Is there anamorphic full screen??

I realize the title here is an oxymoron, but was wondering why it is,( how can I describe this?,,) All my anamorphicwidescreen movies that playback thru hdmi or component video jacks default to my Sony 46 16x9 TV by filling the entire screen with aspect ratio of 1:66 to 1:85 by displaying the signal to 1:78.1 .(16x9 or 16 divided by nine = 1.78 ). My TV has 4 video 'zoom' sizes. 1.Normal, 2. Full, 3.Zoom ,4. Wide zoom . When I play back a non anamorphic widescreen signal ie. TCM movie channel on regular cable, the widescreen image is boxed., and the setting for my TV is Normal., Now I can now use Full, which will fill the screen to almost 16:9 ratio and even though the image is NOT anamorphic, the image looks a bit squeezed, ( and the zoom wide zoom feature will totally stretch the image to unwatchable.). When I watch a regular cable channel that is 4:3 , under the Normal setting ( and don't forget this all under the HDMI/component jacks), the image now has black pillars on each under this setting. All my anamorphic DVD and HiDEF TV will not display under 'Normal' only Full ., .

Now back to my question in the topic line,:
If I play back a 'near new' DVD of say, WB 1938 version 2 disc of Adventures of Robin Hood , or the two disc version of Citizen Kane, both these films are 'full screen' or 1:33 films, yet my TV refuses to play them under the 'Normal setting', only the Full setting., so I'm wondering if the studios have placed the image in centre of a 1:78 black screen with the image in the centre, (with built in black pillars.)., Kinda like what you would see if you were watching a High Definition sports cable channel that is broadcast in 1:78 but when the program displays a 1:33 image they insert red pillars on each side of the program continues in 1:78 but the 'old' footage that is not widescreen and they compensate for the image by building in these pillars. Did Warner Bros build in Black Pillars for an anamorphic full screen image ???????????

whew.. I hope I got that out in recognisable language.....

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

The TITANIC collector's edition DVD featured "anamorphic 1.33:1" video for its interview segments, so they had the borders on the sides of the screen while watching on a 16:9 screen. Some DVDs also feature widescreen menus that are set to fill a 4:3 TV without borders, as well as display in its full size on a 16:9 TV.

No idea if it's ever been applied to a film itself.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

DVDs aren't normally AFAIK "windowboxed" (4:3 picture sidepanelled to 16:9). I know for a fact that Adventures Of Robin Hood is a standard 4:3 transfer, so any windowboxing is being generated by your player.

Standard DVDs (even anamorphic ones) put out a picture that is naturally 4:3, but carry a signal that tells the tv to distort the picture to the correct 16:9. With a 16:9 set, the tv stretches the picture horizontally, where a 4:3 set discards about 25% of the picture information vertically.

Sets capable of handling an HDMI or high definition component signal treat things slightly differently. IIRC, the picture will leave the player already stretched to 16:9 as that's the native shape of an HD picture. A 4:3 picture will have windowboxes either side to make it 16:9. Your tv receives a picture down the HDMI or Component feed and automatically assumes it is a 16:9 picture and shows it in "full" mode. If the picture was switched to "Normal" it would look vertically squeezed and have black side bars.

It's just the different way HD televisions and compatible players work together.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

I never said the Robin Hood movie or video was windowboxed.,, but black pillars only.. But your other point,,.... let me say older standard dvd that are 4:3 in my collection such as.. say 1997 's Hooper does not make my TV go to Full but to Normal, on my TV's video settings.. I know it seems weird.., But I was just wondering in this Post, if the studios 'could bring out full screen' movies with built in black pillars such as the Hi def TV stations do with some of their broadcasts that don't fill the screen, and they 'dummy the sides' with black pillars, ..could studios do this with their own releases?,, therefore makiong the image just a bit easier on the eyes.. and also therefore 'triggering' my HiDEF anamorphic TV into thinking the DVD playback is 'anamorphic 16x9' but the standard image in question has 'built-in black pillars on each side of the 4:3 image??

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Plus, I forgot to read/respond in your post., I cannot 'switch to Normal., Normal has been 'deactivated' because the HDMI or componant presumes it is fullscreen., ( where if I switched to channel three instead of the other inputs I would always have normal including anamorophic widescreen ( window boxed)..

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

The only example of an anamorphic enhancement to a 1.33:1 film that I can think of offhand is "The Sorcerer's Apprentice" segment from the original FANTASIA which plays in the anamorphically enhanced FANTASIA 2000.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

A lot of the Charlie Chan DVDs from Fox have anamorphically enhanced featurettes that include brief clips from the movies with black pillars automatically included on the sides, so the picture isn't stretched out. So yes, I guess it exists. But... does it improve the visual quality of the films? I don't think so but I'd rather someone else take a look and make a judgment.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Well as has been pointed out, Std. Def. video is 4x3, & old academy movies are 4x3, so there's no need for any kind of black bars (on the blu-ray "Adventures Of Robin Hood" there will be a 4x3 picture in the middle of the 16:9 screen with black bars down each side). I've probably missed something here.

My Sony 32" widescreen has five viewing modes:

zoom 14:9 = non-anamorphic
zoom 16:9 = non-anamorphic
normal for 4x3 progs.
smart 4x3 progs. stretched out at the edges to fill the screen (& blown up a bit)
Wide = anamorphic progs.

I can only think that the HDMI input by-passes this lot?

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

actually after all these weeks I finally found or thought of a title that is exactly what I have been trying to describe in my opening thread,.
The third special features disc of UCE 'HTWWW' is called Cinerama Adventure and about 80% of the running time (of 97 minutes) is devoted to 1:33 aspect ratio footage.. (with black pillars on each side of the center frame)..
BUT when the documentary cuts away to the featured Cinerama 'footage' the image 'automatically reverts to 2:89.1' in anamorphic widescreen .
So the implication here would have to be:
The disc in question contains both anamorphic properties(widescreen/full screen) that can play the 'two' sized aspect ratios? Seems the answer is yes. Normally a disc would not be 'authored' to be anamorphic if only the image is 1:33, ..BUT since this disc in question contains two types of ratios the answer to my first post about Adventures of Robin Hood and Citizen Kane are very likely anamorphic but the image shown is not letterbox..
I'd really like to get some expert opinion on this as I feel I have discovered a subject worth reporting on.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

I'm not sure I understand what you're talking about. I don't know what "HTWWW" is, but if it contains 4:3 footage with black "pillars" on either side of the image--and especially if it contains some widescreen footage as well--then it sounds like the DVD is authored as a standard 16:9 DVD.

A DVD can be authored an 4:3 or 16:9 mode, but of course video of any aspect ratio can be included within that 4:3 or 16:9 frame by letterboxing or "pillarboxing" it with black bars.

Robin Hood and Citizen Kane are standard 4:3 DVDs.

Nothing strange is going on here.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

The old (now deleted) Carlton R2 DVD of The Importance of Being Earnest was anamorphic 4:3.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Do you mean that the DVD was authored in 16:9, and contained 4:3 video pillarboxed within the 16:9 frame? Any idea why it was authored that way? Such a scheme wastes 25% of the resolution on the black bars, whereas a standard full-screen transfer utilizes 100% of DVD's resolution.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Sorry should have spelled out HTWWW is How the West was Won.. UCE., Ultimate Collector's edition..

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Yes, it's 4:3 (the correct OAR) pillarboxed into 16:9. Why it was done that way I couldn't tell you.

It's the only example of this practice on a DVD that I own. For the feature that is - I've seen this done for DVD extras occasionally.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

MY flipper of The Man Who Would Be King contains several trailers of John Huston films "pillarboxed" and "enhanced for widescreen TVs." On DVD, it's a waste of resolution, but on BD and HD DVD, it was a matter of necessity, as the native screen AR for those formats is 16:9.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

I think this is a decision made by the studio and/or telecine. A 4x3 program mastered in HD (16x9) can be down-converted for standard def dvd two ways, either in 16x9 or 4x3. I think this was based on some old 16x9 tv's could not show 4x3 discs in progressive scan (the one I had before had this problem) it would 'lock up' in 16x9.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

Let's not make this too complicated... The bottom line is the 4:3 box sits in the middle of a 16 x 9 frame with two 'built in' black pillers .. one on each side.

Re: Is there anamorphic full screen??

I took another look at your original post and the best answer I have is: it depends. When a film is authored to DVD, the authoring tech has two options: anamorphic or non-anamorphic. If he chooses anamorphic, the HD transfer is "squeezed" by 33% and the data is flagged so that the DVD player interprets the pixels as rectangular. If the DVD player is set up properly, you will get the correct image on your display, exhibiting none of the "squeezing". If he chooses non-anamorphic, nothing changes on the transfer and, again, as long as the DVD player is set up correctly, the image will display properly. If a 4:3 film is mastered in HD, the sidebars exist in the transfer, but the person authoring the DVD has the discretion to crop the black bars and have only the 4:3 element on the disc in non-anamorphic, which takes full advantage of the 480 x 720 resolution of the DVD spec. While authoring a disc with 4:3 elements in anamorphic means less fiddling with the display, the trade-off is a loss of effective resolution; by comparison, and anamorphic widescreen disc uses more pixels and has more effective resolution.

Things get complicated with HD displays. My current display (32" Bravia) displays everything properly from my Toshiba HD-A30 connected via HDMI. My Zenith/LG player, however, which is connected via component, defaults to 4:3 and I have to manually change the display if I'm playing an anamorphic disc.