Silence Of The Lambs Criterion vs. S.E. (1 Viewer)

[Jeff]

Paul, it might be a no brainer for those who don't have a 16x9 display but for people like me who do, the MGM one is the way to go. I sold my Criterion 6 months ago for this very reason.
Jeff

 

[Rob Gillespie]

Mine arrived yesterday. Looks nice, but the sound is flat as a pancake. I never heard (or saw) the Criterion copy and I never owned this title on LD so I can't compare, but the sound just has very little life to it. No energy or sparkle. It's not bad by any means, but just, well... "mmm.. OK". Contrast that to the soundtrack on Hannibal which after listening to Lambs is like having your ears de-waxed (metaphorically speaking of course since I've never had my ears de-waxed, but you probably get what I mean... Oh shut up!)
[Edited last by Rob Gillespie on August 21, 2001 at 07:40 AM]

 

[AdrianJ]

I have no problem owning both copies. I was lucky to pick up a copy of the criterion version just before it went out of print. And considering that you can order the new one for around $17 at DeepDiscountDVD, I think it's a no brainer for all the extra features. Just set them side by side and pretend that you have the Ultimate Silence of the Lambs!
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Adrian Jones

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

The Criterion transfer was a pretty good test disc for whether or not your television exhibited red push. In particular, the scene where the SWAT team is watching the elevator (trying not to be spoilerish in case my dad or the other person in the world who has not seen it yet is reading). This always used to look "noisy" until I fixed the red push problem via my TV's service menu, after which it looked like a pretty sweet instance of Tak Fujimoto's prediliction for colored lights. Interestingly, the Criterion Laserdisc had a number of bad pressings that made this scene look like an unholy chroma-noise disaster (it was the opening of side three).
The Criterion SotL transfer also shares a characteristic with the Pulp Fiction transfer which is that its opening scenes are among the worst looking of the whole transfer. Personally, I'm going to pass on the MGM SotL, but I will pick it up if I see a used copy. There are just too many other titles I want to own in the next few months to bother paying new disc prices for ones that I already have in decent versions. This plus Wonka and Cats & Dogs equates to an extra $50 or so in my pocket!
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Michael Reuben]

Michael, if you could post your impressions of the video transfer after viewing the new MGM disc, I'd appreciate it.

I only had time to watch the first 40 minutes or so, but I'd say the MGM is more like the Image transfer than the Criterion. The colors tend toward the cool side, and it lacks the pinkish cast that was often noticeable on the Criterion disc. The anamorphic enhancement makes for better resolution and detail, of course, and the picture is very clean and smooth . Overall, I'd say it's the best I've ever seen the film on home video.
(Full disclosure: I watched this film repeatedly when I got the first, pre-Criterion LD. That's the look I'm most familiar with, and since this new DVD has similar color values, it's entirely possible that I prefer it because it's what I'm used to.)
I'm surprised that the sound is being criticized. The Silence soundtrack has never been effective at creating a sense of acoustic space. Its chief feature is the way that sound effects are subtly layered into the mix, such as the "last breath" that is audible when the first bug cocoon is removed from the body that Starling and Crawford fly down to examine. I was impressed at how this 5.1 version brought out sounds buried deep in the mix. For example, this was the first time I noticed that, during Clarice's run during the opening titles, you can hear the same insect chirping sound that becomes very loud just after she's killed James Gumb at the end of the film (most noticeable during the close-up of Gumb's spinning mobile).
The new documentary is excellent, BTW. No interviews with Demme or Foster, but just about everyone else has something to say. Ted Levine and Brooke Smith are particularly interesting on how they related to each other while filming those horrifying scenes in Gumb's basement.
M.

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

OK, after all of my wasted e-ink up above, I went in to pick up Hannibal and found out that you could get both films for $29 at Best Buy and became the proud owner of yet another version of Silence of the Lambs. I A/B'd it with the Criterion, and the following are my impressions.
Video
Despite the anamorphic resolution of the MGM disc, the Criterion is the better transfer. It is significantly different from the MGM release in both color and density. The MGM release is much cooler looking as pointed out earlier, but it also tends to be brighter in scenes where it should not. The Criterion is not without its problems such as the shimmering around the opening credits text (not evident on the 16:9 MGM transfer), and a few more visible print source flaws than the MGM, but it is overall a better, much more film-like presentation.
Audio
Very close on this one. The MGM disc has the advantage of more discrete channels, but they did not go wacky on the re-mix. The audio on this film is a subtly layered hemispheric mix with the surrounds mostly supporting the music as opposed to a highly directional active soundfield. Kudos to MGM for keeping it that way. There are times where the original 2-channel mix out-performs the new mix (the descent to the first meeting with Lecter has the eerie bass-heavy music slightly higher in the mix), but the new mix is usually as good and occasionally better than the Criterion.
Extras
Both of them have very good extras and they complement each other surprisingly well. Almost everything that you would want that is missing from the Criterion appears on the new release, and vice versa. The new documentary on the MGM disc is very good. It has the advantage over the Dino-heavy Hannibal featurettes of historical perspective.
My Mistake
I thought Tak Fujimoto must have used colored lights to get the yellow/orange look to the Memphis SWAT team scenes. I was wrong. This look was created in post as evidenced by the difference between the two transfers. The MGM has a very clean, unfiltered look with the dripping blood at a key moment looking vividly red. The Criterion transfer which was supervised by Fujimoto has a more stylized look to it with the blood appearing less vivid and more brownish.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Michael Reuben]

Ken --

Quote:

We'll have to agree to disagree.
M.

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

Interesting. Which scenes do you find too bright?

Most of the escape sequence in Memphis consisted of process shots that appear unprocessed on the MGM and previous Orion transfers. The Criterion is the only one that captures some semblance of the "Hieronymous Bosch" look that was intended. Also, the interview scenes between Lecter & Starling in Baltimore (especially the second one) appear to be mis-timed (not grossly, but noticeably) from cut to cut on the new release. The "American Girl" driving scene, while not overly bright, appears to have more video artifacts such as horizontal banding of the street lights than the Criterion.
There is a certain level of comfort knowing that Criterion consulted with the DP on the look of their transfer as well.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Mark Zimmer]

Grrrr, amongst a stack of goodies, I accidentally picked up the P&S version of Silence. I thought Best Buy was only going to carry the widescreen? Well, I guess I use my lunch hour to exchange it. Good thing I realized it before I opened it.
What an amazing wealth of movies, cheap, though. Picked up 10 excellent discs for $120.
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"This movie has warped my fragile little mind."

 

[Michael Reuben]

There is a certain level of comfort knowing that Criterion consulted with the DP on the look of their transfer as well.

I know we often set great store by their involvement, but DPs have been known to "rethink" their work on video (Richardson did it on Platoon; Storaro has done it several times on Apocalypse Now). On the Criterion commentary, Demme jokes at one point about Tak Fujimoto's fondness for red lights. He certainly indulged it in the Criterion version of the SWAT scenes!
M.
[Edited last by Michael Reuben on August 22, 2001 at 11:12 PM]

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

quote: More like "Francis Bacon", according to Kristi Zea in the documentary[/quote]Good point. My Bad. I was thinking Bacon, but I guess I just wanted to spell "Hieronymous". As a penance, I offer up the following two related images. Click on either image for an enlargement & description.
http://www.francis-bacon.cx/crucifixions/crucifixion_33.html http://www.francis-bacon.cx/animals/fragment.html
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA
[Edited last by Ken_McAlinden on August 22, 2001 at 09:59 AM]

 

[Alan_Plummer]

FYI: Tak Fujimoto approved the MGM transfer used for the SOTL DVD.
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[Ken_McAlinden]

This exclusive digital transfer was made from the 35mm interpositive and the 35mm Dolby stereo magnetic master in consultation with cinematographer Tak Fujimoto

Morgan Holly was involved with the laserdisc production and is a forum member. Perhaps he would be able to provide some insight.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Jay Gregory]

I've just received the MGM version of Silence Of The Lambs, and have owned the Criterion Collection version for a couple of years.
I haven't had the opportunity to check out the deleted scenes on the new disk. Can anyone point me to a detailed comparison between both sets of scenes? Is there much overlap between the scenes included on both disks?
Overall, I'm impressed with the MGM version so far. It appears that it serves as a good complement to the Criterion version.

 

[Paul.S]

Peter Overduin:

Do you still have it and, if so, are you willing to sell it?
Post or e-mail me please.
Paul