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Old 06-08-2003, 05:39 PM   #1 of 72
Brian Tatnall
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Hello everyone,

I'm going to be buying a DIY setup this summer and I'm running into hundreds of options, but I have narrowed it down some. I have around $800 right now.

Which setup would any of you do?

Adire Setup
F: KIT281 (vented)
R: KIT81
C: LCC or KIT81C
S: Unknown

GR Research
F: A/V3 or A/V1+
R: A/V3 or A/V1+
C: A/V1+
S: Unknown

I will be building this system overtime and I am able to purchase the center channel and fronts only at first.

I already have a few opinions, but I just want to hear what everyone has to say. This will be my first DIY in HT (Car audio addict for a few years).

If anyone has other suggestions I would appreciate them also. I suggestion has been the new Stryke S series that can be found HERE With this setup I could afford to get all 5 speakers and a sub at the same time.

Thanks all,
Brian
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Old 06-08-2003, 07:34 PM   #2 of 72
Dan Wesnor
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I've built the Kit 81 and used GR's woofs in my own designs, and there's no comparison between the quality of the midrange in the GR woofers and Adire AV-8. The GR woofers sound much, much better.

The only thing the Adire kits have going for them is powerful low-end, but if you're adding a sub anyway, who cares?


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Old 06-08-2003, 09:01 PM   #3 of 72
Brian Tatnall
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Thanks for the reply Dan!

This is the kind of information I am wanting, but I am left saddened by it. "No comparison" is a mighty statment. I want my low end extension and quality midrage too. What has been the maximum low end that the GR woofers have give you? How do the woofers compare looking at output?

I have trouble getting away from the sheer displacement advantage the AV8 has with more Sd and a great Xmax. It would take nearly two M-130's to keep up.

I could not find a 'bad' review of any Adire Kit and I couldn't find a 'bad' one about the GR kit either. At LDSG the Adire kits generally have ** and the GR's have *** and I was wondering why. I guess this is the reason.

I took some time to look at your site (and all the links your site points to). Very nice! Would you suggest a kit at all or could you 'tutor' me through a design .

Thanks
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Old 06-08-2003, 09:47 PM   #4 of 72
Dan Wesnor
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The AV-8 has a very nasty bump at 2kHz which is difficult to tame. It is quite audible, especially since Adire's designs cross to the tweeter right on top of it.

For low-end extension and quality midrange, you'd want a ScanSpeak woofer. If they're worked right, they sound wonderful. But you can't get 5 speakers for $800. Dennis Murphy has a design using the Usher woofer that should be pretty good, but that still might be out of your price range.

I would definitely suggest a kit - it takes several months of hard work to learn to design a pair of speakers from scratch.

I have never heard Danny's designs with the GR's, but having used the M130 woofer, I am impressed by it. Its only fault is that it doesn't move much air. From what I've read about his designs, they are very good. And this is from other designers, not reviewers. So even though I've never heard them, I am comfortable recommending them.

I've only used the woofers in sealed boxes, which I prefer. Sealed, they will roll off at about 85Hz, which would blend almost perfectly with a subwoofer.

Other designs I recommend you look at are Dennis Murphy's and Rick Craig's (www.selahaudio.com - you'll have to e-mail him). Both have an excellent reputation. If you have more budget, Geoff Dillon's designs are highly acclaimed (www.dillonacoustics.com)

And, of course, I could also recommend my speakers, the Models 1, 2, and 3 (in that order). I don't normally push them on people, because as far as I know, I'm the only one who's heard them.


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Old 06-09-2003, 03:31 AM   #5 of 72
Chris Tsutsui
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I was in the same boat as you Brian, and I remember reading that somebody was able to compare Kits281s with AV-3s and found the Av-3s to be better which is why I chose the AV-3s.

On July 14th, I'll be able to A/B compare my AV-3 sonicaps (GR-165 drivers) to the Kit281s in a comparison and there'll be plenty of other people who can post the difference if you're not in a rush.

I have compared the AV-1+ (GR M130 non-sonicaps) to the AV-3 Sonicaps. For detail, I like the AV-1+ which will have a slight edge and show more subtle sounds. The AV-3s have a fuller sound and can sound rather full without a sub.
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Old 06-09-2003, 06:15 AM   #6 of 72
Bob Bartlett
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I'll second selahaudio.com. All of his projects are not listed on his site. You can email him for info. I built the RC2 and have been more than pleased and they are reasonably priced to.
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Old 06-09-2003, 09:23 AM   #7 of 72
Anthony_Gomez
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Chris, JUNE 14th. This Saturday


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Old 06-09-2003, 12:45 PM   #8 of 72
Danny Richie
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Not to get into the comparisons, you guys can make those, but to follow up with some related info based on some of what was said.

At the LDSG site the *** are based on positive feedback received about XYZ kit. It is not a rating based on performance.

Quote:
I have compared the AV-1+ (GR M130 non-sonicaps) to the AV-3 Sonicaps. For detail, I like the AV-1+ which will have a slight edge and show more subtle sounds. The AV-3s have a fuller sound and can sound rather full without a sub.


I agree, and this is what pushed the development of the new M-130/16.

This is a new 16 ohm version of the beloved M-130 woofer.

It is used in the new A/V-3.

It offers an 8 ohm speaker in an MTM floor stander (no stands needed) with the speed and detail of the A/V-1+ and with the lower bass extension of the A/V-3 (using larger 6.5" woofers).

The pair of 5.25" woofers have a tightly controlled bass thanks to the loading of the transmission line enclosure, with a -3db of 40Hz. This is pretty low for a 5.25" woofer and matches the low end extension of many larger woofers, while still being capable of producing speed and detail that is quite difficult to match with a larger driver.

By comparison the pair of M-130/16's have right at 28 sq. in. of surface area (Sd) while a single 6" woofer has about 21 to 22 sq. in. and a single 8" woofer has about 33-31 sq. in.

And as an update for all of those that have been asking:

The new M130/16's have now arrived in Dallas and if all goes well they will be picked up tomorrow. So the new woofers will be available for shipping later this week. I know a lot of people have been waiting patiently for them to get here, including myself, so orders for them can be filled soon.
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Old 06-09-2003, 01:10 PM   #9 of 72
Allen Ross
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good news



Member and Founder of the \"Its Never to Big or too Loud to have in a Dorm Club\"
Everyone in college should have a 9 cuft Tempest in their closest!
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Old 06-09-2003, 02:06 PM   #10 of 72
Brian Fellmeth
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I have never heard an 81/281. but I can verify that the GR 130 is a first rate woofer and an incredible performer at the $24 price point.
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