Walmart thinks people are stupid enough to pay $4 a disk to convert DVDs to dead Ultraviolet (1 Viewer)

[Traveling Matt]

But you see these services are not streaming only.  The electronic sell thru services created by itunes as well as Ultraviolet are not just streaming services as they also allow download to your home PC or server if you choose to do so.  The studios will continue to give the consumer choices to either rent or purchase.

How the soft copy is delivered doesn't really matter. My point is that purchasing is mostly for discs. The Miramax CEO quoted in Sam's articles clearly knows that, which is why he wants to kill rental, lower disc prices and force you to make a purchase. What makes me pause is the potential backlash of eliminating rentals. I don't think many people consider a movie download purchase the same as a music download purchase. It seems most consider discs as a purchase and streams/downloads as a rental, especially under monthly subscription models. I imagine many would therefore equate a forced stream/download purchase to a price hike, even if the cost per movie is less than a DVD. And then, if anything, I'd expect an increase in disc sales.

 

[Dave Scarpa]

All this cloud stuff, whether Netflix, Itunes whatever, the bottom line is that while I can get most Blu Ray's for around $10-$15 bucks or sometimes less why would I ever switch to an inferior Streaming Download. Even the New 1080p Itunes Downloads, if they were cheaper I might consider, but at $2.99 for tv shows and $20 for a movie, no way.

 

[MattAlbie60]

The online chat representative I just spoke with via Paramount Ultraviolet confirmed that there is no customer service number to call, and as far as he knows there will never be one. All you can do if you have a problem is either email the studio Ultraviolet specifically (so if you have a problem with Paramount, go to Paramount) or email the main Ultraviolet account support. Which I've done. And they don't respond to So, yeah. Ultraviolet is great! So long as you never have any problems, ever. If you have a problem, pray that you get to go through one of the studio accounts and not the main one.

 

[Ruz-El]

Originally Posted by Traveling Matt


How the soft copy is delivered doesn't really matter. My point is that purchasing is mostly for discs. The Miramax CEO quoted in Sam's articles clearly knows that, which is why he wants to kill rental, lower disc prices and force you to make a purchase.
What makes me pause is the potential backlash of eliminating rentals. I don't think many people consider a movie download purchase the same as a music download purchase. It seems most consider discs as a purchase and streams/downloads as a rental, especially under monthly subscription models. I imagine many would therefore equate a forced stream/download purchase to a price hike, even if the cost per movie is less than a DVD.
And then, if anything, I'd expect an increase in disc sales.

I don't trust the studios to lower the prices of the disc purchases if there is a first party streaming option and no rental/netflix 3rd party option. I'm basing this on something I have witnessed the past couple weeks in store. This is Jesse Ventura/Anchient Aliens level conspiracy theory, but I can't help but think it's related.


The local HMV* recently bumped up the price on some Bluerays from $32.99 to $34.99. These are titles like "Thor" and "Captain America", titles that have been on the shelf for a while and typically should be on the 2/$30 rack by now. Or would of if two things haven't happened:


1: Blockbuster tanked and there's pretty near no rental stores in Canada anymore to buy previously viewed movies from.


2: Megaupload got busted and sent the fear through the torrent sites causing many others to walk away before the fed got them. (I'm not saying I support the torrents or bootlegging, I'm just stating a fact)


Factor this in with collectors already willing to pay more for less with MOD titles and I think the studios are heading to the goal they want to have, and that's complete control of the pricing of their product in a non-competitive market. Which is fine, more power to them, but you're going to see price gouging. Why would they drop the prices if they are the only option and the market has proven that collectors will pay premium for the titles they want, and joe six pack will pay the same thing on any kid movie their children need?


*Other retailers like Future Shop have since lowered the price into the $20s, which is still far from where titles like this used to be at this point in their shelf life,

 

[Towergrove]

Yes, and I've posted it to you in replies before. http://www.wired.com/cloudline/2011/10/hollywood-hopes-its-ultraviolet-plans-will-quash-cloud-movie-rentals/ http://www.hometheaterforum.com/t/311881/what-is-ultraviolet-and-why-should-you-care/60#post_3858458 I am NOT A CHEERLEADER FOR iTunes/Apple. I am a cheerleader for solutions that don't suck, regardless of who makes them. I use Netflix, Amazon Prime, the Sony Playstation and the Xbox Live Marketplace stores for downloads and even streaming from ISPs and Cable Cos. None of them suck as badly as UVVU does. I've said all along that I am pro for the good stuff that UV -COULD- have done but their implementation was failed from the beginning because they are run by either the greedy or the incompetent. Meanwhile Apple continues to press on and just make shit that works for the good of consumers. Do I wish that there was a solution that put less power in the hands of one single company? YES I DO. Am I willing to trade off of that elegant solution controlled by a benevolent dictator to go to a TERRIBLE TERRIBLE system run by those who are clearly plotting illegal price fixing and to kill rental in the meantime? Hell NO. And meanwhile there are still all those other great solutions giving consumers what they want while Uvvu tries it's failed coup.

Yes i see you are quoting articles and opinion pieces. Where are the quotes from top studio officials indicating they are trying to squash rentals? I see that Mirimax is not an advocate of rental but where didhe say he wants to rid the world of rentals? Otherwise the pieces you quote are speculative in nature. Also you mention price fixing, doesn't Apple set prices for their iTunes store? Would that not be the same thing?

 

[Towergrove]

Originally Posted by MattAlbie60
So, yeah. Ultraviolet is great! So long as you never have any problems, ever. If you have a problem, pray that you get to go through one of the studio accounts and not the main one.

Yes it sounds like they need to work on the customer service aspect of the program. Sounds like a nightmare for you!

 

[Sam Posten]

Yes i see you are quoting articles and opinion pieces. Where are the quotes from top studio officials indicating they are trying to squash rentals? I see that Mirimax is not an advocate of rental but where didhe say he wants to rid the world of rentals? Otherwise the pieces you quote are speculative in nature. Also you mention price fixing, doesn't Apple set prices for their iTunes store? Would that not be the same thing?

Here:

He said the ease of streaming on myriad devices such as a Blu-ray player and video game console is what has made Netflix so popular. “Clearly, if we can create a digital locker experience that is as easy for the consumer and interoperable, then at least [it would be] an opportunity,” Lang said. He said there needs to be discussion among studios regarding pricing of packaged media, including the fact that DVD prices currently are too high at retail, especially for library product. Lang also said studios should not advocate the transactional VOD rental model. “If you really want that film, you should buy it and not rent,” he said. “It doesn’t make any sense to rent it for 24 hours.” The CEO said Miramax is working through the issues — issues he said that are complicated and difficult. “I don’t know how many people use photo sharing software, but that is 90 percent cloud-based,” Lang said. “Ninety-five percent of the software industry in the world is now through cloud-based transactions. I’m hopeful that the movie business gets there.” He said studios need to partner with technology companies and retailers to see what they think will work and then develop a cohesive plan going forward. “Hopefully that will create a purchase-transaction market,” Lang said.

Price fixing / illegal collusion and the death of rental. It's this kind of price fixing that Appe is in trouble over too.

 

[Traveling Matt]

I don't trust the studios to lower the prices of the disc purchases if there is a first party streaming option and no rental/netflix 3rd party option.

Well, I think they would lower disc prices in an attempt to bridge a gap; again, most seem to equate streams/downloads with rentals and would therefore expect to pay a price similar to what they do now whether or not they own it. Lower disc prices would also align better with today's $5 discount bin standard, which seems more common. Either way, the Miramax CEO's suggestions cater to low-priced options when his implied goal is to increase revenue. It looks to be very difficult to return to higher revenue unless you eliminate the lower-priced alternatives. The cost of everything is going up; if the studios want to better fund new projects, as the Wired article says, they need to make even more money than the disc-only days. This is settling for less.

 

[Towergrove]

Originally Posted by Traveling Matt


Well, I think they would lower disc prices in an attempt to bridge a gap; again, most seem to equate streams/downloads with rentals and would therefore expect to pay a price similar to what they do now whether or not they own it. Lower disc prices would also align better with today's $5 discount bin standard, which seems more common.
Either way, the Miramax CEO's suggestions cater to low-priced options when his implied goal is to increase revenue. It looks to be very difficult to return to higher revenue unless you eliminate the lower-priced alternatives. The cost of everything is going up; if the studios want to better fund new projects, as the Wired article says, they need to make even more money than the disc-only days. This is settling for less.

I think people equate streaming with rentals but Downloads? Apple seems to be pretty successful with its download to own category. Im sure those purchasing films from that system have no problem with understanding that ownership model. I believe streaming to most people = Netflix or youtube.


So for a lady like myself who has a large collection of films on disc and plans to continue to collect movies in the digital age, which service do you all think I should go with, Itunes or UV (or maybe both). I think you all have convinced me that there may be better alternatives to UV but im still at a crossroads and havent a clue what to do.

 

[Sam Posten]

My recommendations wouldn't change claim your downloads Look for Bargains on iTunes and Amazon Watch less important content on Netflix Supplement with XBL or Sony if you own a game console No uv. And don't claim uv downloads, that will just encourage them to continue.

 

[Traveling Matt]

I think people equate streaming with rentals but Downloads?  Apple seems to be pretty successful with its download to own category.

That might be, considering the popularity of their devices. But indications are far more people purchase discs to own.

 

[Towergrove]

I just noticed that a few of my recent discs purchased are UV only not iTunes. justice league Doom for example. Hopefully Warner will give me a iTunes code. UGH!

 

[MattAlbie60]

Don't count on it. They turned me down Told me they couldn't give me one for a "myriad of different reasons." Props to the representative for using the word "myriad," I guess.

 

[Ruz-El]

Originally Posted by MattAlbie60 /t/319219/walmart-thinks-people-are...vert-dvds-to-dead-ultraviolet/30#post_3907495

 

[Thomas Newton]

No interest in streaming here. Streaming destroys the ability to watch a movie on a device like an iPod Touch, iPhone, or iPad when stuck in a place like an airport, train station, etc. Public WiFi hotspots often have terms of service prohibiting the use of streaming video. Cell data plans make cellular streaming a really bad idea. So tell me again why I should trade iTunes Digital Copies for Ultraviolet streaming? Or even buy discs that have the Ultraviolet "feature", for that matter?

 

[Thomas Newton]

Doesn't using itunes give you less choice when it comes to what device you play your media on?  Can you play your itunes purchases on devices other than those produced by Apple?

If you're talking about music purchased in the last few years (since Apple went to "iTunes Plus"), you absolutely can. The tracks are 256 Kbps AACs with no DRM. AAC is a standard format and there are many non-Apple devices that can play it. You will probably need a program other than iTunes to load the files onto your non-Apple device. Movies, TV shows, and e-books are still DRMed – so no playing those on non-Apple devices.

 

[Towergrove]

Originally Posted by Thomas Newton
If you're talking about music purchased in the last few years (since Apple went to "iTunes Plus"), you absolutely can. The tracks are 256 Kbps AACs with no DRM. AAC is a standard format and there are many non-Apple devices that can play it. You will probably need a program other than iTunes to load the files onto your non-Apple device.
Movies, TV shows, and e-books are still DRMed – so no playing those on non-Apple devices.

Hi Thomas, I'm not talking about the music side. The video and book sides is what I'm talking about and that DRM was broken some time ago by those pesky code kids.

 

[Joshua Clinard]

Thanks for calling me stupid! I am very interested in this service that Wal-Mart is offering. It has many benefits. I don't know why you are pooh-poohing it. The quality of the HDX version is very near the quality of a Blu-Ray disc. It even includes Dolby Digital 7.1 And every film I have looked at is only available in widescreen, even titles that were never released on DVD in widescreen! So your assumption that this is more for Joe Sixpack is a little childish. It may not be for everybody, but it is for me. I can't wait to convert my entire collection to this service. Oh, and here are some more benefits. To be able to watch any movie I own anywhere on any device, is awesome. I will be able to watch any number of movies on my iPad in a hotel room halfway across the world. All I need is wifi. The vudu service also has a video to go button that will let me download it in advance and watch it on the airplane. People will also be able to watch their movies on video game consoles, iPhones, iPad's Android phones, streaming video boxes, smart TV's and any internet connected DVD or Blu-Ray Player. This also eliminates the problem of damaged or lost DVD's. Just take your scratched disc to Wal-Mart, and then you will be able to watch it again. Forever, you will never lose access. I think this is the wave of the future. I just wish I could convert all my iTunes purchases to this system because it is superior to iTunes. Apple would have me pay for all my movies again, unless they plan some kind of disc to digital feature. Oh, and vudu offers most of it's films for RENT, so the intention is not to kill rental.

 

[MattAlbie60]

Forever, you will never lose access.

Your opinion is your opinion and that's fine, but you can't promise this.

 

[Sam Posten]

Indeed. May I suggest you research "Plays for sure" http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080422/234401923.shtml http://macdailynews.com/2008/04/23/microsoft_to_shut_down_playsforsure_drm_services_strand_customers/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3AMicrosoft_PlaysForSure http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_PlaysForSure iTunes DRM is no better. The difference is that there is about a million times better chance UVVU will shut down before iTunes does. Josh, you sound like a reasonable guy who has a lot of experience with different formats. I have to ask you, are you more intrigued by what UVVU could be than what it actually is? Is using UVVU actually not something you want to kill people over with 7 different logins?