Rodgers & Hammerstein SE's 2005 (1 Viewer)

[Robert Crawford]

It's not a rumor! I know for a fact that The Sound of Music will be release next year with the corrections to the problems from the prior dvd release.

As far as those other titles, let's just say I wouldn't be surprise, if some of them are also released.






Crawdaddy

 

[Joe Caps]

Because Todd aO was new and at the time, there was no way to reduction print the todd ao 70mm down to 35mm, it was thought best to film the entire thing twice.
The credits are different - in the todd ao they are red credits ona black background - iin scope they are yellow credits over live footage of Oklahoma.
Because 70mm stock was new, it was also scarce, so mistakes were no retaken and some of these are in the film.
In the Kansas City number, Gene Nelson has to land on top of a crate - both feet are in the crate and he pulls out one foot at a time and continues dancing. In the Todd AO version, Gene lands the wrong way on the crate and starts to fall backwards and one of the chorus girls tries to catch him in case he falls, but Gene recovers and continues.
The song Oklahoma begins inside Aunt Ellers house. When the cast goes outside, Gordon MacRae touches one of the poles holding up the porch and it gives way in his hand and he has to put it back in place (in the Todd ao version)
One would think that the same prerecords would be used for both versions. In one case, there is a difference.
At the beginning of the Out of My Dreams ballet, there is a dance for the dancers portraying Laurie and Curlie, wonderfully danced by James Mitchell and Bambi Linn.
In the Todd AO version, there are two points where the dance is noticeably faster than in the scope version.
At the End of the film, everyone sings OhWhat a Beautiful Mornin. When they sing the final "day", the orchestra finishes the finale. The finish is several bars longer in the Todd AO version.

 

[John Whittle]

Joe Caps wrote: "Because Todd aO was new and at the time, there was no way to reduction print the todd ao 70mm down to 35mm, it was thought best to film the entire thing twice."



Joe, who I have the greatest respect for, just one minor addition. The problem with making a 35mm reduction print was that the original Todd-A.O. Specs had a film speed of 30 frames per second and it was the problem of converting this to 24 frames per second that caused the problem. It still is a problem, but with current technology you can have both a 24 fps version (with 3-2 pull down) and 30 fps version on DVD and the player can output the proper rate for your display device.

Such was not even a dream in the early 1950s. There had been reductions of 70mm negatives from few earlier hollywood features. (Fox Grandure (sp?) comes to mind).

Cinerama also had an non-standard frame rate of 26 fps. Both of these systems had this change because of flicker present on the giant presentation screens with 24 fps projection.

John

 

[Joe Caps]

You are quite right. Thanks for bringing this up.

 

[RobertSiegel]

I went to the Talkin Broadway site and jumped out of my seat to see Sound of Music stated as newly transferred. I want to say I have been reading regularly the Talkin' Broadway site for years now, and everything they have said has happened, so I do not doubt this news in any way. In fact, this is the best site to watch for anything about musicals on dvd. Somehow, they get the word before any dvd website does.

There are many more extras Fox could add to the already great special edition already available. There were 2 scenes cut from the film, hopefully Fox has them. One is where Maria meets Rolf, and was supposed to be in the middle of the Do Re Mi number, it was completely filmed. In fact, Charmain Carr (Leisl) has stated they were invited to the Fox lot to view them not long ago. I also think another commentary with Julie and Chris would be awesome, and more of the cast. There's alot of footage from the 25th anniversary reunion in Hollywood for that 70mm special event in 1990, there's hours of footage out there from the reunion between the Von Trapp family and the kids in the cast which took place, there was a featurette on ABC TV on February 29, 1976 the night ABC first showed the film that had interviews created for the short, there is alot happening with the Sing-a-long worldwide that could be made into a featurette. There were many alternate takes according to Robert Wise, hopefully they still exist. There was a 30 minute interview with Maria Von Trapp in 1973....Charmain Carr says she has hours of home movies on the set and would gladly let Fox use them, Christopher Plummer's singing tracks, Academy Award footage, dozens of appearances by Julie Andrews on talk shows during the original release and after that. I personally hope that Fox releases a box set this time, possibly shaped in the form of a mountain? I can see it now. and it would definately sell! AND the ultimate Fox could do is add a DTS track!

I've never believed that the sound on this movie was as good as it could have been. I understand that the music masters had deteoriated, but to me, the dvd of Oklahoma has a much wider range, especially in the upper frequencies. That was 10 years earlier.

I am glad to see Oklahoma included. Finally, a probable 16x9 transfer...these all should be special editions, not bare-bones discs. These are among the most treasured classics. Now for South Pacific and King and I. And if Universal would get some brains, FLOWER DRUM SONG. Fox would be most welcome to release the remake of State Fair as well.

 

[Kajs]

http://www.dvdreview.com/html/sound_..._special.shtml
http://www.sharplinearts.com/diary/diary.html

Both about the prior DVD release and LD.

 

[TedD]

It wasn't that good when I saw the original 70mm release in the theater, either. I saw Oklahome in 70mm 20 years after its original release and it sounded much better than SOM did at its original release.

SOM has no real detail because it has no high end. The low end is limited to the pipe organ in several scenes.

I'm afraid someone tried to make the frequency range sound like an optical track of the same era.

Ted

 

[Doug Bull]

Quote: The finish is several bars longer in the Tod-AO version"

Thanks Joe, I thought it sounded different, but as I no longer have the Cinemascope Laserdisc, I was never quite sure if I imagined it or not.

What version is used on the recent Soundtrack CD?

 

[Joe Caps]

Probably the cd uses the Todd ao version. that cd claimed to be from raw music masters,but there are sound effects all the way through. they lied.
the raw masters still exist for carousel and South Pacific. I would love to hear them.
Carousel has a song cut from the film - Blow High Blow Low - and that song has always been a part of the album. What is missing is the dance that followed it.

 

[JPCinema]

Great News but yes where is FLOWER DRUM SONG and STATE FAIR 62?

 

[Thomas T]

1. I can't wait for the remastered Sound Of Music. The edge enhancement on the current disc makes it near impossible to watch.

2. Flower Drum Song is a Universal film, not Fox.

3. Speaking of Rodgers & Hammerstein, am I the only one doing backflips at Image's December release of the 1957 Cinderella Special Edition with Julie Andrews, unseen in 50 years?

 

[MatthewA]

Also, another thing:

In 1995 NBC aired the film (Sound of Music) uncut and had Julie Andrews hosting it. Perhaps they can get the footage from there, too?

 

[Jon_W]

Quite right, but who ever owns it, DVD has been around far too long not have this film out. And what a perfect thread to bring it up in.

 

[Dustin James]

.

 

[RobertSiegel]

Joe, interesting to know about BLOW HIGH BLOW LOW....I love the song and it was one of my favorites from the Lincoln Center cast album on RCA. I had no idea they filmed it, I figured it was one of those songs cut for the movie completely. That would be great to hear.

Ted, I have to wonder how SOUND OF MUSIC would sound had the raw masters survived in better condition. According to that story on the DVD Review website about how the film was transferred, these were actually used. Joe Capps, do you know this for a fact? I would think that the raw masters, recorded in 1965, would sound pretty darn good compared to some of the trnafers from even 10 years before that. So I am assuming they decayed? Weren't the raw masters used for the gold CD included with the laserdisc box set? In any case I remember reading somewhere that they were in such decay that they could only be run through the machines one time and then fell apart. So, when it says on Talkin' Broadway that there will be a remaster, I wonder if that just means correction of the awful edge enhancement issues or if they have a better source? Anyone know more on this?

 

[Porter Faulkner]

I think the reasons that 'Flower Drum Song' and 'State Fair' (1962) have not been released is that the Rogers and Hammerstein estate have long been dismissive of these two titles and they were generally seen as unsuccesful. Neither film is in the same class as the big 5 (SOM,King and I,Oklahoma,South Pacific,Carousel)and I guess their inclusion would diminish the whole.

'Flower Drum Song' is desperately racist and treats San Francisco's Chinese community like they are a bunch of lovable freaks. 'State Fair' is just a tawdry 60's remake of a much loved 40's classic.

However,that aside, Flower Drum Song has some great fun moments and in spite of its limited budget can be entertaining. Universal released it on laserdisc in pan and scan and it looked apalling and sold badly so I guess they wont rush it.

'State Fair' in spite of its excruciating singing and vocal dubbing, lack lustre cast and bad direction still continues to command top prices ($30-$40!) on ebay for the VHS pan and scan version or copies from Fox Movie Channel. It seems to occupy a special place in the hearts of the public, probably to do with the films only decent performance, dazzling Ann-Margret.

Don't hold your breath for either of these to come out soon.

 

[TedD]

Robert:

My first hand experience is that the original 70mm release 6 track mag prints of SOM were nothing to brag about. I saw it in several theatres in several cities in 70mm, including NYC. There was no real high frequency info in any of them. It's like the highs were rolled of at around 8 or 9 KHz. This could have been done anywhere in the recording chain, but I'm betting that is was done during the original recordings and was the concious decision of some poor misguided person who wanted it to sound like their idea of what a movie soundtrack would sound like and not like a live performance.

If it didn't have a wide frequency range in the original release, then I'm afraid nothing we can do today will ever change that.

Ted

 

[Bob Graham]

Any chance STATE FAIR 62 could be included as part of the STATE FAIR SE?

 

[Joe Caps]

Two things - most ma recordings of the sound of music era cut off around 8 or pkhz.
In the Rodgers and Hammerstein newsletter of a few months ago, the R and H org asked people to write to Universal for the release of Flower Drum Song - they want it released too, but Universal owns the rights.

 

[Jon_W]

As a student of history and the boyfriend of someone who is Chinese(and loves the film!) I think I have to make a comment about Flower Drum Song being racist. First any good historian knows that when looking at anything that is historical, especially a piece of culture, the time in which it was made needs to be taken into account. Yes, some of the people in Flower Drum Song are stereotyped. However, Flower Drum Song should be seen as a product of its time AND as a rare Hollywood film that actually has Asians as lead characters. Furthermore, I know at least one person who is Asian, my boyfriend, and who loves the film.

Of course this does not invalidate the notion that some people Hollywood might not want the film released because it is seen as racist, however, we should not allow such beliefs to prevent us from being able to get the film on DVD as that, in my mind, is blatent censorship. This little rant is more towards people who would prescribe to the notion that a film like Flower Drum Song should not be release and not directed at the gentleman who brought up the racist issue with regard to the film, although I disagree with his view of the film