More Research Asserts that Blu Ray Adoption Isn't Apt to Surge - Page 4

Goko · 05-18-2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce

I have to agree that all the talk about the economy is much ado about nothing. It is really being pushed by a media that describes everything as a crisis. Frankly its hog wash.
Doug

I read your statement to my wife (she does the weekly shopping) and her comment was, "what planet does he live on."
I have to spend several minutes calming my wife down after each trip to Walmart for the groceries and listening to how much this has gone up or how that has nearly doubled in price!

On a more personal note, the discount theater that I regularly attend has recently raised their prices from $1 to $1.25 for the first raise in 5 years and the popcorn has gone from $4.50 to $5.50. Outrageous!!!

troy evans · 05-18-2008, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Crawford

It's not that simple nor does the state of the economy play a small part and many people have reduced their discretionary spending despite them buying an iPhone or new display.

Well, you also have to look at things like GTA 4 selling more than any other media in it's first week at $60 a pop. When that stuff happens it's hard to swallow the "BD discs are too expensive" line. As I said earlier economy for some may be a very real factor. That would apply to anything though, and Yet people still go to movies and eat out and so on. If were talking discretionary spending then you would think people would scale this back as well.

Edwin-S · 05-18-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troy evans

Well, you also have to look at things like GTA 4 selling more than any other media in it's first week at $60 a pop. When that stuff happens it's hard to swallow the "BD discs are too expensive" line.

Comparing video game sales to movie sales is apples to oranges. Video games are interactive and movies are passive. People are willing to pay more for the interactivity of video games. GTA is also a special case. There was a pent up demand for a new installment from gamers who had played previous incarnations of the game. The same cannot be said of movies.

Rachael B · 05-18-2008, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwin-S

Comparing video game sales to movie sales is apples to oranges. Video games are interactive and movies are passive. People are willing to pay more for the interactivity of video games. GTA is also a special case. There was a pent up demand for a new installment from gamers who had played previous incarnations of the game. The same cannot be said of movies.

Aren't they trying to make BD's more interactive like video games? The Master And Commander BD I viewed had a bunch of inter-acting junk on it. I could of chosen to have been informed where on the map the H.M.S. Suprise was as it journeyed along. I don't want my movies made into game-like thangs, especially at the expense of BD-Java which eliminates the Resume function of my players.

Douglas Monce · 05-18-2008, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goko

I read your statement to my wife (she does the weekly shopping) and her comment was, "what planet does he live on."
I have to spend several minutes calming my wife down after each trip to Walmart for the groceries and listening to how much this has gone up or how that has nearly doubled in price!

On a more personal note, the discount theater that I regularly attend has recently raised their prices from $1 to $1.25 for the first raise in 5 years and the popcorn has gone from $4.50 to $5.50. Outrageous!!!

I didn't say that prices hadn't gone up, I said they aren't anywhere near all time highs when adjusted for inflation. Even the price of gas isn't as high, when adjusted, as it was in 1982.

I guess a lot of you don't remember the 70s when we were REALLY in a recession. When unemployment was around 8.5% and taxes were taking almost 50% of your income.

Walmart recently reported that while sales were off for about 2 months in the winter, that their sales were right back up to normal levels last month. Ford last month reported a profit for the first quarter of 2008. Ford has been in the red for something like 18 months. So SOMEONE must be spending money.

Doug

Edwin-S · 05-18-2008, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rachael B

Aren't they trying to make BD's more interactive like video games? The Master And Commander BD I viewed had a bunch of inter-acting junk on it. I could of chosen to have been informed where on the map the H.M.S. Suprise was as it journeyed along. I don't want my movies made into game-like thangs, especially at the expense of BD-Java which eliminates the Resume function of my players.

To me, the meaning of the word "interactivity" is different in regards to movies and video games. Video games are interactive in the sense that you, as the player, directly effect the outcomes that occur throughout the game. In movies, interactivity means controlling a series of features that are supposed to give further insight into the film; however, a person has no effect on the outcome of the movie. It is still essentially a passive activity while a video game requires considerably more audience participation to move a story or events forward.

Interactivity with a movie is voluntary. If the participant chooses not to use an interactive feature there is no detrimental effect. You can still watch the film. Video game inteactivity is mandatory. No audience participation means no progression.

That is why, to me, interactive features are not a good excuse for higher prices on BD discs. Interactivity does not add any particular value to the act of watching a movie, so why pay more for it? In fact, from some of the complaints I have read, interactivity during a film actual reduces the enjoyment of watching a film because a person is taken out of the film by the need to perform some action for little actual gain.

The biggest strength of movies is passive participation. A well made movie with a good story causes a person to fully invest in the experience. The participant gets fully absorbed into the experience and can even lose track of time while watching. In that environment, "interactivity" is a bad thing.

Douglas Monce · 05-18-2008, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwin-S

To me, the meaning of the word "interactivity" is different in regards to movies and video games. Video games are interactive in the sense that you, as the player, directly effect the outcomes that occur throughout the game. In movies, interactivity means controlling a series of features that are supposed to give further insight into the film; however, a person has no effect on the outcome of the movie. It is still essentially a passive activity while a video game requires considerably more audience participation to move a story or events forward.

Interactivity with a movie is voluntary. If the participant chooses not to use an interactive feature there is no detrimental effect. You can still watch the film. Video game inteactivity is mandatory. No audience participation means no progression.

That is why, to me, interactive features are not a good excuse for higher prices on BD discs. Interactivity does not add any particular value to the act of watching a movie, so why pay more for it? In fact, from some of the complaints I have read, interactivity during a film actual reduces the enjoyment of watching a film because a person is taken out of the film by the need to perform some action for little actual gain.

The biggest strength of movies is passive participation. A well made movie with a good story causes a person to fully invest in the experience. The participant gets fully absorbed into the experience and can even lose track of time while watching. In that environment, "interactivity" is a bad thing.

A good video game should also provide you with at least 10 or 20 hours of unique game play, not to mention re playability, making the $50 price a much better value in comparison.

Doug

EricW · 05-18-2008, 05:45 PM

the bottom line for me is, that the general public just does not value an upgrade in PQ enough to get new equipment (and more importantly, learning how to use it).

PaulDA · 05-19-2008, 11:40 AM

This argument just goes round and round. If a majority of people think that buying an HD display automatically gives them an HD picture (and many surveys show that people think just that) AND you have 50 or more SD DVD players with 1080p in giant lettering/numbering all over the boxes claiming to "upgrade your regular DVDs to high definition" (you've all seen such packaging) AND you have salespeople reinforcing that lie (because that is what it is--and I've argued with several people until I was blue in the face that their player did NOT make SD DVD into high definition, that in fact that was IMPOSSIBLE, but to no avail--and these are people I know, not strangers) AND the fact that even fewer people care about properly set up audio than they do video AND that the principle reason they buy HD displays is for a BIGGER picture and a smaller profile TV--NOT to enjoy the "subtle" (and don't kid yourselves, to most people, it is subtle, particularly under 50 inches) improvment in PQ (remember, they think their display automatically gives them HD for TV and their 50$ "upconverting" DVD player is transforming their SD DVDs into high definition).

(I know, a run-on sentence, but I did it to make a point)

Factor in ALL the above (leave out the economy if you wish, but for most people, it most certainly IS a factor because the majority PERCEIVES the economy to be going badly--regardless of its actual state) and it should be quite clear that Blu-ray faces an uphill battle. I certainly hope it becomes the standard as I appreciate all it brings--but I am equipped and informed enough to do so and I care about it. These are not generally shared by the broad public.

And consider that I (quite without unnecesary boasting) am more knowledgeable of and sensitive to PQ and SQ issues than, conservatively, 95% of the general public but when I wander in here and elsewhere I find people complaining about "glaring errors" that I don't even notice (or wouldn't if I didn't read about them in here--and even then, I find the "errors/flaws", in the overwhelming majority of cases, to be rather minor--certainly not the "omg I can't watch such dreck/the film is ruined/etc." that gets expressed by some people in fora like this one). That just adds an additional layer of complication.

Michael Reuben · 05-19-2008, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce

I have to agree that all the talk about the economy is much ado about nothing. It is really being pushed by a media that describes everything as a crisis. Frankly its hog wash.

If you look at the actual numbers, with the exception of fuel prices, nothing else is at all time highs when adjusted for inflation. Even the price of gas was higher in 1982 when adjusted.

I like the way you've managed to "adjust" inflation and the erosion of purchasing power right out of the picture. But you forgot the other half. Adjust the average wage for inflation as well. Now factor in the debt load carried by the average American today vs. 20 years ago.

The media isn't fabricating a crisis so much as catching up late with a story that's been brewing for some time. Here's a reliable indicator. When a major Wall Street financial firm collapses, the crisis is probably real. In the late 80s, it was Drexel. Currently it's Bear Stearns.

M.