The Fugitive, Season Two Volume 1 - Reviews - Page 24

Douglas Monce · 06-30-2008, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyFeldman

I believe you've already stated that you've never seen an episode of The Fugitive and all your doing basically is just saying whatever comes into your head, which is fine, because those who do know a little more are more reliable. They didn't replace "thirty" hours - they had someone write cues in the style of and they did what the show originally did - used those cues throughout the however many episodes that comprised season two volume 1 - each episode running approximately 51 minutes, so where this thirty hours of music comes from is anyone's guess.

I don't have to have seen the show to know something about the process and the reasons that music might be unavailable to them.

I didn't mean to indicate that there was 30 hours of music, but rather that there was almost 30 hours (actually around 25 hours) of sound track that would have to be remixed with the new elements. When doing a job of this undertaking, you don't just drop in the music tracks and you are done. The whole 51 min of each episode would have to be remixed.

Having worked in the industry I do know a little something about the post production process.

Doug

Douglas Monce · 06-30-2008, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carabimero

---------------------------------------------

The words of the CBS Spokesperson disagree with you. They clearly implied that had they waited there was another possibility. They claim they didn't want to make fans wait.

This again depends on what they mean by delay. If it means that they can't obtain clearances for the music, then the delay would be 95 years (I looked it up) from the original publication date. That would be 2058. This is when the music would fall into the public domain. Of course at that point the whole show would fall into the public domain and anyone could put out a copy.

Doug

Douglas Monce · 06-30-2008, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Von Pein

[/b]

Plus, CBS also seems to be hinting in that full blurb above (although it's not specifically spelled out this way) that some of the original Fugitive background music could have been placed on the S2,V1 DVD release...but instead of putting some of it on there, they thought it would be better to completely strip the whole half-season set of all of the original music, even the stuff that apparently IS bought and paid for by CBS DVD!

I'm really boiling mad now.

I guess its a matter of what is more jarring, to go back and forth between newly recorded score and the older tracks, or just have a completely new score.

Personally I think I would have chosen to re score the whole show with the old CBS library music seeing as though they used a fair amount of it anyway through out the show. Again assuming the rights to the original music written for the show were unobtainable.

Doug

Gary16 · 06-30-2008, 09:37 AM

While I'm not in favor of anything that changes the original material, if CBS felt that mixing older tracks with new ones would be too jarring for us sophisticated dedicated fans of the show, why at the very least couldn't they have had Mark Heyes reorchestrate the original tracks that they knew they had the rights to and just compose new music for the questionable tracks? While there would still be objection to not using the original music as recorded back then, at least it would have been the same music newly recorded.

TravisR · 06-30-2008, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyFeldman

...all your doing basically is just saying whatever comes into your head, which is fine, because those who do know a little more are more reliable.

That's what everyone is doing because no one in this threads knows anything about the situation. There's some good guesses that are probably right but no one here truly knows what is happening so everyone is just saing whatever comes into their head.

jdee28 · 06-30-2008, 12:00 PM

Maybe the "significant delay" they refer to in their press release was on the order of four to five years. Maybe they didn't want to alienate people by having them wait that long; and people do get alienated; look at the fans of Taxi. But who knows. It would be nice if CBS/Paramount were more forthcoming, especially with whether or not the music replacements are the only way the last three seasons can ever be released on DVD.

I have doubts that CBS/Paramount will do or say much. Most likely, we'll probably see S.2, V.2 with the music replacements in December or next year, and that will be that, the end of the show on DVD, at least for a few years. They have other properties they can release. It's really unfortunate; we all would have liked to have seen the complete series released in original form, the sooner, the better. Now it looks like never, or if ever, it'll be a long, long ways away.

Professor Echo · 06-30-2008, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corey3rd

The Registry has nothing to do with dictating how a film on the list can be altered or presented by the copyright holders. It merely means the Library of Congress will do their best to keep an original release version of the film. And that doesn't insure that the LoC has a good 35mm copy. We tried to do a series with them of films on the list and it was amazing at what they didn't have available.

I stand corrected. I always thought the Registry was akin to a structure getting landmark status where it could not be inordinately altered, but obviously this was erroneous. Thanks for the clarification and correction!

Carabimero · 06-30-2008, 04:15 PM

Aassuming they were even suspecting a delay of decades, given the average life span and aging target audience, CBS probably would've just said "cancelled" rather than delayed. The wording would have actually been in their favor, suggesting that giving us something is better than giving us nothing. They did not suggest that at all, when they easily could have.

To believe even a majority of decisions in this industry are made according to some established procedural logic (or any logic at all for that matter) would not be my choice. I've seen some truly idiotic yet important decisions made in my entertainment career for no other reason than the person making them happened to have indigestion that day.

Sure, no one knows the facts. Still, I offer my post not as something that just "came into my head," but rather as an informed opinion after actually having heard (and recognized and documented) the first season alterations and endured getting a taste of the intent and character of second season alterations.

Joseph Bolus · 06-30-2008, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary16

While I'm not in favor of anything that changes the original material, if CBS felt that mixing older tracks with new ones would be too jarring for us sophisticated dedicated fans of the show, why at the very least couldn't they have had Mark Heyes reorchestrate the original tracks that they knew they had the rights to and just compose new music for the questionable tracks? While there would still be objection to not using the original music as recorded back then, at least it would have been the same music newly recorded.

Bingo!

This is my *major* beef with what CBS/Paramount did here. (And this is also the reason their official response is inadequate.)

There should be no question whatsoever that they own the Rugolo themes that were scored specifically for the show. Assuming that there really were legitimate reasons for undertaking the drastic measure of re-scoring every episode, why not at least use the Rugolo themes during the re-scoring??

I just don't get it ... *sigh*

Douglas Monce · 06-30-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph Bolus

Bingo!

This is my *major* beef with what CBS/Paramount did here. (And this is also the reason their official response is inadequate.)

There should be no question whatsoever that they own the Rugolo themes that were scored specifically for the show. Assuming that there really were legitimate reasons for undertaking the drastic measure of re-scoring every episode, why not at least use the Rugolo themes during the re-scoring??

I just don't get it ... *sigh*

If they don't have the rights to the original score, they also don't have the rights to the actual written music either. It would be no different if I used a song that I don't own, or simply made a new recording of a song I don't own. I still don't have the right to do it.

Remember that CBS/Paramount didn't produce this show, they inherited it with one of their acquisitions. It is quite possible that all of the ducks were not in a row with regard to the copyright maintenance when they got the show.

As the copyright company seems to be connected to United Artists, its quite possible that the legal paper trail to the music got lost when UA was broken up in the mid 1980s. Many things were lost at that point including some of UAs films which were allowed to slip into the public domain as a result of no one knowing which way was up with the company.

Doug

Gary16 · 06-30-2008, 09:54 PM

Why were they able to keep the original open and closing Rugolo theme music on the second season DVD and not the other Rugolo music within the show?

Douglas Monce · 06-30-2008, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary16

Why were they able to keep the original open and closing Rugolo theme music on the second season DVD and not the other Rugolo music within the show?

As I said before....

The rights to the theme maybe have been held by ABC, as was often the case with TV theme songs. Where as the score its self would have been held the publisher that the composer had a relationship with. This would give ABC a free hand to license the theme to band leaders who may want to create a popular record with it. (and in fact some did)

Doug