thinking about pioneer elite vsx32 or pioneer VSX-1120-K. opinions or other options?

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by Sandor, Nov 3, 2010.

  1. Sandor

    Sandor Auditioning

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    I am a long time pioneer fan from car audio to home. Used to used a pioneer elite 33vsx from back in the day and am now looking at a new setup. Considering the above, either a vsx32 or the VSX-1120-K. I called pioneer, and did my homework, and it seems these are virtually the same. only differences are 12v trigger, and 2yr warranty. BB is selling the VSX-1120-K for 499, its a steal from the 749msrp. I can get the elite for 675 though, just not sure if the extra year of warranty is worth another 175 dollars. The power and all the features are SUPPOSED to be the same, what would you do?

    Or, in the 5-700 range, does anyone suggest anything better?
    probably going to use some paradigm or BW bookshelves, center, and rears for my a 5.1 setup.


    Any thoughts would be appreciated!


    THX
     
  2. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    The 1120 and 32 are pretty much the same except the 32 has 12 triggers (x2), an i/r (in/out) and the gold lettering and orange display of the Elite series.


    I'm finally retiring my H/K 520 and 7200 (boo-hoo, goodby old friends ) and will soon get the 32 to match my Elite DV 49av and on-the-way BDP-31 BluRay player. I also have an Elite 94txh/BDP-05/DV58 combo in my front room so I'm stickung with all Elite stuff for consistancy and familiararity (?).


    Others for you to look at would be the Onkyo 708, Denon 1911, H/K 2600 and Yamaha 667.


    Be weary of the low cost receivers found on ebay. They may not come with a factory warranty. If you decide on one of those then think about also getting the Square Trade warranty.
     
  3. ellie860220

    ellie860220 Auditioning

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    The power and all the features are SUPPOSED to be the same, what would you do?

    chinese mobile phones
     
  4. ellie860220

    ellie860220 Auditioning

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    chinese mobile phones
    Be weary of the low cost receivers found on ebay. They may not come with a factory warranty. If you decide on one of those then think about also getting the Square Trade warranty.
     
  5. Patrick Tyer

    Patrick Tyer Auditioning

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    I found the Pioneer Elite VSX-32 for $529 shipped at East Coast TV's, http://www.eastcoasttvs.com/index.php/receivers/vsx32.html. This is the receiver I am leaning toward right now. Plan on purchasing this weekend. Just thought I would throw it out there to save you a bit of money. Use the discount code PAYCHECK at checkout and it gives you free shipping and 2% off until the 21st of this month.
     
  6. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    That's a nice price for it but I'm pretty sure Pioneer won't honor the factory warranty. Either keep your fingers crossed for a while (about 2 years ) or try and get a SquareTrade warranty.


    The 1120 from an authorized dealer would be another option.
     
  7. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    I don't believe Pioneer Elite authorizes any internet sales (or at least it used to be that way). I bought the 1120 for the secondary basement system from J&R (a few mos.back). They matched an unauthorized dealer's $499.99 price. I heard that they took some grief from Pioneer so I don't know if they are still doing it.
     
  8. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    PS - in my secondary basement system I use B&Ws with the 1120
     
  9. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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  10. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    The 1120 isn't an Elite model, just a plain old Pioneer which is allowed to be sold on-line. But only from authorized dealers.


    I gotta get me a front projector next.


    Shouldn't you have a surge protector for that sub woofer?


    Nice speakers though.
     
  11. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    Yes but the 1120 does have the video processing of the Elite models. I use the basement mainly for stuff like weekend football (main room is too bright for any daytime TV) and it as noted is sold online. No it doesn't have the ICE amps but I can eventually after I get done upgrading a couple of more things certainly get an amp.
     
  12. chris_clem

    chris_clem Second Unit

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    Thinking of getting either this or the comparable Onkyo as well. However with Black Friday around the corner I suggest waiting to see if we can get this at one of the sales!


    That said, if you can't wait to pull the trigger Amazon has a pretty good price on this (plus no tax):


    http://tinyurl.com/2domz4a
     
  13. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    Well, I got the 32 delivered last week and it's a really nice receiver. I hooked it up in place of the 94txh for comparison and really don't notice much of a difference. The 94 does have a stronger amp section but unless you have very hard to drive speakers or a huge room it won't matter. The sound might even be a bit clearer. I like the 6 MCACC presets that Pioneer offers and the on-screen displays are much better than previous years. Biggest complaint is Pioneer still uses a single cross-over setting for all speakers. It doesn't affect me but it might be a problem for someone else. And all other brands offer multiple speaker group settings so why not Pioneer?


    Anyway, I'll be using a 49dv universal dvd player and a 31 BluRay player with the 32 and even though they seem like toys compared to the full size 58 dv and 05 BR players I'm using with the 94 they both perform very well. The 1120 would be a really good choice for someone who wants to save a little money and doesn't need/want the orange display or 12v triggers of the Elite line, and can live with a one year warranty. The 1020/920 and similar 31/30 Elites have different video processors (the 32/33 and 1120 use a Marvell chip) and much weaker amp sections but again, you may not notice it in everyday use. But I think the 32/1120 are worth the extra money.


    I think the Elites are the best looking receivers out there with their orange displays, blue lights and shiny black face plates but the Denon 1911, Onkyo 708, H/K 2600 and Yamaha 667 would also be good choices.


    I'm going to miss the simplicity of my older H/K receivers but it was time to move on. And I really miss my 59txi. That thing was a 68 pound beast! Both the 59txi and H/K 7200 had amp sections that were in a completely different league than the Elite's I have now but I was never able to take advantage of them so that's one of the reasons I let them go. An Elite SC-09 would sure be nice but they're quite expensive. Oh well. I've rambled on long enough. Time to get some chores done.
     
  14. CarlTN

    CarlTN Auditioning

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    Hello to you all. I am considering purchasing the VSx-1120-K also, mainly because it can play back SACD (besides of course to be able to play movies). However, I am trying to figure out if it would still function with the speaker delays in place, while playing back the higher rez 24bit/192kHz surround mix (converted from DSD within the receiver).


    Sony always called for all speakers to be equal distance from the listener while playing back SACD surround sound. That was a silly and stupid design flaw on their part, it seems to me...and partially why the format never caught on (well, that, and the mass market is satisfied with lossy, compressed "free music").


    To me, the ability to play SACD is why I would want the Pioneer over the Onkyo 708. Otherwise, the Onkyo seems like it might be better.


    Also, I read where you said it sets the same bass crossover for all speakers. I am wondering what increments those are? Is it in 10 Hz increments like the Onkyo? (i.e., 50, 60, 70, 80, 90, 100, 110 Hz, etc)


    The owners manual doesn't seem to say, or if it does, I missed it. There are certainly no really good pro reviews of this receiver that I can find, either...Maybe I am just too hard to please, haha.
     
  15. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    I believe Pioneers crossover frequencies are 50 80 100 120 and 150. And maybe 200 but I'm too lazy to check.


    When SACD is transfered to the receiver via hdmi then the 1120 will apply all digital processing including speaker delay. Through the multi-channel analog inputs it, along with 99% of the receivers out there, it won't apply any digital processing, just speaker level control.


    The 708 does support SACD through the hdmi input. See above for the MC analog in's. They just don't bother telling anyone since SACD and DVD-A are all but forgoten formats. But it does make mention of DSD on the Features, page 6.


    Here's a quick review from Audioholics.com and another from HomeTheaterGears.com.
     
  16. CarlTN

    CarlTN Auditioning

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    Thanks very much Gene! I am aware the Onkyo 708 can play back SACD via the analog inputs. But if you are saying the Onkyo too converts DSD to PCM via the HDMI inputs, I have not seen that anywhere. Is that what you are saying?

    The whole reason I would want to transfer the DSD surround digitally, even if it does have to be converted to PCM, is to be able to use the delay within the receiver...since my Oppo player, and my Sony player, don't allow any control over SACD surround delay, themselves. I mean, as far as playing back "mere" two channel SACD, that would obviously still be able to be done via any of the stereo analog inputs on the Pioneer (or any amp or preamp for that matter). The trick is the multi-channel mix, with DELAY...


    Abandoned format or not, if you are a fan of the golden age of classical music like I am, you might be aware of all the 3 channel SACD releases of RCA Living Stereo and Mercury Living Presence. I have many of them on reissue vinyl as well (another format abandoned by people who want convenience over quality), but it's nice to actually have that discrete center channel on a silver disc, recorded 55 years ago or so!


    Well, the bass crossover frequencies seem like enough choice to me. My old Pioneer receiver just had 100, 150, and 200...haha.


    I used to be into two channel highend audio more, and still have a Rogue 88 tube amp, as well as a Resolution Audio CD50. Also had a Krell KAV-250a power amp for several years. I haven't listened to music nearly enough for about a year or so, so I want to get back into it. Also would be nice to be able to hear the new surround formats via HDMI (my old receiver didn't have it).

    My screen is a Da-Lite "high power", fixed to the wall, and my projector is "only" a Panasonic 720p...for now (it does accept a 1080p/24 signal via HDMI, and looks quite amazing despite the lack of pixels). I've had it since 2006, and am waiting for future 4k or 8k "10D" projectors (complete with smell-o-vision and warp drive) to make all of you billionaires over in 'frisco upgrade, so the price of the "old, forgotten" 1080p projectors gets down to as good a value as these receivers are! This screen is so bright, constrasty, and colorful...that I always use the lamp on low (900 lumens)...for which it is rated 5000 hours...I still only have about 1600 on it. It looks like a 112 inch wide plasma, but without the huge pixel pitch. I tried many screen materials, but this one killed the rest. The only drawback, is you need the projector on a stand, rather than on the ceiling...since the gain is achieved in the plane the light is coming from. An aluminum frame for the screen would have been nice, but at $2k more, it just wasn't worth it to me.
     
  17. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    Some receivers (like my Pioneer 94txh) accept DSD and have an internal decoder, they don't convert the signal to PCM (it says "DSD" on the display). I have no idea how the Onkyo 708 deals with a DSD signal. If it has a DSD decoder in it then it will leave it as DSD (preffered). If it doesn't have a DSD decoder then it would convert the DSD signal to PCM. I know the Onkyo 805 does have a DSD decoder though. I used to have one.
     
  18. CarlTN

    CarlTN Auditioning

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    Gene, yes I know many receivers had the DSD decoder in the past, but none seem to now, which is a shame. I am trying to contact both Pioneer and Onkyo, still nothing from Pioneer. Just hung up the phone with a tech at Onkyo.


    I pointed out the info you gave me, about page 6 of the owner's manual. (Thanks again for that!) He was surprised, at first he tried to say it wasn't possible...then he put me on hold for several minutes, and comes back and says "I stand corrected, evidently it does handle SACD through HDMI". However, he also said the player would have to be set to "PCM"...wheras, I was thinking the receiver should perform the conversion using a DSD signal sent from the player. I'm not even sure my Oppo can output PCM while playing an SACD, but I guess it can. I need to try it to find out.


    Basically, I have decided to try the Onkyo, since that is the only way to know for sure anyway (and since nobody else on earth but me cares whether this works, haha.) That is, IF I can find one available for a good price. As of today, Amazon is "temporarily out of stock" (there's a shocker, haha). It seems to have a bit more power than the Pioneer, and also has stereo subwoofer pre-outputs....something I also have always wanted!


    It has a captive power cord, so I guess you can't have everything. That could always be modified to accept an IEC socket, but would be a hassle.
     
  19. gene c

    gene c Producer

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    From what I've read the two sub woofer pre-outs aren't stereo. There's just two outputs instead of one. That goes for all receivers with dual sub woofer outputs. Get a Y adapter and you have the same thing.


    My Pioneer Elite 32 does SACD through the hdmi input. I'm sure the 1120 does as well. Look like it converts DSD to PCM.


    I'm also sure the OPPO will output SACD as PCM. Check the settings in the setup menu.


    Customer Service reps don't know anything about what the company sells (Sorry all you CSR's out there ).
     
  20. batman144144

    batman144144 Extra

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    I'm trying to decide between the pioneer elite vsx32 and the VSX-1120-K. I would be using one of them as a pre/pro, driven by a Chiro C-500. Decoding CDs, DVDs, and Blu Rays will be its primary chore. Everyone says the units are pretty much the same. That was fine with me until I looked up the two units on the Pioneer site. The 1120 does not have 192kHz / 24-Bit or 96kHz / 24-Bit DACs. Of course, the Elite does. Isn't this going to make a big difference in sound quality? http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/AV-Receivers/Pioneer+Receivers/VSX-1120-K
     

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