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Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

#1
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I just saw this amazing news on the Classic Horror Film Board:

"Got some truly exciting news that I think everyone here will be rejoicing over. My daughter was talking to one of her old coworkers at the Library of Congress this morning. Apparently after the negative press about the recent DVD of DRACULA, he decided to conduct a further search for better film elements last summer. He was rewarded for his efforts by discovering a complete nitrate lavender fine grain composite from 1930 that no one, including Universal knew about. He said it's in pristine condition and is absolutely gorgeous. The capper to this is that it DOES contain the complete epilogue. It's now in the hands of Universal. Hopefully they'll be making this available in some form soon."

Let's hope this is not a hoax...
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#2
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Furmanek
I just saw this amazing news on the Classic Horror Film Board:

"Got some truly exciting news that I think everyone here will be rejoicing over. My daughter was talking to one of her old coworkers at the Library of Congress this morning. Apparently after the negative press about the recent DVD of DRACULA, he decided to conduct a further search for better film elements last summer. He was rewarded for his efforts by discovering a complete nitrate lavender fine grain composite from 1930 that no one, including Universal knew about. He said it's in pristine condition and is absolutely gorgeous. The capper to this is that it DOES contain the complete epilogue. It's now in the hands of Universal. Hopefully they'll be making this available in some form soon."

Let's hope this is not a hoax...

NICE! I already own 3 versions of this, I'll buy a 4th DVD! Please let it be real!! XD
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#3
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

1930 - that means not cropped for the soundtrack?
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#4
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Well it will be narrower than 1.37:1 if that's what you mean. Optical sound films before the introduction of the Academy Ratio in 1932 (I believe) all have a ratio of 1.17 or 1.2:1 (something close to that.) The problem that arises is when the films are cropped back to 1.37 to fill standard 4:3 picture areas. Are you saying that all DRACULA prints in existence are permanently cropped to 1.37:1?
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#5
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Exciting indeed...now if Universal goes Blu-ray and releases it hi-def I'll be even happier!
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#6
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod J
1930 - that means not cropped for the soundtrack?
Presumably, it's the original Vitaphone version, if it's from 1930. So, it should have the correct framing.

It should have the original version of the title cards, too.
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#7
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

I would buy this in a heartbeat on any home format(DVD, HD DVD or BD). Now that they are able to, I truly hope Universal gives us a definitive home version of one of their most important films.
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#8
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

It is just amazing that things like that can still be found! I trust Universal to appreciate the good fortune! Yes, i would buy it!
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#9
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Wow, I hope we get too see this!!


Universal should release a Ford-At-Fox style package of ALL of their horror films of the 30's through 50's.
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#10
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

I would like to see this as well......I'm hoping for Universal to go Blu-Ray someday in the near future and release this.....that would really be fantastic.

Maybe the person who found the print should start conducting a search for some of the lost films.....'London After Midnight' comes immediately to mind......you never know....
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#11
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

This is indeed exciting. I can't wait to own a video version. I have posted before on how the audio on some versions of Dracula differ. Specifically, music playing after Bela's line "There are far worse things awaiting man than death."

Some versions have music following that line, some don't. I wonder what is contained on this version, if anything.
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#12
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

I would quadruple dip for this IN A HEARTBEAT!

However, the way so many people screamed and hollered at Universal after the release of the Legacy Edition, I doubt they will be quick to put this out again. I hope I'm wrong as I WANT this so bad I can taste it.
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#13
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by James Phillips
Presumably, it's the original Vitaphone version, if it's from 1930. So, it should have the correct framing.

Wait a minute...are you saying this was originally released in Vitaphone? I thought Universal had switched to variable denisty soundtracks by this time. All the 1930 date means is that it was prepared as they were making release prints. It was released in February 1931 so all of the printing preparation would have been done late in the previous year.

I am really confused here....was it shot as a Vitaphone production? If it's a lavendar originally prepared for making dupe negatives then it would reflect the original release prints made from it.
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#14
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Thanks for the post, Bob!

Great news if true, but.....it was on that same forum where a respected poster said that Warner found the Spider Pit sequence from King Kong and was going to include it on the DVD. Obviously that wasn't true and it turned out that Peter Jackson had merely recreated it.

I guess we'll find out soon enough if this pans out. It also begs the question why Universal couldn't find something that a LoC worker bee could.
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#15
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

I'd like to see "Dracula" really restored, including all the scenes that might have been filmed but were cut at some point. (I think the running time would be 90 minutes).

It's funny how excited people get over "Dracula," yet every time someone talks about it, they say what a disappointing movie it is.
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#16
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve...O
Thanks for the post, Bob!

Great news if true, but.....it was on that same forum where a respected poster said that Warner found the Spider Pit sequence from King Kong and was going to include it on the DVD. Obviously that wasn't true and it turned out that Peter Jackson had merely recreated it.

I guess we'll find out soon enough if this pans out. It also begs the question why Universal couldn't find something that a LoC worker bee could.

Warner Bros. only recently found out about the forgotten camera negatives to a lot of Warner and MGM films stored at the George Eastman House (like The Champ '31 and David Copperfield) When you consider how many movies a studio owns, plus the amount of film stored for each title - it's not unthinkable that stuff can easily become lost or thought to be lost.

Tell The Weinstein Company to release Richard Williams' animated masterpiece The Thief and the Cobbler on DVD in Panavision widescreen and uncut! See and hear what you're missing from their Bitsy Award winner of Worst Standard Edition DVD of 2006 on YouTube!
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#17
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

If true, this sounds great. The problem is, Universal has just released a 75th Anniversary of DRACULA again, and I can't see them wanting to put another one out so soon.
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#18
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnMor
I hope I'm wrong as I WANT this so bad I can taste it.

Interesting quote considering the movie we are discussing. LOL

If this is true, I would love to see this come out. So far, I've held off on the 75th anniversary edition, but have come close to buying it many times. I am especially intrigued by the existence of the epilogue.

I have the Legacy edition, and IMHO, it isn't very good. The 75th anniversary edition notwithstanding, it is probably as good as can be with what was available, but I've always dreamed of someone finding a better, more complete print. Let's hope this is true and we all get to benefit.
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#19
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

This only goes to prove that there's still hope for film preservation! When you consider how in recent years pristine original prints for films like King Kong (found in the UK and used for the DVD) have been found along with the discovery of seemingly 'lost' films like Beyond The Rocks with Swanson and Valentino, it gives everyone more of an incentive to do more searching. By the end of the year, don't be surprised if even more big discoveries are found, and not just from the silent era!
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#20
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod J
1930 - that means not cropped for the soundtrack?

Quote:
a complete nitrate lavender fine grain composite

Composite means an optical soundtrack is on the print.

-Jay

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#21
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

.
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#22
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoBiscotti
Wow, I hope we get too see this!!


Universal should release a Ford-At-Fox style package of ALL of their horror films of the 30's through 50's.


I agree. I just don't understand why they didn't do something like that back when they did the Legacy editions, instead of just giving us a large portion of their old horror movies. With this discovery, I guess it's a good a time as any to try again and get it right.

They seem more proud of their horror movies than almost anything, so it seems like a no-brainer.
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#23
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

while i wait to see if anything materializes with this i dont think it will happen anytime soon. actualy i woul be willing to go all out with the ford at fox idea as well, but only if they were truly intent on doing it corectly, but with the sets that they have been releasing exclusivly at best buy, the idea o a single release for Dracula complete and restored to what brownning originaly intended would be a sight to behold,

the thing is that the spanish language version followes the same script, different actors of course and of course is longer , i want to see those missing sceens that were edited out of a film that is 76 or so years old, but i belive that everyone is waiting to see the film as it was originaly intended
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#24
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

I'm really not interested in this as I thought the last release had a great video quality. If they included the silent version, which was made for theaters not equipped with sound, then I'd buy it.

Universal has too many titles left unreleased for me to want to see this thing released again. How about THE LAST WARNING before the 4th version of DRACULA?
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#25
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Pennington
Composite means an optical soundtrack is on the print.
Ah, I missed the part about it being a composite print. That sounds a bit strange to me, if it's supposed to be from 1930. As I've always understood it, Dracula was originally only released with a Vitaphone soundtrack, and the optical soundtrack version was created later on, for the re-release prints.
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#26
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by James Phillips
Ah, I missed the part about it being a composite print. That sounds a bit strange to me, if it's supposed to be from 1930. As I've always understood it, Dracula was originally only released with a Vitaphone soundtrack, and the optical soundtrack version was created later on, for the re-release prints.
Well I was under the impression that Dracula used a Westrex track like the greater majority of films made pre-Dolby.
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#27
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Universal didn't make composite lavenders. Separate pix/track only. So this story seems rather unlikely.

DRACULA was filmed full frame (no soundtrack), but with viewfinders that were marked for 1.37 (and composed thusly). Universal went 1.37 in late 1929, after it was adopted by AMPAS, but before DRACULA was in production. Shooting it full-full frame might have been accomplished for two reasons:

1) For the silent version and sound-on-disc version, which had a full-frame (no track) aspect ratio.

2) Because not all of the cameras at Universal had been set with new apertures. They simply had new viewfinders marked accordingly and the left edge was not printed for the picture on the sound block.

DRACULA was recorded with Western Electric SOUND ON FILM. Universal only did one or two sound-on-disc recordings in 1929 and that is IT (one of these was the reissue PHANTOM OF THE OPERA talkie sequences). The confusion lies in that DRACULA was available FOR sound on disc markets.

-J. Theakston

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#28
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Thanks for the clarification, Jack.

I suppose we'll have to wait and see exactly what's been unearthed here.

But, even if it's 'just' the 1930 picture element, it would still be an amazing discovery.
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#29
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Elliott
I'm really not interested in this as I thought the last release had a great video quality. If they included the silent version, which was made for theaters not equipped with sound, then I'd buy it.

Universal has too many titles left unreleased for me to want to see this thing released again. How about THE LAST WARNING before the 4th version of DRACULA?

I'm surprised to hear you say this (well, not really so much I guess, given how much you dislike the film even though you've tried watching it 100 times!). For one thing, while the video was improved on the most recent DVD, it was far from what I'd call "great" and this is one old movie which has long required new and sparkling film elements. Secondly, and the main reason I decide to get rid of the 75th Anniversary edition, the sound was horrid and distracting. Lastly, this new find is said to include Edward Van Sloan's epilogue, which alone would make this version essential and thus render all the prior releases moot.

And I couldn't care less about the silent version you frequently mention. Without Bela's classic accent, there is no film. Since you don't really like the movie and consider it dull, I'm always baffled as to how you think a silent verison could "add" to it.
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#30
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Re: Exciting Discovery of DRACULA Film Element!

Look at Browning's silent films compared to the sound ones.

Getting something like THE LAST WARNING or ISLAND OF LOST SOULS out there is still more important than another version of DRACULA, FRANKENSTEIN, THE MUMMY or THE WOLF MAN. In my opinion of course.
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