SVS SB-2000 or PB-2000

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by erew99, Mar 11, 2014.

  1. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    I got a true funny story for you.

    I reviewed the SVS Ultra speakers. While doing so, they threw in a 13 Ultra sub(full name of the sub escapes me) that wasn't part of the review(and I only mentioned it in passing).

    Anyway, I swapped out DCM TF series and a M&K sub for the SVS.

    Accidentally a guest kicked on Audyssey(which I normally don't use) that was set for the DCM/M&K.

    The 13 Ultra "on that EQ curve" promptly felt like it was trying to destroy the room...

    So, in jest, just so you can immediately know the impact of the incoming sub, leave the room EQ set for the prior sub...(we were watching Mama Mia and the bass was something out of dub step...)
     
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  2. FoxyMulder

    FoxyMulder 映画ファン

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    I would have loved being in that room.
     
  3. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Yeah my M&K is not a light sub. But it is 20yrs old.

    The "idea" of subs in the class the 13 Ultra is in...wasn't even a side thought in speaker designers minds then.

    My M&K didn't hold the 13's jock strap.

    But...the day the M&K powers on for the last time...will be met with a few tears.
     
  4. erew99

    erew99 Second Unit

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    While I'd like to get a bigger sub, there are other factors. My biggest is my in-wall wiring, limiting my placement.

    The other is size. Because the walls are only 10' (on the sides) I am very limited. Only one of these walls is usable for a sub.

    One of the 20' walls isn't usable. The other has a fireplace, speakers, and some other furniture already there.

    If I could get the PB-2000, I'd go for that. My options are the PB-1000 or the SB-2000.

    Max height has to be under 20". Max width under 17". Depth... I have some room to play with, but 24" should be the max.
     
  5. FoxyMulder

    FoxyMulder 映画ファン

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    Go for the ported PB-1000 then.
     
  6. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    I'm glad I have a GF that plays an upright bass and (grand) piano.
     
  7. erew99

    erew99 Second Unit

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    HAHA- I bet you are.
     
  8. Gaptek Edan

    Gaptek Edan Extra

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  9. Robert_J

    Robert_J Lead Actor

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    I'm sure this isn't your GF but it is the only girl I've seen play the upright bass.

     
  10. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Nope, not her...but good song.Kind of a subdued Better Dig Two by The Band Perry.
     
  11. PaulDA

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    I was trying to decide between the SB and PB-2000. Went with the PB-2000 after some exchanges with Ed Mullen at SVS (other option I was considering was dual PB-1000s, but he suggested the single PB-2000--to me, demonstrates it's not just about extracting dollars from buyers, as dual PB-1000s would be more expensive). Looking forward to its arrival (ordered today).
     
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  12. PaulDA

    PaulDA Cinematographer

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    It arrived today (well, yesterday, I guess, given the hour). Will get a chance to play around with it in a few days when the house is empty for two weeks (wife and kids are going on a road trip with my mother-in-law). Can't wait to take it out of the giant box.
     
  13. Robert Crawford

    Robert Crawford Moderator
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    Paul,

    How are you liking it?
     
  14. PaulDA

    PaulDA Cinematographer

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    I like that it digs deeper at below 30hz than my old sub. I have limited placement options for it, though, and I'm trying to cope with a serious peak centred on 20 or so hz (measured with REW). With movies, the difference with my old sub is clear, but, so far, with music, less so (outside of a few tracks with really low synth bass). I'm awaiting a replacement mic for my Antimode 8033, which will hopefully tame that peak and allow the 30-80hz range to shine through better than it seems to do at the moment.

    I'm actually leaning towards keeping my old sub in the "cave" as well. Again, with REW, I measured bass response with my PV900 (placed near field--just to the left of my chair at the MLP) and it cures a pretty big dip centred at 43hz, while providing a about a 3dB boost in output across the range (its level is set low and it is away from the walls, so it doesn't provide a big boost in output--not what I'm looking for from it as it can't keep up with the SVS). photo.PNG

    Pinkish trace is SVS + PV900, bluish trace is SVS alone.
     
  15. PaulDA

    PaulDA Cinematographer

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    Well, after a long session of measurements (few different placements, new sub w/o EQ, new sub w/EQ, new and old sub w/o EQ, new and old w/EQ--in all cases, EQ is Antimode 8033C), I have finally reached a point where I can now test to see if the graph, which looks good, equals good SQ. Attached is a (red) trace of the two subs w/EQ (it was taken at a bit higher volume setting on the AVR, so ignore the apparent large boost in output--REW puts the difference of each trace at 7dB (red one is higher) vs. a green trace of the PB-2000 with no EQ.

    I tested it with various music and film excerpts. I'm sure I could spend many more hours tweaking further, but I've reached a point where things are nicely improved. Keeping the second sub serves mostly as "null killer", as can be seen in the other graph. The red trace in the first graph shows what adding EQ to the two subs does to smooth the big hump below 40Hz. The pinkish trace in the second graph shows the null created by the EQ with only the SVS in play. It improves a lot of other things, but killing that last null with the extra sub makes it even flatter in room.

    So, proof that two subs, even if not the same, can be better than one (with a LOT of measuring and placement trials), and some form of EQ for the sub in any space under 3000 cubic feet, is essential.
     

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  16. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    This is exactly why I've always been a proponent of full range speakers in all positions(even center, if you can).Having 4/5/7 speakers playing to 40 kills nulls.
     
  17. PaulDA

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    Well, perhaps at my next speaker upgrade (which, judging from past experience, is about a decade away). At least I have subs that'll be able to keep up.
     
  18. Robert Crawford

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    Yeah, I have a dual sub setup right now in my main HT. If I buy the PB-2000, I'm thinking of buying two of them as my hearing/brain is used to the dual sub setup.
     

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