Re: Color treatment (BD releases)
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Originally Posted by John Stuart
I was saying by looking at those images, the BD release have a more red skin color in all actors at the same time... and not only that, stuffs in scenario like walls and Eastwood's hat have also the same tone applied... the hat is darker on DVD, the walls are normal, and the list goes on. It seems they have painted everything using the same red tone/colour.
How can we be sure all BD releases are not having the same issue (if it's an issue, please feel free to correct me). More than that, all reviewers are looking exactly for them? I was told the Godfather collection was great, but judging by the pictures I saw, it seems the colours were boosted sometimes.
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There are several things going on here.
First of all, Blu-ray uses a different colorspace than DVD. It's not significantly different, but depending on the playback and capture software on the PC used for the screengrabs, the colors may be affected. Some reviewers do it right, some don't.
Second of all, different masters can be used by the studios with different levels of approval by those involved in the film. Without direct confirmation from them, it's hard to know which is the "correct" version. In the case of
Godfather, however, we know that the Blu-ray release was overseen by the cinematographer and a few other members of the original crew, and therefore we can be reasonably sure that the changes were meant to represent the intended look of the film. After seeing different versions of the film for several years, you can get used to the DVD as being the "correct" version, but when the person responsible for determining the look of the film (and not necessarily the director *cough* Lucas *cough) says it's spot on, I'll believe them.
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| The Matrix (Ultimate DVD and BD releases) is now presented with a green tone (?) in some scenes that wasn't there before. Not that I like the old release, which is awful compared to the new ones. But c'mon, that green tone was there when we saw the theatrical version? Isn't dangerous to accept all those modifications with no hesitation, no research to find out how much the image/audio from the movie was changed in that process? |
Not sure what you mean here.
The Matrix film was different in the initial DVD release because they didn't originally think to make an obvious differentiation between the settings. For the new release (including the Blu-ray), the filmmakers went back and recolored the scenes set in the Matrix to both define the look of that setting, and to match the look of the sequels. IIRC all of this was stated before the release, so it wasn't as if they were just foisting this on us.
And, of course, the idea behind "theatrical" viewing is for the most part flawed. Unless you had the chance to view a pristine print on a well-calibrated projector system from the optimal distance at a correctly light-controlled theater
and have a photographic memory, then you have only a general idea of the look of the film. I can't think of more than a handful of theaters in the world, most of which are single-screen locations for premieres in places like LA, NYC, London, etc., that could accurately represent the film exactly as it was intended. You certainly wouldn't be able to see it that way at your average gazillion-screen multiplexes, or even classic 65mm/70mm-capable locations like DC's Uptown. And even then, you'd have to depend on memory, which for almost everyone is imperfect at best for the movie itself, let alone things like contrast and color timing.
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| How can you say which one is right? Isn't there someone comparing old masters (from VHS/LD/and even broadcast) with all these releases? To at least see what they changed and we are now accepting gracefully? |
Like I said above, if we have input from those who know how the image is supposed to look, then it's reasonable to say that they know which one is right. But nobody outside the owners/distributors of the film has access to the masters, original or otherwise, so people can only compare the final product. There are a few enthusiasts and reviewers that do those comparisons.
But if you're asking why we don't have any comparisons
before the product is mastered, transferred, and encoded, well I'm not sure why you'd think we'd get that chance. Movies, just like pretty much every product being manufactured, are available to us only as consumers. It's not as if the consumer test drives cars before they hit the assembly line, or test drugs before they leave the labs. Just like movies being transferred to home video, those are all done by the companies themselves, and maybe the occasional government agency. And given that the perception of that movie by someone who didn't work on it is going to be subjective based on a variety of influences (like the all-but-certain-to-be-imperfect "theatrical" experience above), to say nothing of the fact that everyone sees a film differently, I'm not sure how useful this would be.
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| I am far from being an expert in this area, but I feel someone should address those differences (especially when it comes to the original audio tracks), and I was once told everytime they release a movie into a different media, it will have to be different (they will never be the same), they just need to be restored into one acceptable margin and that should be fine. |
Well, as you yourself put it, how can
we know what's the margin for "acceptable?" There are a ton of technical and economic factors that can affect the different media that make it virtually impossible to have the same exact look across every single one of those media types, such as the aforementioned colorspace differences, or the rights to the film changing over time or between countries.
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| I am not saying either the old masters were better than the new ones - perhaps something between will suffice. But once again, aren't we accepting anything that is delivered these days? |
I'm a little confused here. Who's saying that? After all, the very existence of these boards and the debate on them seems to refute the idea that we're accepting anything that's delivered.