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Home Theater Forum > Entertainment and Media > SD DVD - Film and Documentary
[ Donner Superman 2 SE (merged thread) ]

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Old 08-05-2004, 01:32 PM   #181 of 2287
Jon Hertzberg
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And for those unfamiliar with Lester aside from this rather ugly Superman affair, he has amassed quite an impressive collection of credits over the years, and is really quite a different director than Donner. While a film like Superman obviously plays more to Donner's strengths as a director, I would argue that Lester's best films are more significant than anything in Donner's oeuvre. However, I do think Donner was the better man for this job, will always remain a devotee of the film, and also long for Donner's vision of Superman II to see the light of day.

Lester is certainly no hack, as he is often portrayed when the discussion turns to Superman, and he's definitely not "no-frills." He directed his share of duds, but he also gave us the masterful Petulia, the deservedly beloved Hard Day's Night and Help!, the underrated Robin and Marian, and the delightful first two Musketeers films.

And, believe it or not, he is an American expat who has spent most of his adult life in Britain.

-Jon
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Old 08-05-2004, 01:52 PM   #182 of 2287
James Phillips
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It's all rather convoluted.


That's putting it mildly, OO7!
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Old 08-05-2004, 02:03 PM   #183 of 2287
Grant H
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I know I'm tired of watching Superman reveal his identity by TRIPPING ON A BEAR RUG!!! Ugh.


In all fairness, is Superman not realizing that no bullet came out of a gun any better? This is a guy who can catch them afterall. Realistically, he'd have just repeated the Clark Kent faint thing from S1 if he wanted to protect his identity. So, part of him had to have wanted to reveal his identity to Lois either way--whether it was doing his Superman invulnerablility pose over a blank or tripping over a rug in Clark Kent mode and grabbing his glasses out of the fire to conceal his features.

I honestly can't tell you whether or not I would prefer the Donner scene. I think the theatrical version is pretty heartwarming and possibly one of my favorite scenes in the film along with the "Would you care to step outside" line.

Pretty sure Donner would scrap some stuff that may be genuinely better than his footage just to up his percentage of footage.

So, chances are I'd never get a film that I was 100% satisfied with.


My midis bring all the Force to the yard; my midis are better than yours!
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Old 08-05-2004, 03:44 PM   #184 of 2287
AlexCosmo
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I'm a big fan of Lester's. "No-frills" only referred to his economical, fast methods. It bugs me seeing the Musketeer movies as they are though. They never should have been split in two, there's too much padding. For such a pioneer of snappy editing, he can't be too crazy about that. As for a Superman 2 DVD, would it cost any more than the Superman 1 restoration? Wouldn't they just use the effects shots from Lester's version? Or is that 2-3 million figure for legal hassles?
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Old 08-05-2004, 03:52 PM   #185 of 2287
Drew Reiber
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[quote]
Quote:
As for a Superman 2 DVD, would it cost any more than the Superman 1 restoration? Wouldn't they just use the effects shots from Lester's version?

I doubt it. Some of the sfx in the Lester version isn't even finished, look at the frozen Washington, DC footage at the end. Brrrrr. Anyway, one of my biggest beefs is the Fortress of Solitude transformation sequence that reuses outtakes from Superman I that have since been restored to that film anyway. Also, I don't believe the post-production on Donner's footage is anywhere near complete.

Quote:
Or is that 2-3 million figure for legal hassles?


Well, even if they can find a way to get the rights to Brando's footage, they're going to have to pay his estate.
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Old 08-05-2004, 04:00 PM   #186 of 2287
Drew Reiber
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I haven't read one article that suggests that Lester went on record to say that he took credit for the Donner footage, although he has undermined his work a little by saying a lot of that footage was shot by the 2nd unit.


Read the one that I linked and called "BULL$#^@!" or some such nonsense. He states that even the shot lists he checked only gave Donner credit for 12% of the footage when he came on to 2. That's an outright lie. If 2nd Unit shot anything, it might have been the stunt work with Lois falling out the building or some of the exterior work near the Fortress. However, we know Donner shot the original Daily Planet opening, the original identity revelation sequence at the hotel, the Brando sequence(s), the prison sequences, the Luthor/Fortress footage, the White House sequence, the Daily Planet/Luthor/Zod footage, the Zod/Superman/Lois/Luthor footage and who knows what else (the Moon sequence?). That's the majority of the frickin' movie!!!!!

Either he's claiming that most of *his* own cut is second unit, or he's taking credit for Donner's footage. Either way, he's got no credibility as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 08-06-2004, 01:03 AM   #187 of 2287
David_Blackwell
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If they restore the Donner version, how come I have a feeling this will take up to $5 million to restore (and to cover clearnces and pay off Brando's estate too) due to some of the unfinished effects (which would be handled by CGI effects like the same approach of using CGI to improve effects shots and finish shots like with the Star Trek: The Motion Picture Special Edition).



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Old 08-06-2004, 01:15 AM   #188 of 2287
Drew Reiber
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(which would be handled by CGI effects like the same approach of using CGI to improve effects shots and finish shots like with the Star Trek: The Motion Picture Special Edition).


What really blew me away about the Star Trek restoration was how they retro-designed the new special effects. The style really fit the movie well and didn't seem out-of-place or contemporary (beyond the late 70's). Very impressive.
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Old 08-06-2004, 02:52 AM   #189 of 2287
Dharmesh C
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Quote:
Read the one that I linked and called "BULL$#^@!" or some such nonsense. He states that even the shot lists he checked only gave Donner credit for 12% of the footage when he came on to 2. That's an outright lie. If 2nd Unit shot anything, it might have been the stunt work with Lois falling out the building or some of the exterior work near the Fortress. However, we know Donner shot the original Daily Planet opening, the original identity revelation sequence at the hotel, the Brando sequence(s), the prison sequences, the Luthor/Fortress footage, the White House sequence, the Daily Planet/Luthor/Zod footage, the Zod/Superman/Lois/Luthor footage and who knows what else (the Moon sequence?).

Yep, he shot the moon sequence, too.

It comes to about 65-70% of the picture.



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Old 08-06-2004, 04:52 AM   #190 of 2287
Dave Simkiss
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