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films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

#1
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3/6/08 at 1:17am
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I am currently studying indigenous cinema and am hoping to write a paper on the subject of Two Spirit and LGBT natives in film and television. I have a few examples like Johnny Greyeyes and the Business of Fancydancying if anyone knows of more with links to clips etc. Or even better academic articles, journals, books etc on the subject.

Please help
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#2
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3/10/08 at 12:48am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

can nobody help me
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#3
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3/10/08 at 6:03am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkif99uk
can nobody help me

What exactly are you asking?


Wait, did a little googling. Check out Little Big Man starring Dustin Hoffman. There was a character in that film who fit the criteria. As I remember it, he rode his horse backwards. That is the closest I ever got to a mainstream film handling the concept of "Two Spirit". His name was "Little Horse" and he was described as a "'heemanee' for which there ain't no English word".
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#4
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3/10/08 at 9:54am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

The only film that I can think of that may partially fulfill the criteria is "Big Eden".

The film stars Arye Gross as Henry Hart, a successful gay artist from New York City who returns to his Montana hometown to care for his dying grandfather. While at home, Hart is forced to confront his unresolved feelings for high school friend Dean Stewart (Tim DeKay), while simultaneously beginning to fall in love with Pike Dexter (Eric Schweig), the shy Native American owner of the town's general store.

Uncle Joe: I'll never marry you, Selma Plout!  You may as well take off that wedding dress and put it back in your Hopeless Chest!

--Petticoat Junction--

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#5
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3/10/08 at 6:48pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkif99uk
I am currently studying indigenous cinema and am hoping to write a paper on the subject of Two Spirit and LGBT natives in film and television. I have a few examples like Johnny Greyeyes and the Business of Fancydancying if anyone knows of more with links to clips etc. Or even better academic articles, journals, books etc on the subject.

Please help

Give me a bit of time nikki. I will see what I can dig up but it may take a couple days.
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#6
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3/10/08 at 6:50pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie
What exactly are you asking?


Wait, did a little googling. Check out Little Big Man starring Dustin Hoffman. There was a character in that film who fit the criteria. As I remember it, he rode his horse backwards. That is the closest I ever got to a mainstream film handling the concept of "Two Spirit". His name was "Little Horse" and he was described as a "'heemanee' for which there ain't no English word".

NO NO NO NO NO!
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#7
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3/10/08 at 8:46pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Brown Eyes
Give me a bit of time nikki. I will see what I can dig up but it may take a couple days.

thanks that would be great my presentation is Wednesday but more importantly I need it for my essay.
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#8
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3/11/08 at 5:26am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Brown Eyes
NO NO NO NO NO!

I did say it was mainstream. Maybe you could elaborate on your comment, for even you can admit this is a quite narrow genre probably not seen much by the general public and thus we plebes don't know what is considered offensive or not. I can't really learn much from "NO NO NO NO NO!", can I? Besides, the OP didn't request postive portrayals only and I would imagine an essay may seek to compare and contrast both positive and negative.
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#9
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3/11/08 at 5:55am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

It might help if you told us what a LGBT is?

-----
Scott

View My DVD Collection
Stop the on-screen Bugs!!!!!!

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#10
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3/11/08 at 7:43am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott-S
It might help if you told us what a LGBT is?

Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender.

It's a common acronym in academia, but I'm not sure of the widespread use outside of that sphere. As far as "Two Spirits" is concerned, I definitely had to google for that.

I guess you learn something new every day.
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#11
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3/11/08 at 8:47am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Ah. And Two Spirit has a transgender meaning as well. I just googled the term.

Two-Spirit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A little more explanation by the original poster would have been helpful. Good luck with your essay.
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#12
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3/11/08 at 10:44am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkif99uk
thanks that would be great my presentation is Wednesday but more importantly I need it for my essay.


Not a lot of time there. I will contact a friend of mine who will be able to give me a good list later this evening.

You got the main one. The Business of Fancy Dancing

My hunka brother is a winkte, two spirit. I am trying to get a hold of him.
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#13
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3/11/08 at 10:55am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie
I did say it was mainstream. Maybe you could elaborate on your comment, for even you can admit this is a quite narrow genre probably not seen much by the general public and thus we plebes don't know what is considered offensive or not. I can't really learn much from "NO NO NO NO NO!", can I? Besides, the OP didn't request postive portrayals only and I would imagine an essay may seek to compare and contrast both positive and negative.

Offering up a movie such as Little Big Man as a source for a serious topic on anything is laughable. It is unfortunate that the "general public" takes a film such as Little Big Man to be authentic or educational in any manner.

The original poster specifically stated indigenous cinema. Little Big Man comes no where near indigenous cinema. It can only be used as an example of stereotype portrayals produced by American/Canadian mainstream, something that Native writers, actors, directors, and producers are trying hard to reverse. Very few are interested in learning who we are and what we are they prefer to retain the old comfortable stereotypes, whether heathen savage or noble savage, in the end niether portrayal is accurate.

what I gather from the OP is that they are looking for a Native voice, Little Big Man is not a native voice.
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#14
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3/11/08 at 12:22pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Brown Eyes
Offering up a movie such as Little Big Man as a source for a serious topic on anything is laughable. It is unfortunate that the "general public" takes a film such as Little Big Man to be authentic or educational in any manner.

The original poster specifically stated indigenous cinema. Little Big Man comes no where near indigenous cinema. It can only be used as an example of stereotype portrayals produced by American/Canadian mainstream, something that Native writers, actors, directors, and producers are trying hard to reverse. Very few are interested in learning who we are and what we are they prefer to retain the old comfortable stereotypes, whether heathen savage or noble savage, in the end niether portrayal is accurate.

what I gather from the OP is that they are looking for a Native voice, Little Big Man is not a native voice.

Thank you. So much more informative than "NO NO NO NO NO!" I apologize if I barged in with an offer that offended, it's been a long time since I've been able, or frankly willing, to keep up with the latest in PC notions and even if I did, I much prefer being scolded than censored. Some people are funny like that.

Anyway, it looks like I learned more than one thing today and that's never a bad thing.
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#15
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3/11/08 at 3:04pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Gatie
Thank you. So much more informative than "NO NO NO NO NO!" I apologize if I barged in with an offer that offended, it's been a long time since I've been able, or frankly willing, to keep up with the latest in PC notions and even if I did, I much prefer being scolded than censored. Some people are funny like that.

Anyway, it looks like I learned more than one thing today and that's never a bad thing.

I figured that as soon as I read your original post that any response would be brushed off as PC.

Well since I am at heart a hopefull fellow I will give another shot at trying to make you understand,

Why is this always related to a pc thing? It is not a pc thing, not for me and other Native people. People see me or ask me about my name and where it came from. When I answer Oglala Lakota many times they do not understand so I have to go with Sioux.

What happens next is "Oh like Dances with Wolves" or "Man Called Horse" or any other popular media creation. It is even worse for Native people who are not from a plains culture. Imagine if the majority of people who meet you relate to you in stereotypes.

You don't look Indian? you don't act Indian? don't you all live in tipis? Indians can can live off the reservation? blah blah blah. It can get much worse than that.

It would make my life much easier if people thought, Thunderheart, Skins, Smoke Signals, Doe Boy, The Business of Fancy Dancing.

In short you do not have to live your day to day life with stereotypes hanging over your head.

It is similar to a white person having to explain why they do not act, dress, and speak like the characters in Elizabeth. Or black people having to explain why they do not act dress and speak like characters in Zulu. Arab people not acting like the characters in Lawrance of Arabia. Asians acting like the characters in Shogun...

I know that the above may sound unlikely but I assure you that because the majority of Americans do not interact with Indian people on a daily basis that without a modern day baseline people resort to the only information they have.
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#16
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3/11/08 at 8:28pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

David,

I'm a white, single, never been married male, age 42 who likes classic films. If you don't think I have to live with stereotypes, you really don't get out much. Hell, some of those stereotypical assumptions are from my own family, and my family aren't morons like the people who ask you if you live in a tipi. If anyone asks you that, I hope you have a good joke, because I can think of a few. Shit, the least they could do is ask if you own a casino, this is the 21th century! (That's a joke. If you wish, you can do like my sisters do and question my sexuality. Go ahead, I don't care. )

Anyway, thanks for the insight. I didn't mean the PC comment to demean, only to say that the rules often change fast for us outside the direct sphere of discussion and being outside, we tend not to follow it. I did say I learned something and I meant it.
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#17
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3/12/08 at 6:07am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkif99uk
I am currently studying indigenous cinema and am hoping to write a paper on the subject of Two Spirit and LGBT natives in film and television. I have a few examples like Johnny Greyeyes and the Business of Fancydancying if anyone knows of more with links to clips etc. Or even better academic articles, journals, books etc on the subject.

Please help

also check out

Stryker

and

Without Reservations.
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#18
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3/12/08 at 12:08pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

thanks have been looking at Styker will look out for Without Reservation. I have also been looking at films by non-native filmmakers to see it they are stereotypical or are realistic in their portrayal. Many films seem to conform to western identities of sexuality although from the reading I have done Two-Spirit includes all LGBT identities as well
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#19
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3/12/08 at 12:10pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

By the way who stars in Without Reservations the only film I can see on IMDB is the 1946 John Wayne movie
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#20
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3/13/08 at 9:45am
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

I googled: "Two Spirit" movies and there were a lot of hits. I don't know what to look for but did find this site:

American Indian - First Nations Two Spirit Internet Resources

You probably already have this information.
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#21
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3/17/08 at 5:50pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

tried looking at the planet out films and it loaded with no text or anything, so annoying. happened with both internet explorer and firefox
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#22
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3/18/08 at 6:40pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkif99uk
By the way who stars in Without Reservations the only film I can see on IMDB is the 1946 John Wayne movie

I am not able to find it as well. I will ask Ramsey again this weekend.
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#23
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3/18/08 at 7:11pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

removed

" I think it's time we go to plan B". "What's plan B?" "That's the one where we don't do something stupid".

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#24
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3/18/08 at 7:54pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

removed

" I think it's time we go to plan B". "What's plan B?" "That's the one where we don't do something stupid".

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#25
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3/19/08 at 3:54pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

thanks my presentation is today so hoping it goes well am showing clips from Stryker and Johnny Greyeyes and the trailers for The Business Of Fancydancing and Girl King as well as a short clip of Marina from the L Word as even though are character is not specifically native the actress Karina Lombard is of Lakota descent. And a clip someone made of the scenes with Pike Dexter in Big Eden. After this I just have to write a 2500 word essay on the topic. Not sure what to put in my thesis. That films with lgbt natives follow a western view on sexuality? or That the term two-spirit is all encompassing of sexuality that all representations of LGBT natives can be classed as Two-Spirit, anyone have any ideas let me know
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#26
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3/28/08 at 5:08pm
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Re: films with Two spirit or LGBT Native Americans/Canadians

did my presentation now have to write a 2500 word paper on the representation of queer natives in films but need a thesis statement any ideas
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