Wow! I didn't expect this: I think I'm done w/ analog amps (receiver or separates) (1 Viewer)

[Kevin Alexander]

The XR70 is already being sold at Onecall and J&R Electronics, but people still don't seem to be giving up their XR45's.

 

[FeisalK]

darn. I guess it's cheap enough to keep, maybe use in party mode or something

 

[Danny Tse]

Exactly, Bruce. One reason I chose the JVC F10 over the Panasonic was its "superior" analog line stage. However, since owners of the JVC mentioned that there's definitely a change for the worse when it's used in the digital or regular analog (maybe going thru an analog >> digital >> analog conversion) inputs as compared to the 5.1 analog inputs, I have effectively one input for my high-resolving source. Which isn't enough for me. And thus my decision to keep my Cambridge Audio integrated and use it as a pre-amp.

 

[Kevin Alexander]

Has anyone tried using 2 Pannys strictly for their amp sections w/ a separate 7.1 pre/pro or 7.1 receiver? I assume you would have to have main ins on the receiver or pre/pro, or will just pre/outs work?

Also, how do you think this will affect the sound quality, since you're introducing a separate device. Will I have the same clean sound as if using only the Panny?

 

[Danny Tse]

Kevin,

As I understand it, technically, none of the Panasonic receiver has pre-outs/main-ins. However, you can access the 5.1 inputs as main-ins. Given the posts on audiocircle.com sounds like the analog section of the XR50/70 is an improvement over the XR25/45 and is quite transparent. I've been reading thru the posts over there and now trying to decide whether to go the TEAC power amp route or replace my Cambridge Audio integrated amp with a Panasonic receiver (which will give a tuner and multi-channel capability as well).

As for the XR45 vs. XR70, according to one of the modders on audiocircle.com the XR45 is more robust. Check out the below link for photos comparing the internals of the two receivers....

http://www.audiocircle.com/circles/v...r=asc&start=30

 

[Aaron Smithski]

Even if this was possible, doing so would negate the Panasonic's best quality -- the fact that there is not any additional d/a conversion going on before the amps! This seems to be where the 'magic' is.

My original plan for the theater amplifier power was to run my Parasound HCA-1205A (200x5 @ 4 ohms), and purchase a Parasound HCA-1500A (315x2 @ 4ohms) -- about $1250 used for the two of them. The pre/pro plan was to get an Outlaw 950 -- about $600 used.

After hearing all the praise for the Panasonics, I found an XR-45 on eBay and decided to give it a whirl. The short story is I'm going to be keeping the XR-45.

Note that I don't think the XR-45 lays waste to the Parasound/Outlaw combo...but I could not substantiate the $1600 difference. My Tannoy speakers are pretty efficient (92 dB) and my room is not huge (2400 cubic feet), so the XR-45 drives everything louder than I care to listen -- and I like it loud! The Panny is remarkable for what it does, considering it's cost and 9-pound weight.

 

[Kevin Alexander]

Aaron, you lucky dog! Congrats on being able to snag up a XR-45!

 

[Aaron Smithski]

Kevin -- finding the XR-45 was one of those 'all the moons were aligned' kind of deals!

The seller was from Canada, had only 6 feedback, and it was a 3-day listing that ended on a Wednesday morning at 9:00 a.m. I ended up getting it for $251.

There are always people that find a better deal though. I've heard of a few guys getting their XR-45's for $100 or less from pawn shops, etc. that have no idea that there are folks out there that will pay 3 times that amount for this piece.

I felt lucky even finding one...guess I don't spend enough time in the pawn shops!

 

[BruceD]

Danny,

If you use the new XR-70 with a companion Panasonic player (forgot model #), you can stay digital (HDMI) from player to XR-70 for CD, DVD, and DVD-A, but not SACD.

 

[Danny Tse]

How about $1,100 for a modded XR45 on Audiogon.com?

No dice with SACD staying digital....seems like if I am dealing with SACD, it will do a A/D/A conversion with either the TEAC or the Panasonic.

 

[FeisalK]

wont the new Denon (2910, 3910?) output SACD in the HDMI connection?

 

[Danny Tse]

the Denon 3910 alone cost more than my entire system

 

[FeisalK]

there's that... :

 

[Kevin C Brown]

I don't think any player at the moment outputs SACD DSD over HDMI. Only i.Link for now.

 

[Nigel Hooper]

Here's a rather bad review of a Panny.

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-...?reviewid=5074

 

[FeisalK]

I wonder about electronics and breaking-in (or whatever it is that happens) but it appears these Pannys need about 300 hrs to bed in. brash could be bright could be by comparison? - brit amps generally sound warmer (NAD, Arcam?)

there's a new review of a Panasonic XR50 on Audioasylum (Quote: "When brand new, the Panny was very bright/too bright. That has improved considerably after 4 months")

 

[Danny Tse]

I have went through almost all of the threads at audiocircle.com and the concensus is that these digital amps need to be broken in over hundreds of hours and that the replacement of the stock power cord is highly recommended. For the Panasonic XR receivers, the replacement of the PC is easy since it's detachable. The JVC is another story though.

As for comparison to other gear, I've read these receivers/amps have replaced separates costing thousands of $$$ from their owners.

Check out this thread on the $99.00 TEAC digital power amp.

 

[Kevin Alexander]

Any suggestions or links as to what to replace the cord with?

 

[BruceD]

Nigel,

Your "bad review" link is a bit suspect, IMO. They site Sony digital amps as "State of the Art", the most ridiculous statement I've ever heard (as many on the forums have complained about the sound quality from Sony digital amps and I think Sony had a bunch of recalls).

I'm not saying Panasonic digital amps (Actually Texas Instruments chips) are the best, but I think the magazine likely didn't even listen to the Panasonic and just assumed it had the same brash/harsh sound as all previous Panasonic analog amps. Remember these mags take advertising, and I don't really trust their reviews.

As I said previously, these TI "Power DAC" chips are the only digital amp technolgy that doesn't run the digital source signal through additonal A/D/A cycles, i.e. the most direct path from source to speakers. The additional A/D/A cycles used in other digital amps is likely to degrade the quality of the original source signal.

 

[Nigel Hooper]

The British rags are the most unbiased in the world and I am quite certain they listened and there are measurements as well. I rather like the TI amps but they have never really had a favourable professional review.