your character is a part of it in a cut-scene, for example - I find it kind of creepy, and I imagine a woman would consider it much worse.

This is especially true as games become more and more complex. People talk about the plot of a game more, and it that's going to be an issue, then you really have to start thinking about how the various characters are being portrayed more.

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Dave Falasco

It's a reasonably well-written article and I can certainly sympathize with her point, but the simple fact is that most gamers are males between, say, 13 and 30, and a good portion of that group just likes to look at girls in skimpy clothing. It's why your typical newstand has 12 different "gentlemen's" offerings, from the mild "FHM" or "Maxim" to the more adult rags. I think for the most part game developers have targeted pretty well what their demographic likes. Guys like cars, and we have lots of racing games. Guys like blowing shit up, and we have lots of action/military games. Guys like sports, and we have just about every sporting game you can conceive. And guys like looking at girls, so there are games that let you do that as well.

I don't see anything wrong with that; if someone doesn't like that sort of thing they can just avoid those games just as a non-race fan would avoid Gran Turismo. And to be fair, that article doesn't seem to be calling so much for the banning of those kinds of games, but rather for the development of more female-friendly games. It's certainly an argument that has been heard before and one against which I would never argue the merit. I just don't know if the numbers are there. If someone builds it, will they come?

BertFalasco

Why should anyone even conform to such a turn of mentality just because these things happen, why must we have to do women oriented stuff? Just like a store such as Starbucks are allowed to refuse to sell you something based on their discretion, it isn't neccessary for games to have "proper" womenly subjects/trophies; ergo, companies can do what they want. Who the hell are they to try and render something they did not create. There is not a standard/rulebook for women to use as a code of justification.

I feel like I am getting too heated and philosophical.

Mark Evans

I think the problem is that with Maxim, you can reasonably assume that your target audience is that 13-30 male demographic that likes to look at skimpy women.

But video gaming as a whole, while currently predominantly catering to that category is not that specific. Maxim is not something that anybody ever expects to attract that many women. I think video gaming is, but it's not going to happen with the current concept of the "mature" title.

I too didn't have a chance to peruse the article, but the fact of the matter is that women are rarely given a good deal in gaming. Samus and Cate Archer are two great examples though of how you can make a female protagonist who is capable, interesting, and, yes, sexy, without transforming her into a sex object. They represent a minority though.

Also, who can blame women for feeling slighted by gaming? Who remembers that unfortunate spate of girl games a few years back? The heck with girls, nobody wanted to play that stupid Barbie game. A good game should be able to transcend gender.

I think treating women as sex objects in a game is unfortunate because it reflects poorly on gaming as a whole and it definitely does nothing but reinforce the stereotype that gamers are social misfits.

I don't refer to games like GTA3 either, btw, as I think any crime came about drug cartels that didn't have hookers wouldn't be realistic anyway. I predominantly mean games that are created with the t&a first and the game second. That is the "bass-ackwards" school of game design.

Mark Evans

\"I\'m sure that\'s it. Maybe I should write a horror novel on passive resistance instead.\"
- Gabriel Knight

Morgan Jolley

This is how I look at it:

Who freakin cares? If you don't like a problem, fix it yourself (unless its in the government, then the only way to fix it is protest it). And if you're in the minority opinion, well then no wonder you're dissatisfied. The minority is named as such BECAUSE it's the least popular point of view. If everyone else wants something only you don't, its better to appease them.

Though some examples of overt sexuality are a little over the top, like DOA:XBV.

BTW, one time I was playing Tekken Tag Tournament while my brother had a female friend over. She saw one of the girls in the game and thought it was overtly sexist that she was big breasted and good looking. But when she saw one of the males without his shirt on, she instantly thought he was hot and wanted to try the game out. So sexuality can go both ways. It's not like every game out there only has girls that represent perfection, nearly all of the male protagonists in games are tough, strong, and badass (like women typically want them to be).

Joseph Young

Hm, not exactly sure what it is that is irking you, Bert. An article written by a female video game player that doesn't automatically condemn condemn the gaming industry for somehow 'hating' women is alright by me. If anything I think she was very aware of how much this argument has been run through the sand and wanted to take a more measured, post facto stance. I don't think her suggestions were radical or 'activist' in nature.

Dave, I pretty much agree with your take on the subject.


Yeah, gotta hate those pesty 'nature' people. And those silly activists, having the nerve to declare their independence a few centuries ago, boy, their efforts were for nought, eh?

Life is a multiplayer game.

~j