Upscaling/HDef DVD Player merged thread

Discussion in 'Playback Devices' started by Chris Huber, May 17, 2004.

  1. Chris Huber

    Chris Huber Second Unit

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    Thank you cameron, that does help. Now that I think about it, my friends digi cable ER is more sharp then DVD quality. In these "up-sampling" DVD players, is there an option to turn it on in teh menu, or is it just automatic upsampled?

    If the DVD-S97 has those 4 options, then why aren't people getting it? Seems to have all the features everyone here is talking about. Seems like the best player, period.
     
  2. DaveGTP

    DaveGTP Cinematographer

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    The new panny unit is still listed with Faroudja in some places, but several calls to Panasonic have reported that Panasonic management says no Faroudja.
     
  3. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    I actually hadn't heard about the Panasonic. I'll have to check it out. From the bottom corner of the catalog, it looks like those models are for Canadian market. If that's the case then it would be the same scenario as getting the LG for those of us stateside.

    Usually the upconversion is set in the menu preferences as the players are capable of doing all possible flavors from 480i to 1080i. Switching around is not as simple as pushing a remote button - the player usually can't be playing a disc, etc.

    EDIT: Just read the post a little closer about it coming from the Canada catalog.
     
  4. jon.b

    jon.b Auditioning

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    i was looking around on the best buy web site, and i saw that its says that the zenith dvb318 does need DVI to upscale the video. Whos info do i belive? i really want one of these!
     
  5. Page Ferrell

    Page Ferrell Agent

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    jon.b -- the BB web-site information is incomplete. The zenith upconverts to 1080i over component. Go to this sickly long thread in the AVS Forum if you want to read of many individual users confirmation of this upconversion:

    DVB-318 AVS Forum Thread

    You can also find confirmation from users at the Home Theater Spot! forum.

    DVB-318 Thread at Home Theater Spot! Forum

    Page
     
  6. Steve Schaffer

    Steve Schaffer Producer

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    Page,

    You beat me to it on the availability thing. Glad I was wrong!!

    As for the Zenith "not supporting 4/3" it does to exactly the same extent the XP-30 does in all but 720p or 1080i, and the "failure" in those modes has more to do with the design parameters of the displays (locking into "full" with HD scanrates) than any deficiency in the player itself. It will scale non-anamorphic widescreen dvds in the HD scanrates, something the XP-30 won't do at all.

    Since I already have a CP-72, essentially an XP30 with a reportedly fragile spindle drive and 5 disc capacity, I plane to hook up both and do an A/B with 2 copies of the same disc playing in both units, switched via my receiver. This will be via component viewed on a Sony KP57HW40 widescreen rptv. Unfortunately I won't receive the Zenith for a couple of weeks so I won't be able to report back very soon.

    Any suggestions for test discs? I suspect that as with any scanrate upconversion the garbage-in-garbage out rule will apply so won't be surprised of some poor transfers look better on the Panny, so would appreciate both good and not so good transfers as suggestions, along with any notoriously poorly flagged discs to test de-interlacing. Since computer animated stuff like Shrek or Monsters Inc tends to look great on even mediocre equipment I'd prefer live-action suggestions.
     
  7. Allan Jayne

    Allan Jayne Cinematographer

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    On regular (interlaced) DVD playback on a standard TV, you do see the scan lines from time to time.

    Progressive scan (480p), for which you need an HDTV set, has a much smoother picture. This is what was meant by "halfway between DVD and HDTV".

    If the DVD player upconverted 480p to 1080i the visible difference is miniscule compared with 480p directly from the same DVD player to the same TV, even if (rare) the TV displayed incoming 480p as 960i rather than 1080i. (960 is not that much smaller than 1080)
     
  8. Cameron Yee

    Cameron Yee Executive Producer
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    Steve, to me the most obvious difference between 480p and the upconversion to 1080i has always been the appearance of text and titles. In 480p those elements have always looked fuzzy around the edges or just not as sharp as I am used to seeing on things like a computer monitor. But with the upconversion those elements appear crisp and clean. Try any of the Lord of the Rings discs when the gold hammered title comes on. I think the difference will be obvious.

    When most people get a big screen TV they are initially disappointed by the picture because everything gets magnified and therefore doesn't look as sharp or clear as when they viewed things on a 27" or 32" set. Basically the upconverting players put big screens back on the same apparent level of clarity.

    As far as what discs to use, pick any disc that has been reviewed as excellent and you'll be fine. One that doesn't get mentioned too often is Red Planet.



    Actually what I meant was the 1080i upconversion is halfway between DVD at 480p and (true) HDTV. So the upconversion is even better than 480p. And 480p is still technically 480i - the set or the player is just linedoubling the signal.
     
  9. Chris Huber

    Chris Huber Second Unit

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    Any Reports on when the DVD-S97 will be available for purchase?

    At the current moment, Upscaling, HDMI, De-Interlacing are the 3 features that no other player has in one, correct?

    I just found this player:
    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...647710-7112604

    It has all three features: HDMI, DCDi, Upscaling.

    All the great players are still not available [​IMG]
     
  10. Andre Bijelic

    Andre Bijelic Stunt Coordinator

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    It's scheduled for September in Canada. Not sure about the U.S., though it's usually around the same time. The new, lower-end Panasonics were released simultaneously in Canada and the U.S.
     
  11. Chris Huber

    Chris Huber Second Unit

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    Samsung DVD-HD941

    I've talked myself into this one now... Pretty good price and comes with a HDMI cable.

    I wonder if the price is gonna stay 250 at Amazon all the way to release date?
     
  12. Chris Huber

    Chris Huber Second Unit

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    Dear customer
    This unit will be released in June 2004.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    ********** Don't Remove "[SN********]" from the title *************
    When you inquire about our answer...
    With the Serial Number, we could identify your message.
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    [ You Wrote ]

    Samsung DVD-HD941

    When will this product be released?









    Nice guys! This looks like a hell of a player! I'm gonna get this one.
     
  13. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Lead Actor

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    What is the model of the LG equivalent dvd player for the Zenoth DVB 318?
     
  14. Andre Bijelic

    Andre Bijelic Stunt Coordinator

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  15. Don_Berg

    Don_Berg Supporting Actor

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    Isn't the LG-equivalent the Canadian version?
     
  16. DaveGTP

    DaveGTP Cinematographer

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    The Zenith is apparently a straight up clone of the LG player.
     
  17. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Lead Actor

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    Well I played around with the LG player today at a local b&m store in Toronto. Noticed that a simple push of a button directly on the player changes the modes from 480p to 720p to 1080i etc. The remote was not quite as bad as I was expecting it to be based on the reports. For cdn$299 I don't think I can really go wrong so I will probably pick one up tomorrow and test it out.
     
  18. PhilWW

    PhilWW Agent

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    I am sure that you will be very happy with your purchase of the LG player, especially you have a big screen HD display which will have a bigger impact on the picture quality. The 1080i image from my 318 regenerates my interest in watching DVD again.

    Let us know what you think about this player after you get it tomorrow.
     
  19. DaveGTP

    DaveGTP Cinematographer

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    I'll post my comments now just as I posted on AVS in the 318 thread.


    It looks like I am returning it. Image quality for movies is excellent (I think better than my CP72, but not sure), but for video-based materials, quite frankly, it's terrible. Like it's not using DCDi. It combed just like my Playstation 2 (I a/b tested using it).

    I tried out some of the DVDs that the secrets folks use to test (incorrect flags).

    Monsters Inc combs, or something (suggestion: see bed at the beginning behind the boy. It's not moving but the lines are not smooth. Broken up, kind of. Almost chroma bug like, maybe?). Also, try looking at hair on the monsters on a close up of them. Combing when they are moving.

    Spiderman - I saw some minor combing near the chapter breaks.

    Felicity season 1, disc 1, episode 1 - look at the chair (first shot of ep 1). Major combing. Looks like the chair is pulsing.


    I tried out some anime. Stuff with a beautiful transfer that I had watched on my CP72 within the last few weeks. Last Exile - combing. Azumunga Diaoh - combing.

    I tried switching modes (hold display button for 3 seconds), to no avail. Video mode made Last Exile judder like mad. Film mode seemed to have the correct cadence,
    but the video still combed. (despite it being anamorphic widescreen).

    Seemed almost like it wasn't using DCDi for video mode. Seemed like it was flag reading. From the user's manual comments about getting the mode "from the disc information", it sounds like it is flag reading. I'm surprised no one else has noticed the combing on video-based discs.


    From the user's manual:

    Video Mode Setting

    With certain discs, the playback picture may be flickering or Dot Crawl is shown on straight lines. That means Vertical interpolation or De-interlace is not perfectly matched with the disc. In this case, the picture quality may be improved by changing the video mode.

    To change the video mode, press and hold DISPLAY about 3 seconds during disc playback. The new video mode indicator appears on the
    TV screen. Check whether the video quality has improved. If not, repeat the above procedure until picture quality is improved.

    Video mode sequence: Auto -7 Film -7 Video If you turn off the power, the video mode will return to initial default state (Auto).

    Auto: The source material of the DVD video (film material or video material) is determined from disc information.

    Film: Suitable for playing film based content or video based material recorded by the progressive scan method.

    Video: Suitable for playing video based content with comparatively little motion




    Can anyone else check the scenes I mentioned? (I'm sure a lot of you have Monster's Inc to test).
     
  20. PhilWW

    PhilWW Agent

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    Just checked the scenes you mentioned in the Monster's Inc. in 480p, I did not notice the combing, chroma bug or anything, the frame, the bedsheet, the tshirt, the drawing on the wall, they all look very smooth but certainly not as good as the 1080i image, of course. Better check your settings. If image quality for movies is excellent, why do you want to watch the Monster's, Inc in 480p?
     

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