Scott Atwell Star Trek Discussion thread (Series and Films) (10 Viewers)

[Nelson Au]

Scott, yes, I was making a little joke. Kate Mulgrew was cast as the spin-off series main title character, Mrs Columbo! As I understand, the series underperformed as she was a crime reporter and her character's name was quickly changed to Callahan and she became more a sleuth. All references to Columbo were dropped. I remember seeing the pilot episode and how odd it was so different from Columbo.She never appeared in the Peter Falk films.

 

[FanCollector]

Boy, you go to a meeting and things all break loose around here!It could be the bar in Troubled Waters as Walter suggests. (It's a fourth season episode, if you're looking. They filmed it on a real cruise, which would have been more fun if the water hasn't been extremely turbulent. Columbo's seasickness didn't have to be feigned!)It could also be Last Salute to the Commodore, a very unusual fifth season episode also starring Robert Vaughn from Troubled Waters. The whole thing centers around a yacht club and there are a few bars in it.Longer shot: Dead Weight with Eddie Albert from the first season. The initial crime is witnessed through a large wall-sized window by a boating Suzanne Pleshette and much discussion centers on looking through that window in both directions.

 

[FanCollector]

Scott, I believe Mrs. Columbo/Kate Loves a Mystery aired in the fall of 1979, a year after the end of Columbo on NBC.Nelson, Kevin Pollak's impressions are very funny. Years ago, he used to do an act in which William Shatner was a general addressing the troops before a big battle and soldiers Peter Falk and Woody Allen kept interrupting with questions. "Yes! You! The soldier in the raincoat! What is it now?"

 

[FanCollector]

Oh, just one more thing, Nelson...did you see the Mrs. Columbo pilot back in 1979 or more recently? Was it good? I just think Robert Culp is such a good actor and so perfect for those kinds of parts.

 

[Nelson Au]

Let's see if this link works:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHPclZ0cNgA&feature=youtube_gdata_playerThanks for the info on Pollak, Lee. I'll keep an eye out for his act!I did see Mrs. Columbo when the first episode first aired. I don't remember it at all! I do remember the titles and the link above is how I remembered it! I didn't recall the case or Culp being in it. I do remember thinking that this wasn't at all like Columbo. Looking at the video, she looks so young, yet made up to look older. The sweater really fools you to think she could be Maureen Stapleton or the like.

 

[Nelson Au]

I caught the last 30 minutes of a Columbo a few weeks ago with Robert Culp. I agree, he's very good. Speaking of him, I remember a really good TV movie he made. I forget the title, but he's an ordinary guy in a neighborhood suddenly terrorized by the teens in the neighborhood who drive really nice muscle cars who vandalize his home and ultimately breaks his temper when the kids throw something into his house that breaks a window and seriously injures his house keeper. So he goes out to each of the kids homes, warns them he's there and to watch out and proceeds to torch, destroy and smash each of the teens muscle cars. Maybe it was called Outrage.

 

[FanCollector]

Mrs. Columbo was similar in that the stories were inverted mysteries in which the guest star commits the murder at the beginning and then she has to catch him. The difference is that Columbo, for all its wonderfully intricate plotting, is about the central relationship between Columbo and the murderer, whereas Mrs. Columbo generally didn't have much of a relationship with the killers and so it was just a series of planted clues. The only reason I thought the pilot might have been better is that, besides having Culp, I think it was two hours which might have left time for character stuff.

 

[FanCollector]

I think it was Outrage. I never saw it, but I heard him talking about it and his ambivalence about the reaction to it by viewers who interpreted it in various ways. I did see some excellent TV movies he did earlier than that one: A Cold Night's Death--one of the creepiest movies ever! He and Eli Wallach are trapped at a polar research station and someone is trying to kill them. A Cry For Help, in which Culp is a cynical talk radio host who gets a call from a suicidal girl and has to try to find her before his show ends; it's told in real time, too. And See the Man Run, where he is an actor who is accidentally drawn into a kidnapping scheme and he decides to take advantage of the situation despite the risks and moral concerns. Anyone else remember those?

 

[Nelson Au]

I found Outrage on YouTube. What bothered him about the audience reaction? A concern for vigilanteism? Or revenge? Those seem like valid concerns. It pushed all the right buttons for me, I could feel for his frustration.Those other films don't ring a bell for me. Except maybe the radio talk show host? That sounds vaguely familiar.

 

[FanCollector]

I'll try to see it soon. Yes, you're right. Culp saw the story as showing the frustration and breakdown of an ordinary man faced with the worst of society, but he had the impression that some viewers were cheering the character on, as a hero rather than a damaged figure. He drew a connection to the later Death Wish movies with Charles Bronson, which fully embraced the vigilante hero.

 

[Ockeghem]

Scott, yes, I was making a little joke.

"Very little, Ensign."

 

[Ockeghem]

Boy, you go to a meeting and things all break loose around here!It could be the bar in Troubled Waters as Walter suggests. (It's a fourth season episode, if you're looking. They filmed it on a real cruise, which would have been more fun if the water hasn't been extremely turbulent. Columbo's seasickness didn't have to be feigned!)It could also be Last Salute to the Commodore, a very unusual fifth season episode also starring Robert Vaughn from Troubled Waters. The whole thing centers around a yacht club and there are a few bars in it.Longer shot: Dead Weight with Eddie Albert from the first season. The initial crime is witnessed through a large wall-sized window by a boating Suzanne Pleshette and much discussion centers on looking through that window in both directions.

Lee,Thanks. I can rule out the third one (the 'longer shot') you listed, as I own that and I remember both Eddie Albert and Suzanne Pleshette distinctly. However, I will add the second one you listed as another that I will have to watch. As they say, I will know it when I see it.

 

[Nelson Au]

I have two episodes in mind after a recent listen to them. Mirror Mirror and The Immunity Syndrome. It occurred to me, how would we on earth feel if a friendly alien species came to befriend us. Excluding District 9 amd To Serve Man scenarios. It made me wonder, if they were here to not only make friends, would we be so willing to trade them for a mineral they need and we have plenty of? Even if they offered a cure to our diseases, would we be able to do it without ill will and avarice. I can see the Halkin's side.And in Immunity Syndrome, I wondered about Spock's attitude in Devil in the Dark. The cell was a life form. Did they have to right to destroy it? Of course the over riding directive I'm sure was to preserve life and the safety of Federation interests. Kirk did say it wasn't intellegent. It was sort of like swatting a fly. Anyway, just musing about the possibilities. There was a form space life the Enterprise D encounters and accidentally kills. Which they felt really bad about. But it managed to give birth so they took care of the baby.

 

[Nelson Au]

I like Suzanne Pleshette, it will be interesting to see her outside of Bob Newhart whenever I can get that Columbo set! She was great in The Birds.

 

[Ockeghem]

Check it out!

http://shop.startrek.com/?ecid=SMM-ST-00103&pa=SMM-ST-00103

 

[bryan4999]

I have two episodes in mind after a recent listen to them. Mirror Mirror and The Immunity Syndrome.It occurred to me, how would we on earth feel if a friendly alien species came to befriend us. Excluding District 9 amd To Serve Man scenarios. It made me wonder, if they were here to not only make friends, would we be so willing to trade them for a mineral they need and we have plenty of? Even if they offered a cure to our diseases, would we be able to do it without ill will and avarice. I can see the Halkin's side.And in Immunity Syndrome, I wondered about Spock's attitude in Devil in the Dark. The cell was a life form. Did they have to right to destroy it? Of course the over riding directive I'm sure was to preserve life and the safety of Federation interests. Kirk did say it wasn't intellegent. It was sort of like swatting a fly.Anyway, just musing about the possibilities. There was a form space life the Enterprise D encounters and accidentally kills. Which they felt really bad about. But it managed to give birth so they took care of the baby.

One attribute of almost every planet visited in any Star Trek franchise is a "One World" government, which is obviously certainly not true here on earth at this point. Who would friendly aliens deal with? They would have very different experiences depending on where they landed. Of course, it is proven every day over and over that we humans can hardly tolerate different skin colors; not to be pessimistic (Roddenberry wasn't, but he placed Star Trek many years in the future) but I fear humanity would be rather xenophobic at this stage.

 

[Ockeghem]

"It occurred to me, how would we on earth feel if a friendly alien species came to befriend us."

Nelson,

When I first read this line, I thought immediately of The Day the Earth Stood Still (1951). I doubt very much that humanity has changed for the better since that (albeit fictional) encounter. This is one of the primary reasons why I find Roddenberry's nearly-Utopian vision to be so imaginative and worthy of multiple viewings.

Bryan,

I agree with regard to your xenophobic description above. Now I am thinking of a couple of episodes of TNG and VOY that explored races that were xenophobic.

 

[FanCollector]

Oh, yeah...Star Trek!With regard to Mirror, Mirror I never thought about that question. It does seem as though the Halkans are acting out of principle rather than self-interest in that case. But if aliens came here and asked? I'd like to think we would be careful, but forget fuel sources...have you seen where we sell our actual weapons? And we do it without getting any cures.The amoeba in The Immunity Syndrome seems different to me from the Horta. Size aside, it really is the simplest form of life and is millions of years from evolving into anything more intelligent. As a vegetarian, for example, I drink water that surely has some microorganisms like that in it. Even on a larger scale, Spock doesn't lecture Kirk on his chicken sandwich. I think part of Spock's concern for the Horta was that he thought it might be the last of its kind. (And his philosophical swap with Kirk when the Horta is threatening Kirk is one of the greatest character moments for both in the entire series.)The baffling one for me is The Man Trap. It would have been so easy to keep the M-113 creature alive, but none of them try, including Spock. I know that the pacifist Spock was an invention of Gene Coon who wasn't there yet, but it's hard for me to justify everyone else's lack of concern as well, which is why the episode always makes me so uncomfortable.

 

[bryan4999]

The baffling one for me is The Man Trap. It would have been so easy to keep the M-113 creature alive, but none of them try, including Spock. I know that the pacifist Spock was an invention of Gene Coon who wasn't there yet, but it's hard for me to justify everyone else's lack of concern as well, which is why the episode always makes me so uncomfortable.

That episode has always bothered me, too, and I have always rationalized it by reasoning that the crew were not sure of what they were dealing with and it was acting aggressively, especially toward the end when it attacked Kirk.

David Gerrold wrote in his book about writing "Tribbles" that when he saw this episode in its first run, he was a bit concerned that Star Trek was going to be a "monster of the week" type show. I agree that this episode is a bit like that. If the creature was so intelligent, I think the story would have been more interesting if it was more like the "Horta" story. They could have learned to communicate with it, helped it survive, and shown right from the beginning that Star Trek was about kindness and understanding, rather than the monster angle. Growing pains. I am sure they were going for the excitement angle at that point; look at the scary things the crew is going to face every week!

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,

In my personal world view, I agree with you regarding The Man Trap (i.e., vengeance is not mine). However, in Roddenberry's world view, and taking the episode within that context, I would have to say that I have no problem with the demise of 'the buffalo' because it had killed several times to that point.