So, I finally started watching Battlestar Galactica (1 Viewer)

[TravisR]

In all fairness, I was wrong when I said it was a rip off of Star Wars. That being said, I think saying that the original BSG was a cash-in on Star Wars is completely accurate.

 

[Will_B]

and also chose to appeal to the lowest common denominator with its sex obsession from the get-go, and its dislikable characters who were just warmed over retreads from a bad movie

You complain about insults being leveled at the old show (even though I haven't seen any here), and then you level insults at the new show? Hypocrite. And the original Galactica featured a sex obsessed character called Starbuck (of the cigar-chomping male variety). The new show's sexual obsessive was Baltar, but so what? And as for calling the much-beloved characters of the new Galactica "unlikable", that's just, like, your opinion, man. I don't think any of the characters are intended to be unlikable... I'm thinking now, trying to see if any of them were designed to tweak the audiences noses in such a way as to convey that they are unlikeable, and I can't think of any who are... at least not through the first half of their journey. (Ok, Tigh's wife was annoying, but she was more of comedic relief than unlikeable). Oh, wait, Admiral Cain was unlikable.

 

[Jack P]

Actually in TOS, Starbuck rather quickly over the course of the season turned into a relative monogamist with one steady girlfriend (Cassiopeia). Those who think of him as a perpetual "space Casanova" the whole time, again reveal more about how little they actually know about the original series and think of it as defined only by the edited version of the pilot shown theatrically. Indeed, the maturity of the character of Starbuck as well as that of other characters over the course of the season is another reason for its staying power and a reason why the fanbase continues to be so upset over the lack of a continuation to give the original some closure because hard as this is sometimes for the Galactica bashers to realize, Galactica was an *interrupted storyline*. There were ongoing storylines and subplots that had been established that we wanted to see furthering of and it's because the audience cared about the characters and that storyline, the enthusiasm has never diminished over the years, and *not* because of fond memories of the FX which is what the detractors always wrongly assume is the case regarding the original series fanbase. And one reason why the emergence of this other version hurt so much is because it shattered 25 years of hopes to finally see some closure to the show we had loved at a point where we had come very close to getting it under the aborted Tom DeSanto project.


As for insults aimed at the old show, I would say every time the term "campy" is hurled at it is most definitely an insult because if it was "campy" then so too was original Star Trek. And in this case, the bizarre assertion of the show as a "rip off" (false) that is remembered only for "campy nostalgia value" (two more falsehoods in the same sentence) was what prompted me to finally make comment.

 

[Bill McCamy]

Originally Posted by Jack P
As for insults aimed at the old show, I would say every time the term "campy" is hurled at it is most definitely an insult because if it was "campy" then so too was original Star Trek. And in this case, the bizarre assertion of the show as a "rip off" (false) that is remembered only for "campy nostalgia value" (two more falsehoods in the same sentence) was what prompted me to finally make comment.

Jack, you really, really like the old show. Great. You really, really dislike the new show. OK. However this thread started with Ron expressing his pleasure in discovering on BD what many of us had known for several years, that the new show is great. So, some think the old show was "campy,' while the new show is "mature." You've essentially crapped, and continue to crap, all over this thread where most posters have encouraged Ron in his continued journey through the new series. Why? That's rhetorical. Please do not answer. Instead, start your own thread about what a wonderful experience one can have viewing the original series. I promise not to come to that thread and leave a stinking turd in it.

 

[TravisR]

Originally Posted by Jack P
And in this case, the bizarre assertion of the show as a "rip off" (false) that is remembered only for "campy nostalgia value" (two more falsehoods in the same sentence) was what prompted me to finally make comment.

So it's all my fault that you came into this thread? I can honestly say that I'm sorry that I made that statement then. Apparently, there's at least one person out there that somehow enjoys the original series beyond a nostalgic or camp value (and that's shocking to me) so I've learned something new but I think you're really reaching to call what I said 'bizarre' or a 'falsehood'.

 

[Jack P]

Maybe I should introduce you to the many Galactica fan forums and fan circles I've been a part of for more than 15 years and you'd then discover that not one person in those groups are part of them for reasons having anything to do with 'camp' or nostalgia. It has to do with enjoyment of a series that was entertaining on a number of levels based on stories, characters and also the underlying philosophical elements that ran counter to the usual cliches of sci-fi TV in that era.


Try not to rely on Ron Moore for your understanding of what the original series fanbase is like and what it is about the original series that gave it a long-term appreciation that one does not see for instance for "Buck Rogers".

 

[Bill McCamy]

Jack, off this thread, please.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

I had no idea that when I posted my first

message about watching a show that I knew

was popular with the membership that it

would turn into this.


I would highly suggest that if anyone wants

to extensively argue the merits and faults

between the original and new series to do

so in a separate thread.


Thanks

 

[Jack P]

That's fine by me, though I doubt the tone would be dissimilar to what's gone on here already. The bad blood and bad feeling that exists between the two fanbases has been a fact of life for years and I see little hope for that ever changing.


That's my final comment here.

 

[Regulus]

Originally Posted by Jack P

That's fine by me, though I doubt the tone would be dissimilar to what's gone on here already. The bad blood and bad feeling that exists between the two fanbases has been a fact of life for years and I see little hope for that ever changing.


That's my final comment here.

I've seen a simular "Rift" among the Star Trek Fanbases. Time and again I've seen Trekkers argue over which version is better, the "First Generation" Trek (Captain Kirk, Spock etc.) and the "Next Generation" Trek (Captain Picard, Data not to mention the Spinoffs). I tell them this FACT. If it weren't for the dedicated efforts of us "First Generation" Trekkers there WOULD NOT BE the Next Generation or its Spinoffs. How many other TV Shows do you know of that, after being cancelled after three seasons, still retain their Fanbases? FIVE YEARS Passed before we had a new Episode of "Trek" (The Animated Series), then ANOTHER five years before thye first movie came out. (And that Movie was viewed by many as a Dissapointment) Yet, the Series survived, and is still thriving! I Liked the original BSG, and, as I mentioned in an earlier post, was turned off by the new series because of excessive Commercial Interruptions. Nearly THIRTY YEARS passed since the original BSG's Cancellation, and we had it "Revived" A La Trek. I think that's a good thing, so don't knock it. Look at how many other series have been revived lately, only to be gone a year later!


As for the New BSG, as soon as the price of the DVDs gets down to a Reasonable Price (About $20 a Season) I'll get it and watch them!

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Okay, debate over.

 

[Sam Favate]

So, Ron, where are you in season 4, and what did you make of the revelations at the end of season 3?


Also, have you seen the extended versions of episodes? I thought the extended Unfinished Business was quite good.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Sam, I am at the third or fourth episode in

on Season Four. The episode I watched today...



Callie was ejected out the airlock after accusing the President's assistant of being a Cylon.


As for the revelation at the end of Season 3....



Did not see the setup with the music playing across the ship. Did not know where the story was heading until I realized that only the final 4 (of 5) Cylons were able to hear it.

The question now is....



Who is the Cylon that is to be revealed? What troubles me is that they may have already given us the answer. Leobold told President Rosyln that "Adama was a Cyclon." Would the show's writers be so blatant to just give us that answer so quickly or are they trying to detract us from who the individual really is? I am hoping that we were just being fooled. Would hate for it to be Adama.

 

[Brandon Conway]

Glad your enjoying the show so much, Ron. Definitely one of my absolute favorites.

Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein
The question now is....

Who is the Cylon that is to be revealed? What troubles me is that they may have already given us the answer. Leobold told President Rosyln that "Adama was a Cyclon." Would the show's writers be so blatant to just give us that answer so quickly or are they trying to detract us from who the individual really is? I am hoping that we were just being fooled. Would hate for it to be Adama.

It all fits by the end. It will be interesting to read your take on it...

 

[Will_B]

Me too. I'm also forgetting who the first four to be exposed were.

 

[Curtis F]

Ron,


I'm really glad to see you're enjoying Galactica so much. It makes me want to go back and watch it all over again. I've enjoyed reading your thoughts on the show (as well as the other comments people are posting). That being said, and if I'm being innappropriate I apologize, but that heated discussion a few posts back was one of the most entertaining reads I've had in a long time.


You can delete this if you need to.


BTW: I consider myself a fan of both shows.

 

[David Norman]

Interesting take, The Boxing episode is one that roundly gets blasted as a Waste Of Time filler (like Black Market in S2). I thought I was one of the few who loved that episode when it first aired and was always baffled at the reaction it elicited. I thought the emotional

depths it pulled/pushed/dragged us through to get to the end was just beautifully done.



Not really a spoiler, but it does mention some fan reactions about S4 and I'd hate to give too many hints so you may wish to come back and read it later.

(Un)fortunately there were some similar episodes in S4 that started splitting the fans into different camps and I found that a lot of the fans who hated this episode were the loudest critics in S4+ who thought that Ron Moore lost his way (or worse) -- I actually thought the opposite was true and a lot what comes later was perfectly in synch with what was set up earlier. It seemed to really bring out the split between those who wanted a straight line story to the finish with as much Space Battle footage as possible and those who liked exploring the Inner Demon/Psychologic and Personal Motivation of the characters. The latter was what I thought set this series apart from anything that came before it to begin with and it got to a point eventually where anything that didn't immediately and obviously advance the Main Story (in the direction they thought is was supposed to go) was immediately blasted even when often the information came back to mean something later.

Watch this post reignite the argument



I also agree with you about the final cliffhanger at S3 was just beyond words.

Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein

There's a memorable episode in Season Three that takes place

in a boxing ring -- however its setting is used merely as setting

the tone for flashbacks that are intertwined with the struggle that

is taking place in the ring. It's very hard to explain unless you are

familiar with the episode but it is one of the most riveting and

emotional moments of the entire series.


I also felt that the "Crossroads," the two-hour finale of Season

three that (in being careful not to spoilerize) involved a tribunal

and strange music throughout the ship was one of the best
season revelations/cliffhangers I have seen to date.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

I need to be careful what I say here because

I do not want the debating to resume in this thread.


Just an observation....


I did a search for the original season discussions

that took place in this very forum area during the

original broadcast.


It was amazing to see how many people were
dissatisfied with this show and its pacing right up

to the Season 3 finale.


It's kind of odd to see that sort of reactions given

the fact that I think this is one of the greatest
science fiction shows I have ever watched (alongside

Babylon 5 which I adored).

However, I do understand that this new incarnation

did do some injustice to the original series.


My favorite sci-fi show as a kid (don't laugh) was

Lost In Space. It was the epitome of camp. When

the movie was made in the 90s I wasn't particularly

happy with the way they changed the characters.

However, I realized this was now decades later and

perhaps it was time to tell a new story, with a new

twist, while paying some sort of homage to the
original.


I also understand that there's people that would have

preferred a more Cylon action-orientated storyline

and those like me who really love the fact the show

gets into the heads of these characters.


Thing is --- and this is most important -- nobody

is going to convince each side of the justice or

injustice being done.

In any event, I am slowly heading towards the

end of Season 4 and then on to 4.5. The Fifth

Cylon has not been revealed (but a spoiler above

probably ruined it) and now I have to go back to

the Leobold/President Rosyln episode to see just

what he whispered in her ear.

 

[TravisR]

Originally Posted by Ronald Epstein
It was amazing to see how many people were
dissatisfied with this show and its pacing right up

to the Season 3 finale.

I only started watching the show after S3 aired so maybe I'd have a different POV if I had watched the show from week to week but I thought S3 was excellent and was completely surprised to see the negativity directed at it too. I thought Unfinished Business (the boxing episode) was one of the best episodes of the series on a purely dramatic level but you'd think that that episode had beat up alot of BSG fans' moms with all the hate it gets. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

 

[RickER]

Originally Posted by TravisR



I only started watching the show after S3 aired so maybe I'd have a different POV if I had watched the show from week to week but I thought S3 was excellent and was completely surprised to see the negativity directed at it too. I thought Unfinished Business (the boxing episode) was one of the best episodes of the series on a purely dramatic level but you'd think that that episode had beat up alot of BSG fans' moms with all the hate it gets. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

LOL


I love BSG, new and old, but yea, i was one of the people who HATED, with a passion Battlestar Rocky. That one episode almost made me stop watching the show. In fact, if i had not read that the show was going to end after season 4, i might of quit. That episode could of been a shark jumping moment.


I dont think the show ever recaptured the plot line they had at the end of season 2, beginning of season 3.


I will have to remember to skip the boxing episode when i get season 3 on Blu-ray. Makes my blood pressure rise thinking how bad it was.


Glad to hear your enjoying the ride Ron.