Will we ever see 16:9 pan & scan?

Discussion in 'DVD' started by Dave Poehlman, Apr 9, 2003.

  1. Dave Poehlman

    Dave Poehlman Producer

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    I was just sitting here at work thinking about my HT as I often do. :b And I was wondering.. with the imminent take-over of 16:9 sets... will the J6P's be requesting that 2.35:1 films be pan & scanned down to 16:9?

    Will we have a whole new OAR battle on our hands?

    Just thinking out loud, really.

    Any responses to this somewhat rhetorical thread appreciated.
     
  2. Ken Seeber

    Ken Seeber Supporting Actor

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    In a way, we already are. Director Roger Donaldson has chosen to reframe "The Recruit," which was 2.35:1 theatrically to 1.78:1 for the DVD.

    To be precise, "The Recruit" was shot in SUper 35, so it isn't true panning-and-scanning, but it is a reformatting to fit a 16:9 screen.
     
  3. Dmitry

    Dmitry Supporting Actor

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    Ken beat me to it, but here's a link to the thread discussing the Recruit.
     
  4. Michael Reuben

    Michael Reuben Studio Mogul

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    You're late to the party, Dave. [​IMG] HBO has been doing this with 2.35:1 films on their HD channel for years, despite loud protests from the HT community. They claim to have survey evidence demonstrating that the public wants this, but at the time they implemented the policy, almost no one had HD-capable hardware.

    M.
     
  5. Tony-B

    Tony-B Producer

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    It will sure happen on DVD. It will not be pretty. 3 versions for some movies (WS OAR, WS P&S, and regular P&S)?!?!?! Ugh.
     
  6. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Lead Actor

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    Is it only in North America that this is happening? It seems strange and disturbing to me that such a movie pioneering country should be so backwards when it comes to properly displaying movies in their correct aspect ratios while other countries are not.
     
  7. Simon Massey

    Simon Massey Cinematographer
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    No this happens in the UK as well. Films on both the BBC and ITV are modified to fit a 16:9 screen
     
  8. DaViD Boulet

    DaViD Boulet Lead Actor

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    Hopefully we'll have HD-DVD for the 'elite' viewer who appreciates OAR while DVD becomes the "full frame 16x9" format for the masses...

    dave [​IMG]
     
  9. Patrick McCart

    Patrick McCart Lead Actor

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    Probably, but it'll likely be a "dual format" situation. I'd rather see, for example, a DVD of Blazing Saddles with a 1.78:1 pan & scan transfer along with a 2.35:1 transfer.

    I'm hoping that Academy Frame films stay that way. Classic films will likely be immune to this because no one wants to buy 16x9 Citizen Kane. Nobody.
     
  10. Ricardo C

    Ricardo C Producer

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    The Freddie Mercury Tribute Concert was "tilt & scanned" from 4x3 to 16x9. Pissed me off [​IMG]
     
  11. Craig Beam

    Craig Beam Screenwriter

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    I dunno, Patrick.... aren't they already doing "tilt and scan" reformatting (3:4 to 16:9) on select TV shows (CHEERS, for example) for future HD broadcasts? Why not Academy ratio films too? If the TVs become rectangular, what's displayed on 'em will surely follow.... good news for widescreen cinema, bad news for TV.
     
  12. Jesse Skeen

    Jesse Skeen Producer

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    They should put 2 versions of the movie on each disc (if they're going to do pan and scan at all)- one a proper aspect ratio presentation, the other pan-and-scanned for 16x9 version with the 4x3 pan and scan flag enabled to 'fill up' 4x3 screens.
    It sucks that I can't buy certain movies in widescreen, but I can get the Queen videos cropped for widescreen!
     
  13. MarkHastings

    MarkHastings Executive Producer

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    My Mits 16x9 TV has a 'zoom' mode that zooms into 2.35:1 anamorphic video to get rid of the small black bars (by cutting off the sides).

    Hopefully more tv's will have this option so J6P can do this manually rather than the studios screwing with our movies.
     
  14. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Hollywood has a knack for screwing with movies.

    Dan
     
  15. Mark Walker

    Mark Walker Cinematographer
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    Playing By Heart was clearly a 2.35:1 AR film, but the DVD is something like 1.85:1. It is most obvious during the final credits when the AR moves to 2.35:1 to get all the credits in the frame.

    Love the movie, but the framing on the DVD pisses me off.


    Mark
     
  16. Pehr

    Pehr Extra

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    Swedish "Chanel 4" (no connection to the UK chanel)
    showed "Ben Hur" a few months ago, in anamorphic 16:9 'pan&scan'
     
  17. Paul_Stachniak

    Paul_Stachniak Screenwriter

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    I been watching Fellowship of the Rings in Full frame 16x9 HD here in Canada, and I'll be honest. I don't like it.

    It's like... one wall has been knocked down, and behind it, is another stupid wall. Will the general public just not be happy until those damn black bars are gone?

    What's this going to come to? 2:35:1 TVs? But of course Hollywood will have to widen the current ratio to something like 3:67:1, and so there will still be bars when shown on the new 2:35 TVs... and before you know it...

    huh..

    Sorry. Got a little out of hand there. Suffice it to say, it's not getting any better as technology improves.
     
  18. Juan C

    Juan C Second Unit

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    The Belgian edition of Felicia's journey (shot on Anamorphic 35mm) is pan-and-scanned to 1.78:1.

    And I too fear that this will be more and more frequent.
     
  19. James Lambert

    James Lambert Stunt Coordinator

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    I own a "widescreen" VHS of the lost boys, which has an AR of about 1;85 (According to IMDB it should be 1;2.35). This was bought about 6-7 years ago when Widescreen TVs were booming. In fact there was quite a brouhaha on a primetime "customer issues" program Watchdog about Titanic still having black bars when shown on a widescreen TVs. But in the same programme they complained that it was about 3 minutes shorter and must be missing something (PAL speedup).
     
  20. Iain Lambert

    Iain Lambert Screenwriter

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    I saw that Watchdog too (oddly enough). The look of exasperation on the FOX UK exec as they were barracked for daring to release the 'widescreen' VHS in anything other than the shape of a 'widescreen' TV was just heartbreaking.

    This is now happening a fair bit in the UK, with discs like "U-571" and "Gosford Park" being opened to 16x9 even though they are 2.35:1 films.
     

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