Fingers crossed for somehow getting more Love Boat on dvd... at any price!Neil Brock said:
Not sure how many Warner Archive you have seen but so far I have: Cheyene, Courtship of Eddie's Father, Girl From Uncle and have seen in person from a friends copies The F.B.I and Daktari and all of them are on par with the best of Paramount. Cheyene is every bit as good as Gunsmoke in Quality . Nothing they have released so far looks as bad as Have Gun Will Travel and Rawhide. I stopped buying both of those shows once they went to split seasons as it was not worth the premium price they want as split seasons for a lesser quality release. Even though the shows are good. For a price comparison Cheyene Season 2 and 3 are 20 one hour episodes the same as 40 1/2 hour episodes of Gunsmoke or one season 39 episodes. Amazon Generally has each Gunsmoke Volume on an everday price from $22.00 to $26.00 so an average of $24.00 per volume or $48.00 a season. Cheyene has a list of $49.99 a season with an everyday discount of $5.00 and everyday coupon of another $5.00 for a total of $39.99 for an everyday price. So definately cheaper than Gunsmoke on an everyday price. Now if you wait of course you can find a big sale for a little more of a discount on the Gunsmoke title just as you can find 20 -25% off of Cheyene plus a coupon code. I may find an archive title on ebay for $10-$12.00 but that doesn't mean its fair to compare that as a standard price anymore than it is to use a 50% off sale that some website may have once or twice a year as standard pricing on Paramount titles. Bottom Line is both Paramount and Warner Archive are asking the same premium prices for their titles so you really have to want the title or wait for a big sale to justify it. Everyday discount prices on WA titles are nearly as cheap as everyday Paramount titles. Heavier and similar discounts are available on both WA and PAramount titles if you want to wait. So far all WA titles have been of excellent quality while Paramount is sometimes excellent and sometimes poor and Paramount sometimes has issues with music replacement.. So I just can't see the Logic other than pure bias in constantly ripping the high WA pricing when Paramount has an equal pricing scheme with not always the same quality level.smithb said:
I hope thats true. I would love to see Beverly Hillbillies, Petticoat Junction and My Three Sons continued.Neil Brock said:
Sorry but I have to disagree with you. First off for price comparisons, you are using Gunsmoke against Cheyenne. From a content length comparison that is fine but not from a pricing side. Gunsmoke and Perry mason are perhaps the most expensive of the CBS/P sets and even regular purchasers have complained about them in their split volumes (even I wouldn't blind buy them). There are many other CBS/P titles that are regilar priced well below that (e.g., Beverly Hillbillies, Petticoat junction) that typically go for $22-$25 a full season. Cheyenne on the other hand appears to be on the cheaper side of WBA titles. As I listed in my post, to be fair you have to compare apples to apples, which means either comparing the entire price range of titles per season from each studio, or at the very least Perry Mason and Gunsmoke against Tarzan and FBI. Even WB pressed disks go for cheaper then the WBA releases (e.g., Maverick). You took one example Cheyenne and Gunsmoke to make a case. I provided several and can provide even more. They aren't the same pricing scheme. With current discounts, Tarzan full season could probably be had for $60 - $70, while Maverick goes fro $30. As far as sales go, you make it seem like WBA has discounts and sales to the same degree as often as the competitive pricing between Amazon, BN, and other such vendors. I just don't find that to be the case in my experience. As for video quality, I have Cheyenne and Courtship of Eddie's Father, and I've seen FBI. Cheyenne in no way competes with Gunsmoke or Perry Mason. They aren't even close. The WBA Cheyenne is a little better then the Encore captures I made. Believe me I watch these on a 92" screen and there are definitely differences in detail level and the cleanup that was done during the remastering for HD. It would be good news if WBA continues to approach remastering, like Tarzan. But at this point I would say that WBA has been careful to only select titles that are in better then average quality without the needing to go further. While CBS/P has many more released titles that frankly show the various difference in quality of masters available when not remastered. Lets wait to see more titles from WBA before judging quality. I'll bet they have their fair share of problems with source masters as well. We just haven't seem them yet with the limited number of releases. I'm not biased against WBA. The fact is that I've been able to pick up quite a few blind-buys over the years buying cheaper titles from other studios. Some of these becoming new favorites. But i find that harder to justify with WBA pricing. Sure a must own I will buy no problem from WBA (e.g., Courtship of Eddie's Father). But I'm choosier where I spend my money on blind-buys, and a cheaper price offsets some of the risk.Randy Korstick said:
The thing is, it really isn't even WBA vs. CBS/P. I think because CBS/P has a few more expensive titles like Perry Mason it draws the comparison. I don't know of anyone that is happy paying even the Perry Mason price per volume. Those of us that do, it is because it is a series we want. But the majority of CBS/P pricing is lower then that, just like many other studio's and their pricing. I didn't want to pay what I had to pay for the last season of FKB's from Shout!, but i did because it is the only game in town with the title, and i wanted it. However, I had no problem picking up the earlier FKB seasons for a much cheaper price so that I could judge how much interest I had. What makes WBA standout for me, as other similarly priced specal programs, is that the higher pricing is the norm. Where as for most other studio's the higher pricing seems to be the exception for a select few. That is the disappointment and what limits my interest to just "must own" titles, and leaves out the "might be interesting to try" titles. Now i may have to change my approach and just buy less if this is the future, but as long as I can get other titles for cheaper i can continue to experiment with my purchases looking for the next new favorite to add to my collection.Gary OS said:
I can ony comment for myself, but MGM never entered the picture for me because of the lack of content available, and titles of interest based on what has been listed about their potential catalog. So my approach towards MGM's prgram is the same as WBA. Truth is, no one is really talking about it, so what is there to respond to. But i agree with with you about MGM's program.Jack P said:
I agree, if CBS/P or any other studio's venture into this model I doubt it will be any different. And while I agree that content and quality of a release can always be compared, i see no reason that price be left out. As a consumer, i don't care about models, i just care about content availability, quality, and pricing since it all goes into my purchasing decisions. I see no reason to leave one characteristic out because a particular model treats it differently.Jack P said:
We'll agree to disagree as there are many more examples Bonanza being another I would like to buy but it remains around $24.-$26.00 per half season and $48.-$52.00 is more then I'm willing to spend for that show. So I wish I had the money but I can't buy too many blind buys or mild interst shows from either WA or Paramount because of the similarly high prices. Only titles I really want but at least WA I always know, so far the quality is high. Yes there are many Paramount titles that end up in bargain bins and cheap sales but that is also due to poor sales and those shows are usually discontinued so thats not always a good thing. I watch an episode of Gunsmoke and Cheyenne every week on a 56" HD TV and the quality is nearly identical. Are you comparing Season One of Cheyenne or Season Two and Three? Because the quality of Season One is not as good as 2 and 3 so that maybe why you are seeing a difference. But if I really thought there was a big drop as you are saying from Gunsmoke to Cheyenne then that would make the Timeless Westerns unwatchable other than the awesome looking Virginian releases. I find the rest just watchable but am grateful to have these over nothing but I feel Timeless is way over priced. Yes I know big discounts are easy to find on their stuff but I won't pay over $25.00 for their titles other than Virginian and usually feel I over paid because of the lack of quality. Most of their releases are on par with bargain bin public domain titles that normally sell for $10.00-$15.00 for a set like theirs and I feel thats what most of their titles should be regulalry selling for. So I appreciate Timeless for releasing obscure westerns and a few other shows but not for over charging for something they do no mastering or restoration work on and generally look poor to barely acceptible.smithb said:
Timeless: Interesting,.... over several years of collecting, 1) I've never paid anything close to WBA list prices for my TV/DVD sets. 2) Comparable to PD? The vast majoriry of their releases, not close to me at all with that "party line" comparison Excepting for "M Squad", which is bad, no question about that one, and "Arrest & Trial", the rest of my Timeless inventory looks considerably better than a few Alpha / PD quality releases. Continuous pricing comparisons: Well, those of us that have collected studio sets for years, all disagree with the few staunch proponents that regularly appear when their WBA realm seems threatened and attempt to win this ongoing debate point. "Bias" card being played: Note to all here, that this card was first played by the few WBA proponents. Naturally, that's a two-way street. I've seen this stuff posted prevoiusly here, and probably more on the movie board, where they will also use the "whiner" analogy for those that have different pov on this subject. It's another "round" of a "Capital Hill" scene, where the two aisles will most likely never see it the same As for "What it" comparisons, ie, attempting to compare a not-yet existant CBS/P MOD program's pricings, well, we know what that's all about However, it's refreshing to see, this time, the absence of a comment from, yes, one of the WBA proponents that has told us in the past (since they know that their pro-WBA stance isn't by any means unanimous), "If you don't like it, get another hobby!!". That's verbatim and it's something that, as one that disagrees with their pov about this issue, I've never posted those comments. If we didn't know better, we'd think that we have about 2-3 WB employees that post about this ongoing subject
Yes I agree Jeff you are practically perfect in every way. End of debate. No other point of view is worthy of more than a few posts or two before being ridiculed by your superior intellect. I also like how you say its not biased but yet make your whole post based on WA proponents when that is not the case. I stated I buy Paramount and WA but am selective because I admitted both are overpriced so no proponent of one or the other here. I just appreciate studios that are still releasing classic films and TV shows and Warner is one of the few left and I don't get the contant singling out of WA for the price structure when Paramount has the identical price Structure and Fox used the same structure when they still released classic TV.Jeff Willis said:Yes, WBA proponents, I'll agree to disagree once again, "surprise surprise"
My HDTV has a Small-Screen Mode that I use whenever I'm watching a low-quality DVD. I euphamastically call it "Mill Creek Mode". If you ever watched any of their PD "Shovelware" Sets you know the quality leaves a lot to be desired. Whenever I discover I'm watching a low quality Video, I switch to the smaller screen and continue to view away!silverking said:
But that is just it, we do not agree about the price structure's being identical between MOD program's and typical pressed disks. Especially when considering street price. Again, how can you argue with WB's own "Maverick" (the complete first season) being available for pre-order at $30, when most MODs by WBA average around $60 to $80 a season when released. Yes, some releases by other studio's can be closer in line to WBA, and Yes there may be quality differences that you aren't willing to pay for, but overall the pricing of "pressed" disks is undeniably cheaper then MOD titles across the board (not just WBA).Randy Korstick said:
Actually, in my case, I'm not disappointed at all (if that's was how it came off). I was just noting there are visual differences between the referenced releases. I'm just appreciative of the content being available and understand the difficulties in getting some of the releases out at all. For example, I own many Timeless releases and just watched five episodes of M-Squad on the 92" screen the other night. No problems and enjoyed the opportunity to be able to watch this great show. What i have difficulty with on the big screen isn't washed out prints like M-Squad and Texan where there is still a sense of detail, but highly overly compressed video where someone tries to fit eight hours of content on a four hour disk, and everything has a "blocky" feel to it.silverking said:
