Reverse 3:2 Pulldown vs. Progressive DVD Player (1 Viewer)

[Chris Tedesco]

I just bought the 36inch XBR800 HDTV. Love it so far, of course I haven't even set it up yet.

Anyway, I know the unit has Cinemotion 3:2 Reverse pulldown, my question is, since it has this do I really need a progressive scan DVD Player?

Take note, I wouldn't be getting a $800 DVD player, more like that new Pioneer 563A Pure Cinema.

Anyway, I have a non-progressive DVD player right now (Panny 120a). I am just wondering if that will work just as well with Cinemotion turned on.

I hope this makes some sense.

Thanks,

 

[Guy Kuo]

Maybe yes, maybe no. It's not an easy question to answer because it depends on the source material, how the DVD player creates its progressive scan signal and how the display creates the progressive scan signal.

First, if you use the display's deinterlacer, you are dependent on how well the designers implemented the system. It has to detect video and film cadence changes and adapt its deinterlacing method both accurately and correctly to create a progressive image. Not all deinterlacers are created equally. How well your display's works is not an entire trivial thing to test. One has to see how well it handles video and film modes, motion, and edit transitions which alter the cadence. We've included a "Motion Transitions" test sequence in the upcoming AVIA Pro so equipment testers can see how well a deinterlacer handles all 25 film to film transitions, five film to video, and five video to film transitions. The tool isn't out in anyone's hands yet, but people will finally have a comprehensive test sequence for deinterlacer function.

If you use a progressive scan player's progressive output, you may or may not have more accurate deinterlacing. It depends on how the deinterlacer was implemented in the player. If it completely depends on proper flagging of film cadence, it will probably work perfectly and better than the displays deinterlacer IF the DVD was mastered with correct flagging. Unfortunately, not all DVD's are properly flagged, so a player which depends on flags can be tripped up. In that case the display's deinterlacer would do a better job. On the other hand, a DVD player may also include cadence detection logic and be able to correctly deinterlace improperly flagged material. It depends on the player implementation.

I don't think anyone has concise and certainly not complete testing of DVD player and display deinterlacer performance sufficiently well tabulated to enable easy comparison by shoppers. The tools simply haven't been avaialable for easy and thorough testing. Once AVIA Pro is released, it is my hope such information can be compiled so consumers can make choices based on objective testing.

Sorry it's not possible to answer your question more directly. I'm sure some opinions will be given claiming the superiority of one vs the other, but personally, I wouldn't care to make a claim until after both the player and display deinterlacers are thoroughly tested.

In the mean time, I'd use the display's deinterlacer and watch for "combing" artifacts at scene changes and during motion. If you see combing, the deinterlacer is likely not doing a great job. I'll leave it to someone else to explain what a combing artifact looks like. Look also for the terms "Bob" and "Weave" on the net in relation to deinterlacing.

 

[MichaelDDD]

I knew this forum was a great source of quality information..but wow...one of the designers of the Avia DVD?

*tips hat* Thanks, Guy; you and your coworkers created one awesome product. I'll be preordering the Avia Pro DVD as soon as it becomes available. I can't tell you how many of my friends TVs I've calibrated with my disc...and how much of their beer I drank while doing so. Thanks.

 

[Chris Tedesco]

On the other hand, a DVD player may also include cadence detection logic and be able to correctly deinterlace improperly flagged material. It depends on the player implementation.

How would one find out if a DVD player has cadence detection logic? Does the Pioneer 563a have this?

Guy, thanks for the information. I now know there is a lot more to learn than I thought!

I think I'll probably go ahead and get the Pioneer, if nothing else, I'll be able to play SACD's now!