Will DVD-Audio Survive (1 Viewer)

[StaceyS]

There is no reason why we couldn't have A/V devices using DVI for all A/V, and audio-only devices using FireWire.

It is cost prohibitive.

Don't think in terms of cost of single chip or connector. Think in terms of engineering resources to design and implement, and the annual license that must be paid for both 5C and HDCP. Companies can't afford to pay both.

Everyone was expecting big announcements at CES in regards to products with the "standard" digital interface, but it did not happen. Looks like nothing new for 2k3.

I believe companies have to spend >$100k a year in license fees just to build a DVD-V/A player. (Those who actually make DVD players, not just re-badge.)

 

[Lee Scoggins]

$100k a year in license fees just to build a DVD-V/A player.

Stacey or Ian, do you know what the corresponding license fees are for Super Audio?

Thanks.

 

[StaceyS]

Lee, I do not.

 

[AaronBatiuk]

Don't think in terms of cost of single chip or connector. Think in terms of engineering resources to design and implement, and the annual license that must be paid for both 5C and HDCP. Companies can't afford to pay both.

And that is why consensus is needed, not only on the technology to be used, but on reasonable licensing fees for that technology.

License fees will be simpler to pay and hopefully less in amount once highly integrated chipsets appear (Firewire and/or DVI on-chip). Such LSI's could be delivered to manufacturers with a fees paid & included in per-chip costs. Engineering resources will be less taxed once reference designs appear based on these LSI's. This won't happen overnight; the first generation of players to use whatever new intereconnect technology comes about will be expensive due to the complexity of design and implementation. I assume that the cost will drive down with integration, just like x86 motherboard chipsets that have USB, USB2, 1394, audio with S/PDIF, video, all built-in. The typical "chipset" on a modern integrated motherboard is one or two primary ICs providing dozens of functions at very low cost.

 

[Mark All]

I just feel the acoustic event we have in the studio can not be sufficiently captured where one can really get into the performance and not think about the hardware side of the equation. With high rez, we have a chance to change that and bring the sonics of really fine LP down to the realm of a $1K CD player.

Wow, this thread has gathered a lot of interest.
I've very recently gone back and listened critically to common recordings I have on LP and CD vs. DVD-A and SACD. Before I recently bought a decent turntable, I didn't realize or pay much attention to how unnatural some instruments sound when played back on CD. Back in the 80s I ignored complaints about the "harshness" of digital audio and evenually stashed away my LPs and direct drive turntable. Six-hundred CDs later, I'm starting to replace favorite recordings from CD on DVD-A and SACD, as well as on LP if I find a mint condition copy for cheap. All four formats have a place in my listening, although I would rank order my preference in terms of musicality and overall sound quality now as SACD, DVD-A, LP (can't get rid of all surface noise), CD, MP3. In terms of convenience and accessibility I'd rank order as MP3, CD, LP, SACD, DVD-A. Will DVD-A survive? It's on the bottom of my convenience and accessibility list now. I hope the labels get their acts together with DVD-A and come through on their commitments because I'd like to be able to replace my old recordings within the next few years--hint to the labels that some people are eager to spend again for good music in high resolution they already have in an inferior format. SACD seems to be leading in this regard right now.

 

[StaceyS]

License fees will be simpler to pay and hopefully less in amount once highly integrated chipsets appear (Firewire and/or DVI on-chip).

While it might change per connector cost or chip cost, the license for 5C and HDCP will not.

Some technology must be renewed each year.

If you want to build a DVD player, you must license macrovision. Up front that is a lot. (>$30k) That is for 480i only. If you want $480p, it is another fee $$$. You must then pay > $10k per year to continue to make players. If you are no longer making players but you still have inventory for sale, you must continue to pay the >$10k. (I have to be a bit vague on the numbers.)

CSS is about >$10k per year. CPPM is also >$10k per year.

All of these costs are just to be allowed make the players. They have nothing to do with the parts used.

It is an expensive business and is why most high end companies just OEM from someone else. Of course some of them should still be paying fees, but they don't. (they are under the radar.)

So companies can buy parts today with macrovision even though they are not a license of macrovision. This is not the case for HDCP. If you are not a licensee, you can't buy the parts.

 

[Mike Click]

I think it will go the same route as DCC, Remember when compact cassette went to Digital Compact Cassette. Format didn't go over the price was high and the tapes wouldn't go much further than the standard tapes would. IMHO

 

[KeithH]

Mike, there are some fundamental differences between DCC and DVD-Audio. DCC may have offered better sound quality than analog cassettes, but DCC came along at a time when interest in the analog cassette was starting to fade. Analog casettes wear out over time, and DCC did not completely eliminate that as a problem (tapes simply wear out). Furthermore, DCC offered, at best, CD sound quality. CDs were already ubiquitous when DCC came around, and consumers who felt the need to record were happy with the analog cassette. Finally, pre-recorded DCCs were few and far between, whereas pre-recorded analog cassettes were numerous. DCC simply did not fit in the marketplace (neither did DAT). Consumers saw no benefit to jumping from CDs and analog cassettes to DCC.

DVD-Audio, on the other hand, offers clearly better sound quality than CD. Furthermore, DVD-Audio offers high-resolution surround sound, unlike the CD. Finally, DVD-Audio offers video content, unlike the CD. Whether or not these advantages associated with DVD-Audio will translate to mass-market acceptance remains to be seen. However, DVD-Audio clearly has advantages over the CD that DCC did not.