Warner Archive Launches Streaming Service (1 Viewer)

[Randy Korstick]

Michael and I have been through thick and thin on message boards since 2002 (wow, where does the time go??), and I have been telling him this very same thing all along. Michael is relatively younger than many of us (though he is about to turn 33 as I recall), and I have always been absolutely AMAZED at his appetite for old films -- even the more experimental silent ones coming from 1900. But Michael is in a tiny minority. There is just no way there will be that many younger people caring to stream ancient black and white movies... we're lucky when most of them venture before 1990!

I remember you guys from a now defunct forum that had a horror forum. I can't remember the name but it goes back to 2002 and I think has been out of service for at least 6 years.

 

[Ed Lachmann]

What I HATE about this is that films and TV shows I would buy in a second are ONLY AVAILABLE in this damned streaming form. Countless times I've written to Warners pleading for a release of 77 SUNSET STRIP and HAWAIIAN EYE, but to no avail. My blood boiled when I saw them both on the streaming list. I'd pay anything for BDs of FREAKS and AUNTIE MAME, but I'll be dead in my grave before they make them available to people like me who'd love to own them. It may be nice for people who want to "sample" something before buying it, but what about people who WANT to buy it, but the God damned studios won't make it available to them. I'm about sick of the whole stinking mess and ready to give up buying anything anymore. How are these IDIOTS planning to reduce piracy when they won't give anyone the opportunity to buy what they want and make all these dream releases streaming downloads only?

 

[Richard V]

^^^^ Fully agree

 

[Joe Karlosi]

That's another thing -- wasting HD opportunities on Streaming Only. How ridiculous. Why should someone who only cares to watch a movie streamed one time get to see it in HD, when the diehard fan of the film who would love to own it on Blu-ray cannot have it released that way? Who cares about a super-duper, gorgeous transfer that's only gonna get streamed once and forgotten?? Yeah, having an option to either stream or own is one thing; but having some movies "Streaming ONLY" is pathetic.

 

[Ed Lachmann]

Thank you, Richard. I'm just beyond disgusted at ALL the studios and they way they're treating classic films fans who WANT to spend money on their damned product! Warners with their standard DVD only releases of WUTHERING HEIGHTS, THE BISHOP'S WIFE and THE BEST YEARS OF OUR LIVES, Paramount and their 4K restoration of SAMSON AND DELILAH that will ONLY be available in standard DVD and NOW THIS! Why don't they just kick us in the teeth, for Christ's sake!

 

[Nebiroth]

The issue films like this in streaming-only format for two reasons: First, because it is a step further in the MOD model: with streaming you have no phsyical product at all, therefore, there are no production or distribution costs at all, rather than MOD which merely reduces these to a minimum because you only make as many as you actually sell. Naturally, both methods eliminate entirely the risk of producing minimum-production runs of discs that do not sell, leaving the producer with a warehouse full of "dead" product Second, exclusives like this act as a hook to get people into streaming. Here in the UK, for example, the early satellite broadcasters did the same, with many of them offering rarities they knew would be popular with TV or film fans who would happily pay the initial high prices for receivers and dishes. This then gave the broadcasters an initial critical mass of viewers and allowed them to recoup some of their initial costs - and to attract paying advertisers. Streaming is really the old pay-per-view or subscription TV model, given a facelift and some botox to make it look modern. It gives the illusion of viewer control, but in actuality gives the studios back the control they have wanted ever since retail VHS/DVD started out. It does, for example, finally give them the territorial control they have always wanted but never managed to actually enforce - DVD region coding, for example, was a late add-on at the existance of the studios. DVD was originally conceived as an "Any disc - in any player" system. That's why region coding was trivially easy to defeat.

 

[Ed Lachmann]

I get it, no "real" effort, no "real" product plus plenty more time to sit on their fat asses and rake in the dough while being "modern" and "cutting edge" at the same time! I suppose then they won't mind if we do "pirate" what we want to own and burn them onto our own BD/Rs with our own artwork. How could they get upset, they give us NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER! No more "dead" product, like BDs, DVDs, books, record stores, libraries, face to face conversations. As Finley Currie once exclaimed in BEN-HUR, "Judah, I have lived too LONG"!

 

[Joe Karlosi]

No more "dead" product, like BDs, DVDs, books, record stores, libraries, face to face conversations.

Ha! Well said, Ed! One of the truest and most brilliant critiques of today's modern-day cesspool that I have ever read!

 

[MattPriceTime]

I didn't know some people were so oblivious to the huge contributor to the illegal distribution of movies and music in this day and age.

 

[Michael Elliott]

Its not about music but there is 0% difference in illegally downloading music, movies or illeaglly streaming music, movies or TV shows. They are all equally wrong and those who do one usually do all. What do the Bowery Boys or pirated discs have to do with this conversation? I don't deny there are bootleg discs but I also don't care because I would never buy them. Your point was young people were going to flock to this and discover old movies through this service. Thats what the disagreement is about because: 1.) young people interested in old movies are a small minority and 2.) my biggest point is that most(not all) of the young people that are interested in it will not use it because they have to pay for it. They won't pay because they know they can use illeagl sites to get this content free just like they do with newer movies and music. I don't have any problem with the service starting I just don't agree it will be sucessful with younger people for above reasons. Thats all I was trying to say. I'm not sure why you have to take this personnal. I know you have always enjoyed older movies and I think thats great and if you want to use the service then thats great too. I apologize if I offended you, we just apparently disagree on the issue of young people using this service.

Please don't take offense to anything I'm saying. While we certainly aren't going to see eye to eye, nothing I'm saying is meant to be a personal attack and I'm not taking what you're saying to me to be an attack. With that said.... 1. Old movies are a small priority all around. I know people 10-30+ years older than me that don't care for anything pre-1970s. These films certainly aren't paying the bills (why they're MOD) and some aren't worth the disc so a cheaper route is obviously going to be streaming. 2. Kids have more money to spend than their parents usually. Plus, the kids don't have to use their own money and especially if they are living at home and their parents are members. I mean, this is how movies get passed down to the next generation after all. I have two 17-year-old stepdaughters and both of them use my Netflix account all the time. They know of no illegal sites for movies. I'm not saying no one knows of them but... 3. I do get rather offended when older people attack young ones even though I'm not that "young" any more at 32. I say this because from the time I was young I had to hear from "older" people who seemed to know everything about younger people but the majority of these things were just coming from old people who sat around together upset that they were no longer young. I questioned how much experience you have with the "young" because I go to dozens of concerts a year (artists from the 60s-80s) and the majority of people are young. Dylan, Springsteen and countless others have young people there to see them. I also go to several classic movie screenings and once again the majority of the people are young. This is especially true when I watched SINGIN' IN THE RAIN, TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD plus at least a dozen Hitchcock movies on the big screen. There are certainly young people out there who enjoy this stuff but they simply don't feel like debating with older folks who just put them down because they don't know them. I'm sure people questioned what movies you and your friends were watching back in the day. There's really no difference. 4. TCM has opened the gates to young people who enjoy this stuff. Again, Tarantino and Scorsese have a big following among young film buffs and they are constantly shining a light on older movies. This allows them to get interested in new things, introduce their friends to new movies and this is what keep classic films alive. The "original" fans of these movies are long dead by now. Your generation picked them up on TV(??) and then home video came along to keep them alive. They're not going anywhere. I hear some older folks say that once they're gone these movies will die but this is just wishful thinking on their part. 5. Just have faith. Not every teen is into Twilight.

 

[TravisR]

No more "dead" product, like BDs, DVDs, books, record stores, libraries, face to face conversations.

Testify! I went to a comic book store and a record store today and while it's easy to get those things on a computer, that ease of access is not worth what you miss out on. I'm not much of a 'people person' but even I like standing around and BSing about comics, music, movies, TV shows, politics or whatever with likeminded people. Plus, stores full of records or comics have such a great smell (and it's not just the people ) that you can't get from an iPad.

 

[Michael Elliott]

I would only consider it "evil" if it replaced physical media; I want there always to be the option to buy discs (preferably pressed and not MOD, but will take whatever I must there)..

Let's pretend for a second that on 6/6/13 all physical media was going away. Is there really that much that you want that you don't already have? Again, I have streaming on several devices and I think from this point on anytime someone buys equipment they're going to be streaming. My girlfriend just surprised me with a 60-inch television and sure enough, the remote has a Netflix and Amazon button that you push and it goes right to my queue. I've been planning to upgrade televisions and for the past few weeks I've been looking around. All of them have streaming options. As with most new things, I think once people try it and see what it is, they're going to love it.

 

[Michael Elliott]

There's certainly a lot of anger in this thread. Is it really as simple as an age thing? Some of you are cussing and fighting as if Warner killed one of your children.

 

[TravisR]

There's certainly a lot of anger in this thread. Is it really as simple as an age thing? Some of you are cussing and fighting as if Warner killed one of your children.

To paraphrase a fairly famous movie, "Forget it, Michael, it's the internet." I make no secret of wanting own physical copies of the junk that I collect but when I eventually have no choice, I know I'll start downloading. Never say never but I don't think the future is streaming only. Certainly streaming will be a big part of the future and probably the most common way that people watch things. Currently, I don't stream or use On Demand to watch movies all that much (maybe two or three times a month) but it's essentially become a replacement for rentals for me. When I want to own something, I can't imagine that the studios won't still be happy to sell me a copy of a movie that I can legally put on a hard drive (though I couldn't care less about the legality of it) and watch whenever I choose. As long as I can still do that, people can stream movies all they want.

 

[Ed Lachmann]

Well, to tell you the truth, there are hundreds of movies and old TV shows I'd like that I don't already have and several of them will be streaming on Warner's new service. Let's be honest here, how much does it really cost for Warners to release a BD of something they already have in HD format. Not that much. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I think that discs are about as perfect a storage option as one can find. I have early test pressings from 1982 of Japanese promo music CDs a friend gave during a trip to Brazil that year. They play perfectly still. I'd have gone through a dozen hard drives by now and the music would certainly have been lost. I like blu-ray and am one of the damned fools who his replaces regular DVD's with BDs because the image is so much better, especially the widescreen 50's-60's stuff which is still sorely under-represented. Sadly, I'm guilty of being a "collector", like those sad backward hillbillies who still buy records. I'm not so crazy about the web, that electronic Godhead we're forced to pray to, and can't help feeling sick to my stomach over what its ascension has meant to would-be small shop keepers and career musicians whose dreams will never be what they were ever again.

 

[Michael Elliott]

^^^ I don't know which titles that you're wanting but has there been any hint that they won't be released onto some sort of physical media? I know Blu is a far stretch on most of them but three years ago I doubt anyone would expect to see the various titles that are now available. Warner has to thrown some rare stuff on here to make people jump into it. They couldn't exactly compete with Netflix by offering the exact same titles that people were getting there. Still, going as far as people's dreams is taking this a bit too far. A lot of people's dreams couldn't come true in earlier days for a wide variety of reasons so are we really going to resort to blaming the internet now? The invention called sound killed a lot of dreams to silent stars. The invention of television killed off several careers. The home video boom killed the dreams of those loving or running drive-ins. Technology changes things. I don't want to quote a certainly Dylan song but the times do change.

 

[David Weicker]

Let's pretend for a second that on 6/6/13 all physical media was going away. Is there really that much that you want that you don't already have? Again, I have streaming on several devices and I think from this point on anytime someone buys equipment they're going to be streaming. My girlfriend just surprised me with a 60-inch television and sure enough, the remote has a Netflix and Amazon button that you push and it goes right to my queue. I've been planning to upgrade televisions and for the past few weeks I've been looking around. All of them have streaming options. As with most new things, I think once people try it and see what it is, they're going to love it.

Well, in answer to your first question, YES. There is a lot of content that I don't already have. I currently have about 450 movies on disc. Only half of them are blu-ray, the other half haven't been released in the upgraded format. And there are lots of other movies that I still wish to own. As for TVs and other devices having streaming, yes, they do. And I occasionally use them. However, although Amazon has some movies for free (at least free if you have Prime), most movies are not free, Most are $2.99 ($4.99 for HD) - at least the good ones are not free. And Netflix will someday change their pricing strategy. Once they have reached a certain level of subscriber base (or become the only game in town), they will switch over to some type of per watching model. They may not want to, but the studios will drive them to it. If I watch 5 Warners and only 1 Fox movie, Warners will want to charge 5 times as much. So, why streaming may see to be a bargain today, it won't be in the future - especially if you rewatch things. Streaming fills the rental market - a natural progression from Blockbuster. It doesn't fit the collector market. As for trying it and loving it, that is irrelevant. One's love of streaming in no way affects one's love of collecting. David

 

[Michael Elliott]

The question was aimed at Joe because I know him but this content you don't already have is something that's not available on any physical format? Or are you just wanting all of your titles on some sort of upgrade and you fear this might not happen because of streaming? I'm also certain the fear of Netflix being the only game in town isn't going to happen. I don't see Hulu, Amazon, Fandor, HBO, Warner, SugarDVD or countless other pay sites going anywhere. Plus you have dozens of small stations as well as others (Redbox, ClassicFlix) wanting to get in on it. Prices will certainly go up but I know very few items that this doesn't happen to. Plus you have to consider with so many places fighting each other, all of them are having to up what they offer to be the "best" out there. Plus, if it wasn't for streaming (and poor sales) then I doubt most major studios would be handing their bigger titles over to smaller companies to release so you collectors are getting some benefits out of it. The special features is something that will keep DVD sales going. But it goes back to what I said a few hundred posts ago. Right now we have a DVD-R, a stream rental or a download. All parties have something so until only one item is offered, I really don't see why there are so many conspiracy theories. I'm sure Warner is reading this thread and are either laughing at the fear people have or worried that some secret conspiracy code was cracked. I'm willing to bet they are laughing. As for loving it.... I know LD collectors who were showing the same anger at DVD. I know DVD collectors who were showing the same anger at region 2 stuff. More DVD owners were angry when Blu came around. Again, this here is nothing new as people always show some sort of fear but more times than not when you look back it was for nothing. Again, I've yet to have someone explain why I should be worried that the items I bought are going to be taken from me sometime down the line. Is Warner really going to be some Grinch that takes away all my son's Scooby Doo episodes that I bought? C'mon now.

 

[TonyD]

I must have missed something, how do I get this channel to appear on my roku device?

 

[Michael Elliott]

I must have missed something, how do I get this channel to appear on my roku device?

You have to get an invite first. I still haven't received one so I'm guessing my support hasn't gotten anyone's attention to send me one so I can come back here and sing the praises. Hint to Warner.