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Promising news for Marantz x200 owners (1 Viewer)

Salvador

Second Unit
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Messages
431
I just finished talking to a representative at a local retailer (American Sound of Canada) and he said that the problem with the x200 has been resolved.

I'm taking this with a pinch of salt. First of all, when i asked him if he was aware of the problem with the x200 line he said that he wasn't. He then put me on hold and confided with his associate and told me that the problem has been taken care of with the 'new' batch. I tried to dig deeper and asked him if there was an official statement from Marantz about the fix but he said that he didn't know.

Sounds like there's a bit of horse crud in there. Half truths, half lies is what i'm sensing.

If anyone out there has received any new information about the x200 line please share it with us. I'm really interested in getting either the 5200 or 6200 model.

thanks
 

ChrisAG

Supporting Actor
Joined
Aug 26, 2001
Messages
503
Salvador,

What "problem" has been resolved? There are several - popping, digital dropouts, and flakey S-video (even repaired units).

I also was in contact with Enzo at American Sound. While he is a nice guy to deal with, I knew about all of the problems with the Marantz units before he did. Most of my knowledge came from personal experience with three separate units, discussions on this board, and discussions with Lenbrook (who were only forthcoming on the original S-video problem). No-one wants to admit anything it seems.

Since I no longer have a receiver, I'm no longer talking to Lenbrook or the dealer at this time. Maybe next month...
 

Salvador

Second Unit
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Messages
431
i mentioned audio dropouts when choosing tracks, s-video problems during bright flashes, and audio noise on analog inputs.

as i said, i am skeptical about what that person (forgot to ask for his name) said about the those problems being resolved. Sorry if i wasn't specific on the details i mentioned.

But anyway those guys seem to be clueless about the whole situation. Isn't it part of their job to make themselves aware of these problems. I mean you can't start recommending products to people that have a known flaw or prolem that hasn't been resolved.
 
Joined
Sep 30, 2001
Messages
40
I finally talked to someone from Lenbrook (Montreal and Pickering offices) this morning. They are aware of a "popping" problem and they seem to have a fix for that. They don't seem to know about the digital drop-outs but they think that the two problems could be related. I'm suppose to have more feedback very soon. They also are going to look into the S-Video/bright flash bug.

I'll keep you posted.
 

Kevin C Brown

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2000
Messages
5,723
(I mentioned before that I don't have a Marantz anything yet, but will be looking forward to their next pre/pro... So I'm interested in how they handle this "customer support" issue.)
Just curious if anyone has tried to write and send them an actual physical, US Mail letter?
I have good luck doing that with Sony in the past. (Whereas phone calls got me nowhere.) I always sent 2 copies: 1 to the main customer service address, and just to make sure :) one to their U.S. headquarters.
 

ChrisAG

Supporting Actor
Joined
Aug 26, 2001
Messages
503
I don't see how the digital drop-outs and popping could be related. the former is a digital signal detection problem (lag), and the latter is an energy or static build up that is suddenly and uncontrollably released.
 
Joined
Sep 30, 2001
Messages
40
ChrisAG,

I understand what you mean and I think that what Marantz/Lenbrook calls popping is not the same problem that other noticed on their receiver. The problem that they mentionned to me that they have solved has to do with a "muting circuit" in the receiver causing some pops. My explanation of the digital drop-outs makes them think it could be related (muting between tracks when there is no signal).

I did try to reproduce the popping bug. I listened to a CD for 45 min at -15 db and I turned the volume down after. There was no pop. I do hear something when I turn the volume knob up and down, a very faint pop in the other speakers (center, surround) but that's all. No severe pop.
 

Chris PC

Senior HTF Member
Joined
May 12, 2001
Messages
3,975
Hey fellow Marantz jammers :) Well, I have decided to sit on my Marantz for now (smash!). haha. No really, I'm just going to keep it. I had the S-video repaired and the only severe problem I still have is the drop-outs. Since I noticed the Onkyo had them too, I wonder what the deal is. My receiver sounds very good though. I must admit that I like the sound. I bi-wired my speakers and I thought I lost some bass, but I think I was imagining things. All in all, the sound is very good and movie playback is great. I think I might also have some other issues, but I'll have to see. The RC6200 remote is kinda wacky. I should replace the thing with a remote that I can see in the dark at least. With the 3 year warranty, I may keep my receiver and hound Marantz for the drop-out fix.
I have not experienced the popping sound. Could you guys gimmie the drill? Tell me what to do in order that I might hear it? For instance, lets say I play a CD at -15 dB for XX minutes and then turn the volume down, how far exactly do I turn it down? I doubt I will hear the pop, because I have not heard the pop yet. The only "pop" I've ever heard in my system is the stupid circuit cutting in and out when playing a CD through a digital cable.
 
Joined
Dec 2, 2001
Messages
18
Well, in my case, the "popping" is pretty easy to reproduce.

- Listen to a CD at a normal volume level (-15db is plenty load) for probably 3-45 minutes or so.

- Press the mute button

Or, you can turn the volume down really low or switch to a different source. All of these seem to make it happen in my case.
 

Rafael Maya

Auditioning
Joined
Oct 30, 2001
Messages
6
Guys,

It seems to me that the two problems are related (POP, digital drop out) because the digital drop out sound just the same as the POP but much lower in volume and after all the mute circuit has capacitors which could easily be discharged, after all when you turn the volume down all the way to -75db the mute circuit comes on, the same happens when changing from DVD to CD otherwise the output transistors would have a load one second, and no load the next second, which stresses the output transistors over time.

Another thing that I don't seems to understand about the digital dropout (can someone explain..please). If the digital signal drops out, the data is not being sent to the receiver but the display shows that it is receiving data. So, as far as I can see there isn't any drop out in the signal instead the mute circuit comes on to prevent any noise (hiss) in the analog recordings (AAD, ADD) CD's. That is why the "digital drop out" only happens when using digitals inputs (at least in my receiver). I hope someone can clarify this for me.

I hope someone can clarify this for me.
 

Chris PC

Senior HTF Member
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May 12, 2001
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No loud popping here. I tried the test. Played music at -15dB for 40 minutes and then turned the volume down to -75 dB. I here a tiny click at -74dB to -75 dB where I assume the receiver simply mutes. Its so low, I can barely hear it. I never turn the volume down that low anyways.

The digital dropouts are almost a misnomer I think. What happens is this, inbetween tracks, the receiver changes its operation, it is no-longer in the mode of decoding a signal, and the track comes in part way and gets cut off. Wouldn't the output transistors need muting just the same with an analog signals? There are never any dropouts using analog sources. I would rather refer to the "drop-out" problem as an audio "cut-off" or audio "truncation" problem. The "drop-out" name comes from when you hear audio AND THEN it is cut off. My problem is not that, its when the beginning of a track is not heard and the playback starts AFTER the start of the track, cutting off the beginning with "anngg" instead of "banngg". The Onkyo 797 seemed to do the same thing as my Marantz SR 6200. The NAD T761 did not.
 
Joined
Dec 2, 2001
Messages
18
Well, I just got done exchanging my 5200 for a brand new one. I do belive there is some improvement. However, I do notice some pops in certain instances. After playing around a little bit, I seem to hear them when using one of the specialized modes like Dolby Pro Logic or 6 channel stereo.

ChrisPC - when you ran your tests did you do it in plain stereo mode or did you use Dolby Pro Logic or anything like that?

I'm going to continue to follow up with Marantz about this. The bad thing is that I watched a movie last night and was just in love with the sound. I don't want to get rid of it!
 
Joined
Sep 30, 2001
Messages
40
I just got some small feedback and I wanted to share it with you guys...

I asked to my Lenbrook/Marantz rep what was going on with the popping/drop-out issue and he told me that the case is being looked at in Japan. He confirmed to me that the problem was in the design of the digital circuit. He told me that I won't have any news before January. But the worst thing he told me (and I'm not making this up !) is that the problem is present in ALL the x200 family (4200 to 9200). It seems to be less noticeable on some models.

So, the case is still open and I'll be wainting for a final update in January. I still think I may go buy something else... After all the discussions, what's the next best thing ? Yamaha RX-V1200 ? Denon 2802 ? Onkyo has the same problems ?

Happy Holidays everybody !

Joyeux Noël !!
 

Salvador

Second Unit
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Messages
431
Darn, this isn't good. I'm planning to make my purchase soon and marantz seems to be the most cost effective solution out there. It's just those stupid problems that's making me weary.
 

Jagan Seshadri

Supporting Actor
Joined
Nov 5, 2001
Messages
528
Salvador, I know how you feel. I bought a Marantz 5200 thinking it would be cost effective. It was cost ineffective, unfortunately. Good price, but problematic units.

-JNS
 

Salvador

Second Unit
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Messages
431
I'm leaving in a short while to go to Great Met Sound here in Toronto. I want to hear and see what's going on with the x200 line and audition some speakers as well. I'm going to bomabard whoever is there with questions about the x200 line.

The 5200 and 6200 offer 6.1 and preout flexibility. THe only other options in my price range are the Denon 1802 and Onkyo 595, neither offer those attributes.

I'm willing to roll the dice here if the store i purchase it from will allow me to exchange the unit once everything gets resolved. I have no way to test the S-video noise problem since this receiver will be hooked up to my computer. I don't want to run into that problem a couple of years down the road and not being able to exchange it for a properly working unit.
 
Joined
Dec 2, 2001
Messages
18
Here's an update on my situation.

I have just sent my 5200 back to a service center here in the States (prepaid UPS). They claim to have a fix for the "popping problems."

The gist of the problem is that there is a charge building up on the mute circuit (over the course of about 15 minutes). When muting occurs, the charge is discharged and causes the pops. The solution is to modify/add some resistors to bring the circuit to ground and discharge the circuit before it can cause problems.

I should have the unit back in a week or two and will report on the status of the fix.

I would encourage people that are having problems to contact Marantz through their web site and politely explain the problem. They have been forthcoming with me and have made a good effort to get it fixed.

Like others here, I looked at other units, but didn't see anything in the same price range that met my needs - that my dealer carried. Because of the "deal" I got on the Marantz/Paradigm speaker package, it wouldn't make sense for me to get a refund and try my luck elsewhere.
 

Chris PC

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May 12, 2001
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Well, I hope I'm lucky. Apart from the annoying digital cut-off, I don't have any of the other problems. For now I will listen to CD's from my CD player via analog cables, and also from my DVD player via analog cables. I haven't experienced any dropouts during movies. I never hear any popping. I will try reducing the volume or muting after listening for a length of time, but so far, I have never noticed any pops. I hear a distinct but very tiny "click" when i mute or reduce the volume from -74 dB to -75 dB. Its hardly loud enough to worry about. I will pay attention and hopefully those problems won't crop up on me. My S-video is ok, but eh remote is flaky as all heck. I will replace it for sure. It forgets codes, but really, I think I over programmed it and so the memory is replacing itself and writing over entries I made previously. Oh well.

The sound is quite good though. I really enjoy listening to it, thats for sure. I do hope they fix the digital-dropouts or cutoff problem. I look forward to that.

Here's a question for you Marantz owners. I have the Laserdisc and DVD connected via their respective digital coax and digital optical cables. I can also listen to audio from them via analong RCA's because I have connected the DVD player and Laserdisc player via analog RCA cables, but to other inputs. So for instance, DSS is the digital input for laserdisc, and then TAPE is the analog input. So, I have to change the input of course, in order to change between analog and digital. I noticed the Analog/Digital button or A/D button on the remote. Does that mean I can just route the analog RCA cables from each device into its respective input and then I only have to press the A/D button? That would be handy for listening to any analog laserdisc or when listeing to CD's via analog or whatever. So is that How I can use the A/D button?
 

Jagan Seshadri

Supporting Actor
Joined
Nov 5, 2001
Messages
528
Regarding switched video problems with the x200 series, I don't know if I'm stating what you all already know, but check out this thread over in the Home Theater Spot forum:
Marantz Video Problems
These problems seem to pre-date the x200 line... This makes me think that Marantz has allowed the fault to go unchecked, possibly because they view it as a small problem that not many people would notice.
ChrisPC, regarding your question,
Does that mean I can just route the analog RCA cables from each device into its respective input and then I only have to press the A/D button?
That's how it worked on my old 5200. And every time you turn on the receiver, each source selector defaults to either its analog or digital input, but you can set these defaults by using the onscreen display so you don't have to constantly muck around with the A/D button.
-JNS
 

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