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The Matrix Revolutions (2003) (1 Viewer)

JonathonSan

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I don't disagree with either of you at all, with the exception of feelin MORE for Neo in the later movies. Perhaps because I have never been in a situation where being a saviour was a challange...yet :) I do think the natural progression of the character archs created in the first is exectly what happened in the second and third. I was just pointing out that in very little to none of my readings of peoples analysis of Matrix was it implicitly about the connection I, and I'm sure others, felt with Mr. Anderson. Also I suppose my post was to perhaps justify others feeling/critiques towards the sequels being too big to have the personal connection that Matrix had, not that the criticisms are correct, just looking from the other side of the coin.
 

joDOR

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Also I suppose my post was to perhaps justify others feeling/critiques towards the sequels being too big to have the personal connection that Matrix had, not that the criticisms are correct, just looking from the other side of the coin.
it's a fair point, jonathon, and i wouldn't be surprised if you were right.
 

Dave Moritz

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I feel this trilogy would be nice to have in an HD format like BlueRay went it comes out. I hope we are not stuck with DD only and that the option to choose a DTS track is available. If the only thing we get is a higher resolution picture and the same tired DD track I most likely will not repurchase this trilogy. The dvd copy will hold me over until something happens to the dvd or until it just plain gets worn out.
 

Shawn_KE

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Anyone else feel that Don Davis (and Juno Reactor) were ripped on Oscar nods? I could not imagine these films without his awesome score.
 

Josh.C

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Well, I am a bit late to the party to say the least. I vowed never to watch the rest of the Matrix trilogy after being dissappointed by Reloaded. Several years later I decided to give it another try, and to my surprise, it worked much better for me the second time.

I will agree with the many on this post that I feel too much time was spent on the battle in Zion in Revolutions. I really feel that the things going on inside the Matrix is what makes the movies for me. I can see humans and machines slugging it out (as in the Zion battle) on plenty of decent Sci-Fi flicks. The Matrix concept however is genious, and really twisted my brain, which is a good thing. I didn't think Revolutions was terrible, but my least favorite of the three (after a nice comeback for Reloaded).

I'm glad I gave the films another chance, and I would really like to get my hands on the Commentaries to help me understand a few things I have questions about.

I just felt that there were many things left unexplored, and a bit rushed in this last movie. The scene where Morpheus, Trinity, and the Seraph (I believe that's correct? The oracle's body guard) go to the Frenchman to get Neo back is on of the things that bothered me. They made it out to be a huge deal to come out of this inbetween world (train station). Then all it takes is a gun to the head of the Frenchman, and we never hear of him again. I would have liked to see it more played out (a good time to focus on things inside the Matrix, instead of the battle in Zion).

Also, I never fully understood how Smith manifested himself in Bane in human form, and the movie did nothing to explain it. It was also a little hard to believe all of the dialogue Bane(Smith) had to go through before Neo realized who he really was.

There's my take, and even with it being my least favorite, it still had entertaining moments and kept my interest.

JC
 

JediFonger

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what a pleasant bump =). i don't think i've ruined this thread yet... time to put my stink on it! =).

perhaps no other recent film in history has stirred so much conversations and enlightenments about philosophy as the matrix. imho, it is the most philosophical set of films ever made. i mean in that in the sense that the film engages its audience towards trying to understand more philosophy than they may or may not want. that's why so many fans have written many web pages about the topic. i did it for a grade... so i'm gonna post an essay i wrote on the matrix trilogy just as revolutions was coming out of the cinema (lowered cinema counts). this is for philosophy class. the professor told us to pick a topic and relate it to a philosophical topic. i picked ontological and the matrix trilogy. here it is, enjoy!

JediFonger
May 1st, 2004
Philosophy
Professor So&So

Matrix Decoded

Prerequisites: You must have seen the Matrix Trilogy (The Matrix, Matrix Reloaded, Matrix Revolutions) movies before you read this article. This article will be full of spoilers.

Rabbit Hole

You are reading this article because you want answers. You have watched three movies that have asked profound questions and now you need profound answers. Morpheus said, “I told you I can only show you the door. You have to walk through it.” (Matrix 1:10:34). To decipher the Matrix I can only give you the tools, you must learn how to use it. What are those tools? You are already using one of them. Curiosity. Humans are blessed with an intellect to question everything.

There are two subjects that you need to have a brief introductory knowledge on before diving into the Matrix. These are the tool boxes that the tools will be stored in. You will need both to understand the Matrix. The first tool box is computer programming and the second is philosophy.

Construct
Computer programming is a relatively simple concept. Machines will perform actions based on what you command it to do, but machines do not understand any of the human languages. They only understand on and off. So how do you command a machine on what to do? The first step is you write a program in English codes. These lines of codes tell machines what they can or cannot do. These codes exist so that humans can understand what it is they are telling the machines to do. These codes also exist so that you can work with other humans to create more complex programs that in turn control machines to perform more complex actions. The second step is that these lines of code are run through a compiler, which is what translates English codes into a language computers can understand. The compiler takes lines of codes and turns them into a series of on and off instructions that the computer obeys. After you run codes through the compiler the result is what is called a binary file. Binary because the instructions are only on and off, two types of actions. The third step is the time you command the machine to execute the binary file so that the machine follows the file and performs the actions stored in the file. That, in a nutshell, is the basic concepts of computer programming! It sounds complex but if you read this paragraph through a few times you will grasp the concept.

Love of Wisdom

Unlike computer programming philosophy is an extensive subject that is beyond the scope of this article. If computer programming is a tool box then philosophy must be a tool shed.

What is philosophy? Philosophy is asking questions about yourself and how you relate to the people and the world around you. Through the act of answering those questions you will gain a greater understanding of yourself and others. This article will concentrate only on one aspect of philosophy in relations to The Matrix, determinism vs. free will.

Determinism means that every action you take is based on a cause, that your choices cannot be freely arrived at. All of your actions are based on a cause that you then act out in effect. There are many philosophers throughout the ages arguing determinism, but none as prominent as from the last century. B.F. Skinner and Sigmund Freud. They have turned to science for alleged proof of causality. These two are also the founders of modern psychology.

In Skinner’s pursuit for the study of human behavior he believes that your “choices” do no result from “free” choice, but are predictable responses to stimuli. A cause and effect (causality). An example would be when you go to work in the morning and you say, “Good Morning.” to your co workers. You will repeat the action again to the ones that respond warmly on the following day. Your “Good Morning” is the stimulus and your co-worker’s reception is the response. Same stimulus always evokes the same response. Skinner believes that humans are controlled by consequences of reinforcement. If your co-workers are positively reinforced into responding warmly to your good mornings then they will tend to repeat the response every time you stimulate them. The only problem is that Skinner does not take into account human emotions, which can take on unpredictable choices and cannot be empirically measured.

Sigmund Freud believes that all human behavior is controlled by the Unconscious. That below what you cognitively realize there is another level of consciousness. An example would be “Freudian slips”. If you are talking to a very attractive person and you want to say Hi to them but what came out of your mouth was Hi Sexy. It is your unconscious surfacing and reminding you of your physical desires. Freud believed that you have three parts of a personality; Id, Ego and Superego. Ego is you yourself. Id is the carnal physical drives of your body (typically encompassing sex and aggression). Superego are pressures from your friends, family, media, anything that did not originate from yourself. Freud believed that you did not choose to be who you are because you are made up of childhood experiences. These childhood experiences are what the Superego is made of. Both Superego and Id are pulling and tugging at the Ego. It is your parents telling you to be in a certain career, it is the media telling how you should look or talk, it is your friends telling you how to live your life, it is your hormones driving your need for sex. The problem with Freud’s idea is responsibility. There is no way of accounting for criminals that say it was their Id that killed someone or their Superego that robbed a bank. Society would run amok.

Free will is the antithesis of determinism. Every choice that you make are not under the influence of others or causality. You are reading this article because you have chosen to enlighten yourself of new knowledge… or at least that is the hope of the author. The following three philosophers defend free will.

Aristotle tackles Freud’s problem of responsibility directly by dividing it up into voluntary and involuntary actions. Voluntary actions are choices that you knowingly take, therefore you are entirely responsible for those actions regardless of the time you made it. Let’s say you are miserable because you are reading this article right now. You voluntarily made the choice to read my article from the beginning. You still have a choice to stop reading, yet you continue to read. You are responsible for your own misery. Involuntary action is when a person, such as the author of this article, holds a gun to your head and demands you to read through this article. You are NOT responsible for those actions. Aristotle believes that through these choices humans define their personality.

William James’s pragmatism claims that free will gives humans a more satisfying and rational explanation of experience than determinism does. James believes that when you are presented with choices, you will regret the choice you did not make. That very feeling is why we have free will, it is because there is more than one choice at any given time.

Jean-Paul Sartre’s existentialism believes that you are totally and entirely bound to freedom that every choice that you make determines you very essence, your nature.

The problem with James’s “feelings” are that it is too unscientific. Sartre’s interpretation is too strict on making choices that define the make up of a person that he leaves nothing to external forces, such as Freud’s Superego.

The key to philosophy is a balance of ideas. Take the parts that you think makes sense to you and come up with your own philosophy.

Determined Freedom
“It’s the question that drives us, Neo. It’s the question that brought you here. You know the question just as I did.” Trinity said to Neo (Matrix 11:30). Now that you have a primer on both programming and philosophy you can begin by taking a look at determinism in the Matrix Trilogy. “The time has come to make a choice, Mr. Anderson,” Manager (Matrix 12:45). Very early on in the first movie we are presented with a choice. The Manager’s comment regarding Neo’s tardiness to work is within the Matrix but the Manager is really asking Neo to make a choice to knowing the truth of the Matrix. He is also asking the audience of the movie to answer that question. He is asking you to make a choice. What choice? The choice to understand philosophy, to apply it to your life and to gain understanding of the truth. That is also why the window washers are there in the same scene. The glass represents a view into life. The Warchowski Brothers only made one cameo appearance in all three movies. They are the window washers in this scene because they believe they are cleaning your mind’s eye into your own life. They are the philosophers that will take you on this journey of “choice”.

After Neo wakes up in the real world Morpheus apologizes to Neo for waking him out of the Matrix at such an old age. Morpheus then questioned Neo about going back to the Matrix. “But if you could would you really want to?” Morpheus (44:45). These attenuating circumstances would suggest that Morpheus is what Aristotle would refer to as an involuntary action from Neo’s point of view. Is Morpheus an agent of causality? Does his blind faith depend on an empty foundation? Is his belief in the Oracle logical? No, as we find out in Matrix Reloaded:

“Causality. Action, reaction. Cause and effect, “ said Merovingian.

“Everything begins with choice,” said Morpheus.

“No. Wrong. Choice is an illusion created between those with power and those without,” said Merovingian (Matrix Reloaded 1:06:03-1:06:22). Here we have an interesting contrast between Merovingian the determinist and Morpheus the freedom fighter. Merovingian is both B.F. Skinner and Freud combined through the illustration he uses. He attributes programming the cake as the cause and the effect is that woman getting very aroused. The Merovingian believes in this so much that he says, “Causality. There is no escape from it. We are forever slaves to it.” (Matrix Reloaded 1:08:07). Freud’s Id also plays into the picture as the Merovingian is able to physically satisfy his carnal lust without giving heed to his emotional consequences. That is why Persephone, Merovingian’s wife, helps Neo. In Matrix Reloaded Neo later meets the Architect that is even more deterministic than Merovingian. He notes that the Oracle “stumbled upon a solution whereby 99 percent of subjects accepted the program as long as they were given a choice even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level.” Architect(Matrix Reloaded 1:53:50). As Neo puts it, “Choice. The problem is choice.” (Matrix Reloaded 1:52:20). William James would have approved Neo’s statement for choice. The Architect represents the harsh cold reality of determinism. It is a series of mathematical precision, devoid of emotion, only logic and rationality. To the Architect humans are merely numbers and equations to be solved, balanced and manipulated. The problem with that approach is that human emotions do not quantify merely as stimulus and responses as Skinner puts it nor is it just Id or Superego at work. Warchowski specifically put the themes of love throughout the Matrix trilogy just for the purpose of explaining the irrational nature of human emotions. The Merovingian compares love to insanity in Matrix Revolutions. Love is what saved Neo from dying in Matrix, love is what saved Trinity in Matrix Reloaded and love is what saved Zion AND the machine world.

The Oracle is a neutral program inside of the Matrix that wants to survive the future. She could be deterministic or free will if that is the ticket to survive. “So it’s really up to you. Just have to make up your own damn mind to either accept what I’m going to tell you or reject it.” Oracle (Matrix Reloaded 45:36). “But if you already know, how can I make a choice?” Neo (Matrix Reloaded 45:53). So what is the Oracle? How can she see the future? Is she is manipulating it? “Now, since the real test for any choice is having to make the same choice again knowing full well what it might cost…” Oracle(Matrix Revolutions 5:55).

Is the Matrix Trilogy more determinism or free will? It appears from the above evidence that the Warchowski Brothers may have led you into determinism, that all of your life you have been controlled by the Matrix. Every choice that you make is a mirage of hope. As Mr. Smith says, “It is inevitable.” Smith(Matrix Reloaded 58:47). Nearly every character that Neo meets wants Neo to perform and action for them. In the beginning of the Matrix the Manager wants Neo to be on time. Agent Smith wants Neo to come clean of his cyber crimes. Morpheus leads him to the door but wants him to open it. Oracle wants Neo to save Morpheus. The crew of the Nebuchadnezzar wants Neo to save Zion. All of the Agents want Neo to die. In Matrix Reloaded all of Zion wants Neo to save them. The council of Zion wants Neo to save them. Merovingian wants to Neo to be locked up in a Train station. Architect wants Neo’s code to reboot the Matrix. In Matrix Revolutions the machines want Neo to kill Smith the Virus. Through the entire story Neo is being herded into a destiny that does not appear to be of his own choice. But that is not the end of it. The reason why the Matrix Trilogy are the most philosophical movies of all time is because for every side of an argument it provides the opposite view with equal footing.

Although every character commands Neo to perform an action, he still has a choice to make. Even though the Manager tells him to be on time, we know it is not the first time that Neo is late for work. Just like he flips off the Agents, he doesn’t care about the Matrix world. Morpheus gives Neo a blue pill and a red pill, Neo can make a choice. He can choose what to do. Although the Oracle gives Neo information the final choice is still Neo’s to make. Neo must make up his own mind. The Oracle gives information to the human characters so they can make their own choices. She does not impose her will upon them. In the Architect’s room Neo chooses to save Trinity and not Zion. There is a difference between what the people of Zion want, to save themselves, and what Neo wants. To save Trinity. He is so free that he is almost condemned to be free as Sartre says. The existential ideas are prevalent especially in Matrix Reloaded. You can argue that the Matrix Trilogy is entirely for free will because at the end of the Trilogy Neo chooses to sacrifice himself for the survival of both the machine world and Zion.

The Revolution
“Is it freedom or truth?” Smith (Matrix Revolutions 1:49:11)

Mr. Smith represents determinism and Neo represents free will. Smith is so bent on carrying out the course of causality that even if he destroys both the Matrix and the real world it does not matter because his philosophy is that what is coming is “inevitable”. Yet Neo prevails to rebel against that idea “Because I choose to.” Neo (Matrix Revolutions 1:49:57). Neo’s version of inevitability lies not in cause and effect but in a choice. “You were right, Smith. You were always right. It was inevitable.” Neo (Matrix Revolutions 1:52:35). His choice to sacrifice himself defies all logic and explanation, yet it is exactly this freedom to do this action that saves the world. Even with the Oracle’s eyes (to see the future) Smith could not see his own end because he is locked in the tower of causality. Even if Smith was told what Neo would do ahead of time Smith would not believe it because he is so deterministic.

The Matrix Trilogy has every branch of Philosophy explored. Simulacra & Simulation, a green book (Matrix 8:28) appeared in the first movie and Morpheus says, “Welcome to the desert of the real.” (Matrix 41:16) lifted directly out of Baudrillard’s first essay. Warchowski had most of the cast read this work before production of the movies. Neo says, “You ever have that feeling where you’re not sure if you’re awake or still dreaming?” it is a reference to Descartes’ Lucid Dreams. Neo references Buddhist and Judeo-Christian ideas in regards to God’s proof/existence, there is a heavy spiritual undertone throughout the Matrix.

Remember computer programming? Well inside a computer code there is a concept named “for loop”. A loop is needed sometimes when a program requires choices that need to be presented to the user. A for loop consists of initialization all of the components needed for the program to continue, a check in the condition, execute statements that is within the body of the for loop and finally it ends with commands that run after the loop happens. That piece of code from programming generally looks like this:

for(initialization;condition;postloop)
{
body;
}

You would use this when writing programs that call for a machine to perform an action for finite or infinite amount of times. An example would be the ATMs when you enter in your password. Let’s say your password was only 1 digit and it was the number 5. The ATM program might check to see if what you entered was 5 and then let’s you take out cash. This is where the for loop can come in handy. The code might look something like this:

for(insert_ATM_card;if_password=5;eject_ATM_card)
{
Withdrawl_money_allowed;
}

The computer checks to see if you inserted your ATM card, which is the initialization part, then it checks the condition of your password to see if it 5, if it is then the computer executes the body of the loop where the ATM is allowed to give you money. After that the computer executes the post loop that ejects your ATM card. If your password is incorrect it would just eject your ATM card and NOT allow you to withdraw money. Here is the for loop for the Matrix Trilogy:


for(matrix=wake_neo;reloaded=neo_chooses_trinity|| reloaded=neo_chooses_zion;revolutions++)
{
Destroy Zion;
}

Matrix is Neo’s awakening and his initialization into the real world from the Matrix. Reloaded is the condition that Neo choosing Trinity or, the two vertical lines represent OR, Neo choosing Zion. Either way Zion is destroyed, which then leads us to Revolutions rebooting the Matrix with Neo’s code by another iteration of 1. Revolutions++ means Revolutions=Revolutions+1.

What does all of this mean? At the end of Revolutions Oracle says that Neo may return, this means that the sequel to Revolutions is The first Matrix where everything starts over again. The Matrix Trilogy is an infinite loop full of endless and exhaustive examination of philosophical ideas unbounded by time. “Illusions, Mr. Anderson. Vagaries of perception. Temporary constructs of a feeble human intellect trying desperately to justify an existence that is without meaning or purpose!” Smith (Matrix Revolutions 1:49:16). This line of dialogue from the Warchowski Brothers is directed at you, the audience, to live life with a purpose or meaning. The original intent of the Matrix Trilogy is not only to entertain the physical, emotional senses but also the intellect, to stir your curiosity enough that you may start to seek out articles like this one. Philosophy works by probing deep into the most fundamental questions of life. Your journey has just begun. Calvin said to Hobbes at the very last panel of their existence as comics, “Let’s go exploring.”



Bibliography
-White, Thomas I. Discovering Philosophy Brief Edition. NJ: Prentice Hall, 1996.

-Irwin, William, eds. The Matrix and Philosophy: Welcome to the Desert of the Real. IL: Carus Publishing Co., 2002.

- Baudrillard, Jean. Simulacra and Simulation. Trans. Sheila Faria Glaser. MI: University of Michigan, 1994.

-The Matrix Trilogy. Dir. Warchowski Brothers. Perfs. Keanu Reeves, Joseph Cotton. Film/DVD. Warner Brothers, 1999 for the Matrix, 2003 for Matrix Reloaded, 2003 for Matrix Revolutions.

-Warner Brothers. “Philosophy & The Matrix”. The Matrix Trilogy Official Site. http://whatisthematrix.warnerbros.com/rl_cmp/phi.html (Nov 20th, 2002, March 20th, 2002, December 19th, 2003)

-Honderich, Ted, ed. THE DETERMINISM AND FREEDOM PHILOSOPHY WEBSITE. http://www.ucl.ac.uk/~uctytho/dfwIntroIndex.htm.
 

BrettGallman

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Weird, I also wrote a paper on "The Matrix" once, and of course referenced Baudrillard. Something about the semiotic implications or something like that.

It's an interesting point you made about the Matrix being a continual loop, with the first being the sequel to the third. Not so sure I agree or disagree with it (I really need to see both Reloaded and Revolutions together again), but I always wished the Terminator series would end with Kyle Reese going back in time, so the original is both prequel and sequel.
 

JediFonger

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well, whether you agree or not, the point is that matrix trilogy elicits conversation and thoughts. just google around, it is still one of the most popular films to stir discussions about meaning of life, religion, computers and anime, etc. very cool cross section.
 

BrettGallman

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I can definately get behind this point. No doubt it stirs a lot of those discussions. I was just referring to your point about the movies being a continual loop, as I thought the point of "Revolutions" was to show that things wouldn't be like they always were, whereas usually things are systemic and just simply reboot.
 

JediFonger

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well if you go through my example, the "loop" as it were isn't a "reboot". the loop concept in programming is based on variables being in different states. if the rule is set so that the variable is 0, then the loop goes on. but if the rule is set so that the variable is 1, then the loop stops. it's the matrix, maybe there were several iterations of neo or "the one" being in loops, but neo choosing love of trinity and of people of zion is the variable that broke the loop. again, that's one interpretation of several thousands or more =).
 

Fred Mitchell

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I soooo miss these movies. I keep hoping against all hope that the W's will make another. This is also coming from the same guy that was hoping the Matrix Online game would be a faithful continuation of the story.
 
D

DAN NEIR

A couple of questions, since I recently saw these movies again and seeing that this thread has popped up,
Why did the Matrix need Neo to get rid of Smith?
Couldn't it have sent a power surge through just about anyone seeing how Smith was copied onto everybody inside?
How exactly did destroying the Neo/Smith lead to a chain reaction destruction of the rest?
How did the Merivingian trap Neo if he was in the real world?
And one from the 1st Matrix that always bugged me, how was Cypher talking to Smith? Who was the operator that jacked him in and out? Wouldn't they have seen he was talking to an agent?
 

Chuck Mayer

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Backwards:

4) He did it himself. He was his own operator, and probably had a timer set.
3) He didn't. He simply owned control of the place Neo found himself at the end of Reloaded. It was sheer luck for him.
2) Smith was a code overwrite. The code was simply removed from all aspects of the Matrix based on...
1) Smith was the systemic anomaly discussed by the Architect. His code was intertwined with that of the One. The Matrix could not rid itself of Smith without Neo's code. A yin/yang thing.
 

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