When do you give up on a old car?

Michael Silla · 05-09-2003, 02:54 PM

At what point do you consider giving up on an old(er) car? I haven't really been in this situation until recently. I have owned my '97 Nissan 200 SX SE-R since it was new. Taken care of it well (oil changes every 3000 miles + regular maintenance).

In return it has given me mostly trouble free motoring, never leaving me stranded until yesterday. That is when the envitable happened. My clutch failed. In a big way. 96,430 miles were on the odometer.

The amazing thing is that the clutch plate still has grab to it. I'm getting the whole assembly replaced, plus the starter and a unrelated problem with the emergency brake cable fixed all for about $1000 (plus the rental).

What got me posting this thread is that although this bill seems "reasonable" I can see myself perhaps having to replace the shocks/struts in the future too although they seem to be holding up well considering the cars age. I don't even know how much that bill would be.

My long term goal is to not have a car payment for awhile (read: 3 years) so that I can get some furniture and take care of some other bills.

What I'd like to know is what makes more financial sense to you? Minimally fix the car and trade it into the dealer, take a loss and get something new or newer? Or swallow the bill and move on and hope no more major bills come in the next 3 years?

I probably put nearly 25-30,000 miles on my car each year, most of it highway driving (My commute is 67 miles round trip).

Michael.

Brian Perry · 05-09-2003, 03:18 PM

You have to figure that a new $20,000 car is going to cost you $300+ per month (at 0% financing) so chances are that you'd be better off keeping your old car for a while. I'd say replace it if you end up with a repair bill over $3,000.

Jeff Hoak · 05-09-2003, 03:21 PM

First of all, I'm a Nissan fan and driver (95 Pathfinder 141K miles). I'd have to do a count but I think the Pathfinder is my 5th 6th Nissan (Datsun).

Most Nissans run for 150K to 200K with very little service needed. This assumes good care and regular maintenance. There are however things that wear out. Clutch's are one of those things. They also seem to eat water pumps about every 100K miles.

If you figure a new $25K car at 0% with 10% down you're looking at a payment of ~$375 per month. Even if you budget 4 of those payments to be spent every year on your old car (a total of $1500) that's still $3000 a year you've got to spend on paying bills and buying furniture. Over the course of 3 years... $9000.

At my house we make payments on 2 paid for cars (the Pathfinder and a 90 Miata). The payments go into the savings account. On the rare occasions that we do need service beyond my mechanical abilities the money is there without blowing a giant hole in the budget. If either one of them should die or we should stumble accross the "deal od a lifetime" we've got the funds to jump on it. Both of our cars were just such deals.

Keep the Nissan and drive it till it drops dead.

Bill Wise · 05-09-2003, 03:56 PM

Michael,

I'm with Brian and Jeff. While I'm no particular fan of Nissan, I always try to look at it from the standpoint of, "What can I get that I'll like as much for the same money?" I say drive it 'til the wheels fall off.

Regards,

Bill

Malcolm R · 05-09-2003, 04:09 PM

Fix it and keep motorin'. If you've taken that good care of it with regular maintenance, and most of your miles are highway, there's still a lot of life in 'er.

**HTF Ads**

05-09-2003, 04:10 PM

I agree with the others with one caveat: You should probably replace the water pump and timing belt at 100K miles (meaning NOW). This isn't cheap, but amortized over the length of time you'd like to go without a payment, it's still a bargain. If you decide to keep the car without replacing the water pump and timing belts, I think you're asking for trouble.

My car is 15 years old (had it since new), and I just can't imagine not fixing whatever goes wrong with it. Buying a new (or even used) car would be WAY more expensive than fixing my old one. I've saved so much in car payments that the occasional (and thankfully rare) $1700 repair bill doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Ryan Wright · 05-09-2003, 04:12 PM

Quote:

I can see myself perhaps having to replace the shocks/struts in the future too although they seem to be holding up well considering the cars age. I don't even know how much that bill would be.

~$300.

Quote:

Or swallow the bill and move on and hope no more major bills come in the next 3 years?

Even if they do, what's the problem?

Let's say the engine blows up tomorrow. It's going to cost you $3k to replace it. What then?

Well, you can look at a few ways:

1. The car is worth >=$3k, you'd be putting more money into it than it's worth.

2. On the other hand, it's $3k vs. $20k. Do the math. One is obviously much more expensive.

So it really comes down to what YOU want. If you're asking us, "What's the cheapest way to get by?" - fix your car. And fix it again, and again, and again, every time you have a problem with it. It will always be cheaper than buying a new car.

A new car is good if:

1. You don't mind spending a ton of money.
2. You can't budget for repairs and would rather pay a fixed ~$300 per month than get a $700 bill after x months of hassle-free driving.
3. You're just tired of your old car and want a change.

Dave Gorman · 05-09-2003, 04:40 PM

I gave up on the old one after 6 months averaging $250/mo in repairs. I suppose the $250/mo itself isn't bad, but having a vehicle that could break down at the drop of a hat, having to get rides from & to the shop, having to have the beast towed, etc. etc., was all enough for me to call it quits.

Michael Silla · 05-09-2003, 05:23 PM

Thanks guys!

Dave:

My SE-R hasn't reached that point yet. I'm trying thinking *positive* thoughts here

Ryan,

Thanks for your candor. it really is that simple. Thinking about it this afternoon I realize how much money I could waste going the new car route - especially considering that it probably isn't needed. It's true that I am partially sick of the car and would greatly enjoy a new Maxima (I can dream

) but alas those payments would bust my ass and for what?

Brian,

The SR20DE has a chain driven timing belt that *should* never need replacement. The other belts in there that are rubber will be replaced shortly. I never thought about the water pump though - I investigate that further.

Jeff,

That is an awesome plan! I have been "meaning" to do the same thing but after buying my home a couple of years ago I have had a harder time "getting ahead." One of my solutions was to hold onto this car for a lot longer than I expected. I hope that they 2007 model lineup with have something exciting (Read Mits Lancer Evo exciting

) in it.

Make mine Yellow.

Michael.

05-09-2003, 06:52 PM

Good news about the chain-drive timing. The main thing is to avoid having the timing belt break while the engine is running. That ruins most engines, but it sounds like you don't have to worry about that.

The water pump isn't nearly as critical. As long as you shut off the engine before it melts, having the water pump go out while you're driving does not harm the car. It will leave you stranded, though.

Most engines are built so that the water pump must be removed to access the timing belt, so replacing both at once - even though only one may need replacing - is generally a good, cost-consolidating, peace-of-mind-enhancing thing to do.

Quote:

you'd be putting more money into it than it's worth.

I think I do that every time I fill up the tank!

Even so, if I didn't really like my car (and I really, really do), I wouldn't have kept it as long as I have. There are good, miserly reasons for making a car last forever, but I believe car ownership should be an enjoyable experience, too. Some cars, alas, just aren't worth it. In the end, I hope you do what you want. But if you want to save money, "drive it 'till the wheels fall off" is by far the best advice. In fact, put the wheels back on and drive it longer, if you can.