Fantasy Football 2004 Discussion and Advice

Brad, I felt the same way with the #2 pick in my money league. I'm sure Tomlinson will be great this year, possibly top two, but the dropoff between Holmes and Tomlinson is more significant than the dropoff from Tomlinson to Green/Alexander/Deuce/possibly Portis.

Priest is too good to pass up. The owner with the #1 pick in our 12-team money league (draft is tomorrow night) insists he will take LT2, but I think he's nuts to pass on Holmes (this is a redraft league). I have the #4 pick, and plan on taking Alexander if the first three picks go as predicted -- LT2, Holmes and Green. I'm hoping another quality RB falls to me at #21 in the 2nd round. This should happen if a combo of 6 WR/QBs are taken by then. I figure that Moss, Holt, Harrison, Manning and Culpepper will definitely be gone, so I just need someone to bite on McNab, Vick or Terrell Owens.

I have the #1 pick in a ten team league tonite and I tried trading down to 5,4 and 7 but no luck. I guess I'm "stuck" w/Priest Holmes. I just hop I can grab a decent #2 RB and a upper level WR at pick 20 and 21.

You all have pretty much affirmed my thinking, that there's no way I can take someone else over Priest Holmes. Heard on the radio today that Johnnie Morton is pretty banged up too, so with their receiving corps in such bad shape KC definitely will focus on running. Looking at the other NFL backs, there's just no one else who stands out as a viable pick other than Holmes.

Receivers should be no problem at that spot. You should be able to get one of the following -- Owens, CJohnson, Ward or Mason. If I go RB/RB, I'm hoping for Ward or Mason to fall to me with the 4th pick in the 3rd round.

Also, my dilemma in the 2nd round will probably be between Rudi Johnson, Brian Westbrook and Stephen Davis. Right now I have them ranked in that order. I'm figuring that Holmes, LT2, Green, Alexander, Portis, Deuce, Lewis, Edge, Taylor, Barlow, DDavis, Dillon, Henry and Faulk will all be gone by then.

Any opinions on Rudi vs. Westbrook vs. SDavis? I would take any of the others I've listed, except maybe Faulk, if they fell to me in the 2nd round.

Where do you have Curtis Martin and Tiki Barber ranked? I don't think there's enough data on Rudi or Westbrook to draft them with any supreme confidence at that point, although Westbrook should get more carries since Buckhalter got hurt (again!). Of those two I think Westbrook is a better option since he had a higher per carry average and is working with a more experienced QB. Everyone is down on Stephen Davis, but I still think he can be a major contributor early in the season. Get a few big games out of him when the Panthers emphasize the running game and them package him in a trade when one of your late round sleeper backs becomes a stud. He faces KC, Atlanta, Philly, and San Diego early in the season - all four of which were in the bottom 10 of the rushing defenses last year. If your concerned about Foster getting more of the carries then look elsewhere, but I like the Panthers running game this year.

Brad

Well, since you asked..... Isn't SDavis injury prone? At least thats the rap Ive heard on him. Rudi may do well, but if Carson Palmer doesn't do the trick, opponents may just stack the line against Rudi forcing Palmer to try and beat em. Is Westbrook going to do special teams this and does your league give points for that? If so, I may lean towards him. You may also want to look at CBrown, although, you might be able to get him in the 3rd. I saw him at CU run all over my Huskers and from Ive seen from this years highights, he looks pretty good.

There is no way I would consider either of these guys with a 2nd round pick. Martin can be had in the 4th round of most drafts, and Barber is no better than a 3rd round pick.


Not any more than any other RB available at that spot. He played 14 games in 2003, 12 in 2002, 16 in 2001 and 15 in 2000. If I took SDavis, though, I would have to take DeShaun Foster in the 7th/8th round to protect myself -- the same reason I'm not thrilled with taking Faulk if he falls to me. That's why I have him behind Johnson and Westbrook.


I'm high on CBrown, too (drafted him in another league), but the 2nd round is too early for him. I will strongly consider him with my early 3rd round pick, though -- I've picked RB's with my first three picks in the past, but I prefer to get one WR with my first three picks if possible.


We do get points for special teams (not much for yardage, but TD's count the same as rushing/receiving), but I doubt that Westbrook will be returning kicks with Philly's lack of depth at RB now that Buckhalter and Staley are gone.

My logic on Rudi and Westbrook is that they are both young, are now the primary ball carriers with no RBBC threat (I do not consider Chris Perry a threat in Cincy), and both produced when given the opportunity last season.

I'm not suggesting you use that pick for them. If they can be had in the third round or fourth round as a value pick, then why not take a top receiver in the second instead? I guess what I'm saying that I don't think you're getting as much value for picking Johnson or Westbrook at that spot in the second round as you would for Martin or Barber in the third or fourth rounds. It all depends on whether you think they will produce similar to the last few years or get worse. It's obvious you think Westbrook and Johnson will produce better. But then I said to pick Stephen Davis in the second round anyway.

Brad

If Moss, Harrison or Holt were available at my #2 pick, I would jump on them. However, I anticipate that all three will be gone by pick #21. I have the next group of receivers tiered very closely -- Owens, Ward, Chad Johnson, Derrick Mason, Santana Moss and Joe Horn. I can easily live with any of them as my #1 WR, and most of them will be available at #3.28. Hence, my desire to get the best available RB at #2.21, since there are a lot fewer quality RB's than WR's available.

I drafted twice last week. Both were strange...

Here is how I did:

Work League:
QB: Jake Delhomme, Mark Brunell
RB: Rudi Johnson, Chris Brown, Charlie Garner, Tyrone Wheatley
WR: Torry Holt, Joe Horn, Terry Glenn, Brandon Lloyd
K: Adam Vinatieri
D: Jets

Drafted 13 out of 14 there


Other league: (Won it all last year):

QB: Tom Brady, Marc Bulger
RB: S Alexander, Rudi Johnson, Kevin Barlow, Duce Staley
TE: Jason Whitten
WR: D Stallworth, R Moss, P Burress, J Porter, M Muhommed
K: Vanderjagt
D: Philly and Seattle. I took Philly's D because they were there and nobody was left. Plus I tend to take away a highly ranked backup to deny others a decent starting player.

Drafted 7 out of 10 here.

Overall 2 different leagues all together. Payton Manning went #1 on my first league. My 2nd draft is much more typical for a FF league(I think).

Shane,

I like your 2nd team much better, so I'm not sure why you have the frown face there. You have more depth at WR in the 1st league, but you do have Moss in the 2nd. Your starting QB is better in Brady than Delhomme, and your RB situation is better overall.

Taking Manning #1 overall is insane.

Very nice stable of RB's you have there in your 2nd league Shane. In fact, the whole team looks fairly impressive. The 1st league, however, well lets just say its not as impressive.

The first league went odd and I took what I could get. Defenses starting going in the 4th round. The frown face for the 2nd league was a typo.

I do like my 2nd league but I want to be competitive with the first. I don't think that is possible but who knows.

We mostly finished our 12-team money league draft this evening (still have three rounds to complete tomorrow), but here's my team:

QB: Brady, Leftwich, Gannon, Kerry Collins
RB: Alexander, Henry, Garner, Fargas, Pittman, Maurice Morris
WR: Chad Johnson, Rod Smith, Deion Branch, RWayne, TGlenn
TE: ?
K: Nedney

Moss, Harrison and Holt were all gone by my 2nd pick (Henry). I passed on TO and Marshall Faulk.

I'm happy with my running backs, but wish I had better depth at receiver behind Chad Johnson. I debated Andre Johnson over Rod Smith, but went with the veteran. in a tough decision.

When we finish up tomorrow, I'll end up with either Erron Kinney, Dallas Clark, L.J. Smith or Jasen Whitten at TE, and still will pick one more receiver (either Calico or Reggie Williams are available).

Drafted last night. Just my second year of fantasy football, and I don't really know wht I'm doing My league seems to be set up differently than most, as I start 2 QBs, 2 RBs, 3WRs, TE, K, DEF, as well as a flex RB/WR and WR/TE. Starters in bold. What do you guys think?

RB:Ahman Green, Jamal Lewis, Dominick Davis, Warrick Dunn

QB:Aaron Brooks, Jake Delhomme, Carson Palmer

WR:Darrell Jackson, Peerless Price, Keenan McCardell, Ashlie Lelie, Jimmy Smith, Drew Bennett

TE:Tony Gonzales, Marcus Pollard

Def:Miami

K:Ryan Longwell

9 teams, I picked 5th

Here's the final results of my money league draft:

QB: Pennington, Garcia
RB: Deuce McAllister, Fred Taylor, Michael Bennett, Justin Fargas, Richie Anderson
WR: Joe Horn, Darrell Jackson, Reggie Wayne, Deion Branch, Ashley Lelie, Quincy Morgan, Nate Burleson, Robert Ferguson
TE: Antonio Gates
K: Matt Stover
D: Cowboys

It's a 10 team league, with 1 QB, 1 RB, 2 WR, 2 RB/WR, 1 TE, 1 K, 1D, and 18 total roster spots. We get one pt. per reception, hence the last round pickup of Richie Anderson.

I immediately felt dumb after announcing Horn's name when it dawned on me that I already had Deuce, but the damage was done. When Bennett returns I think I'll have one of the strongest RB corps in the league (probably second to the guy who got Holmes, DDavis, SDavis, & CBrown - and more or less even with the guy who got CPortis, JLewis, THenry, and QGriffin.

There was some wacky QB drafting going on. We only start one, but one of our guys drafted Culpepper, Favre, and Bulger in the first seven rounds. It wasn't obviously clear that he was hoarding trade bait, but that is his only reasonable move at this point.

To the point of the thread, here's my first start/bench decision. Deuce and Fred are in - Bennett is out. That leaves me looking at a third wide receiver - Wayne against the Pats or Branch against the Colts? I'm leaning to Wayne because the Pats spread it around too much.

Brad

God, I may be high (I draft later tonight, 12th in my draft) I am figuring who will be gone, but at that point, I'm seriously thinking about an RB who isn't getting big name run.. Lee Suggs (CLE). I have him 9 on my RB board, and I figure he will probably slip down to me.

Now, am I high to rank him up there? That's what I'm asking myself.

The top will all be gone (LT, Holmes, Green, etc.) so I'm looking for a second tier, under the radar RB that I think will produce. But right now, I'm thinking my choice is going to be between Rudi Johnson and Lee Suggs. I'm just debating it out right now

Chris, that's way too early to take Lee Suggs. He went as the 3rd pick in the 5th round of our draft. You can wait and get him much later -- easily in the 3rd round. Rudi Johnson went at #10 and Fred Taylor at #12 in our draft. Either would be a better choice than Suggs. RBs taken in the 2nd round included DDavis, Barlow, Dillon, Westbrook, Henry (me), Thomas Jones and Faulk. Kevin Jones went in the early 3rd round to one of the Lions slappies in our league (I would have taken Chris Brown instead if looking for a breakout rookie RB).

Brad, I like the receivers on your team. If Bennett's injury lingers (which has happened with him in the past), you'll only have two RBs you can count on, though. Pennington's a solid fantasy QB.

Dave George, nice first effort. Keep in mind, though, that Keenan McCardell is still not in camp at Tampa and may hold out all year. He shouldn't be one of your starters. I cannot believe that Ahman Green fell to you at the 5th spot -- he's been going no later than 3rd in most drafts (including ours).

Suggs has just climbed my chart because of the way I think Cleaveland has to play. Chris Brown ranks high on my list too.

*laugh* in a league where we value yardage heavily, Rudi Johnson seems to me like a possible great pickup at #12 if I can grab him, but I'm thinking he's off the board.

I think Thomas Jones and Westbrook are disasters for the season, so I don't even have them in my top 20, although I know some will scream heresy. I look at their new styles of play, especially in Philadelphia with TO, and just see production falling.

I think Tiki Barber and Marshall Faulk are -way- low on my pick board because I think the OL's on those teams will cause more runs to be stuffed then any serious yardage gains.

And Kevin Barlow? I don't know why he keeps rising in the drafts I'm in. I just look at that team and see him picking up some yards, but not enough to justify him being picked in the first two rounds (IMHO).

So, I'm at #12, and I'm thinking (our league is 14 deep, so I'll get 3rd pick next round, of course) I may have a shot at Rudi Johnson, but since our system backs running far more then receptions, etc. I need someone that I think can chalk up the run. And I look at my lists and I go this way in RB:



1. Priest Holmes - KC
2. LaDainian Tomlinson - SD
3. Clinton Portis - Was
4. Deuce McAllister - NO
5. Ahman Green - GB
6. Shaun Alexander - Sea
7. Edgerrin James - Ind
8. Jamal Lewis - Bal
9. Fred Taylor - Jax
10. Rudi Johnson - CIN
11. Lee Suggs - CLE
12. Thomas Jones - Chi
13. Brian Westbrook - Phi
14. Travis Henry - Buf
15. Chris Brown - Ten
16. Michael Bennett - Min
17. Marshall Faulk - StL
18. Tiki Barber - NYG
19. Curtis Martin - NYJ
20. Dominick Davis - HOU (I'm expecting injury problems, although he was a good pickup for me in the 6th round last year)

Here's how my team turned out, picking first out of sixteen teams and using the usual snake draft.

QB: Brett Favre, Tim Rattay, Eli Manning
RB: Priest Holmes, Tatum Bell, James Jackson, Mewelde Moore
WR: Chad Johnson, Rod Smith, David Givens, Bryant Johnson
TE: Billy Miller
K: John Carney
Def: Baltimore

Holmes aside, I'm weak at RB unless Bell ends up becoming a starter in Denver or if Jackson gets traded to a team that needs one. I tried to take the best player on the board, at least when it was discernible, because I figured I'd get more out of a stud WR than a marginal RB. (I took Chad Johnson over Travis Minor or Emmitt Smith, who I could have taken because RBs are so highly valued.)

Week 5 is going to kill me with Holmes and C. Johnson on bye that week, but overall I feel pretty good about my team. My top three picks and defense should help me out substantially. Either Rattay needs to last until Favre's bye week or Manning needs to be starting by then. The run on backup QBs caught me unaware--which will happen with 30 picks between yours.

FWIW, I'd favor Rudi Johnson over Lee Suggs, but then I'm a Bengals fan too.

Chris, you have Dominick Davis rated way too low. Considering that every RB is an injury risk, I wouldn't downgrade him any more than the other guys on your list. You may like Suggs, but why waste a 1st round pick on him when you can get him much later. If you do not like any of the RBs in that spot, take the top WR -- I'm sure that either Harrison or Holt will be available there.


Taking CJohnson over Smith or Minor is a no-brainer. Neither of those guys are worth much, and will only start on very poor fantasy teams. Meanwhile, Johnson is rated anywhere from the #4 to #7 WR in fantasy football pre-rankings. Sixteen team leagues make it tough to get decent depth.

If your bolding of the text in your message indicates starters, then definitely move Jimmy Smith ahead of McCardell and Lelie in you lineup. I think he's coked up and ready for a big year. Your lineup rules seem to allow you to start five wide receivers at some point, so the order may not matter if you're starting all three of those guys.


There's two things in play here: where do you rank him and where does everyone else rank him? You may be correct that his talent and situation will place him as the 12th best RB at the end of the season, but that doesn't mean that he should be the 12th overall RB picked. Only if you're certain that someone will snag him before your second pick rolls around should you grab him in the first round. Otherwise take a more highly valued player in the first and grab Suggs on the way back around. If it helps to keep him undrafted, you can talk up the painful neck stinger that Suggs suffered during the week that has kept him out of practice and the preseason game against the Bears, and has him probable for a punishing by the Ravens D in week 1. You can mention that William Green has been matching him play for play during the preseason so it looks like RBBC for Cleveland this year. You can suggest that Lee Suggs was only a fourth round draft pick by a team that historically drafts very poorly for good reason. You can even talk about the so-so Browns offensive line that will likely keep the Browns rushing attack at or below the 20th place ranking it held last year. All of these things should sour the other drafters on Suggs enough for him to still be available at pick #17.



That's the fortunate thing about our lineup rules. I can start 1 RB and 4 WR if necessary. That's why I didn't spend many middle round picks on backup RBs. I see we both have Wayne and Branch on our teams. I got them at picks #66 and #86, respectively. Both times there were a few owners near me who were angry at me for snatching them up.


After grinding through three hours to draft for 10 teams yesterday, I can't imagine how painful a sixteen team draft would be. You are thin at RB behind Holmes, but he's as good as two RBs all by himself. My only suggestion would be to look at some of the fullbacks like Richie Anderson, Mike Alstott or Zack Crockett. They won't bring big stats, but they'll probably be more consistent producers than Bell, Jackson, or Moore at this point.

Brad

Brad, I grabbed Branch at #76 and Wayne at #93, and I definitely ticked a few guys off -- especially with Branch. Other later picks that got some reactions were Fargas at #117 and Gannon at #124.

Some of the strangest picks in our draft were Trent Green in the 2nd round (#19) and Eddie George in the 4th round (#44) before Charlie Garner, Michael Bennett, and Lee Suggs were taken. I picked up TGreen in another draft in the 7th round, and he went as the 3rd QB in this draft by a new owner.


We can do the same thing. In fact, last season I was loaded with RBs and weak at WR, so I started 4 RBs many weeks (AGreen, Edge, DDavis and AThomas) and almost finished first. This season I can forsee starting 3 RBs and 2 WRs many weeks -- and maybe 4 RBs if Wheatley can't hold up in Oakland.

I took part in my very first FF draft yesterday and picked first in a 10 team league. Here's the format of my league (Also have 3 defensive players):

1 QB
3 WR
2 RB
1 TE
2 WR/RB
1 K
1 DEF

My team:

QB - Peyton
WR - L Coles, D Jackson, C Chambers
RB - Holmes, Dillon
TE - Shockey
RB/WR - T Barber, R Wayne
K - R Longwell
D - Jacksonville

Bench - (QB)Bulger, (WR)D Bennett, (RB)D Foster, (WR)R Ferguson, (RB)C Taylor, (TE)D Graham


I think my receivers might be a little weak. Maybe Peyton and Holmes can win it for me?

Ok, we had a ten team draft, I drafted 9. Here's how it went:

Sixteen round draft. The top is in the order of the draft # picked

9 RB Johnson, Rudi CIN
12 RB Davis, Stephen CAR
29 QB Green, Trent KC
32 TE Gonzalez, Tony KC
49 -TRADE-
52 WR Galloway, Joey TB
69 WR Rogers, Charles DET
72 RB Duckett, T.J. ATL
B. Leftwich Jax
T. Duckett ATL
W. McGahee BUF
R. Dayne NYG
A. Boldin ARI
R. McMichael MIA
A. Vinatieri NE
Philly Def PHI
Dolphins Def MIA
J. McCareins NYJ

Chris, what happened to Lee Suggs? I cannot believe that McCariens dropped that far in your draft. He's a great pickup for your last pick.

Suggs went 21 in our draft. Too high for me I wasn't willing to let a #12 pick go for that when I had Stephen Davis on the board and pretty much knew I could get him in a trade. Just changed my mind S. Davis wasn't even in my list, but he made for good bait later..

I figured to pick him at #29. I don't know what happened to McCariens. I have a feeling he'll click this year with Pennington, but apparently others didn't think so; I need to check the injury wire. Right now I have a trade option out for Suggs, we'll see. I'm somewhat dissapointed with my defence; Philly will do me well, but I valued KC above theirs.. yes, there defense sucks in the real game, but thanks to Dante, they were very good to me fantasy wise last year

A few notable foul ups about our draft.. we used FanBall.Com, as I like the ability to customize, but:

* Still listed Morten Anderson (KC) for (K) instead of Tynes, so in round 15, someone selected Ricky Williams after letting everyone know the pick represented Tynes on mutual agreement of the league.

* As is always, our top RBs went right in order (Holmes, LT, etc.)

In the 20s, we had a run of QB, starting out with Culpepper, leaving me last to grab green. However, looking at the board, I think more then a few made mistakes to make the picks they did, we'll have to see.

In the late rounds, I figured take some chances; so I took Boldin, on the hope that his projections are right and he'll be ready to play at game 5/6. I did trade a pick (Michael Vick) straight up, with incentives, and got Lee Suggs, so I'm happy. I think Vick is going to be terrible this year in the west coast offense.

Here are some of my teams, first an auction league (and their final prices), just my starters.

Salary Cap = $200

QB - Manning $40, Palmer $5
RB - Holmes $36 (Keeper), Rudi Johnson $24
WR - Steve Smith $28, Joe Horn $16, L Coles $11
TE - Jim Kleinsasser $1
K - John Hall $1
Def - Tampa Bay $1

Notable Backups:

Rattay $1, Chris Brown $10, McCareins $3, Lloyd $2, Jon Kitna (Palmer insurance) $1



Here's my other money league, traditional draft:

QB - Favre, Green (Brad Johnson backup)
RB - McCallister, D Davis (Bennett, Martin, Moe Williams backup)
WR - Steve Smith, Issac Bruce, Jerry Porter (McCareins, Lloyd, Terrell, Ferguson among backups)
TE - Heap (forgot who is the backup heh)
K - Wilkens
Def - Baltimore (Dallas backup)

Both are just 8 team leagues. Everyone's team is fairly even with their own strengths and weaknesses.