**Official HTF HD Formats Ind./Retailer/Studio Support Thread-*SEE POST 3176, p. 106* (1 Viewer)

[Henry Gale]

"TOKYO (AP) — Japanese electronics maker Toshiba might withdraw its HD DVD next-generation video format, Kyodo News agency reported Saturday.
The report cited unidentified individuals from the industry as saying Toshiba Corp. is reviewing its operations, with the timing of the withdrawal to be decided later, depending on U.S. demand for its HD DVD products and other factors.

Calls went unanswered at Toshiba Corp.'s Tokyo office, which was closed for the weekend.

HD DVD has been competing against the Blu-ray technology, backed by Sony Corp., other makers and five major Hollywood movie studios.

Recently the Blu-ray disc format has been gaining market share, while Toshiba has been forced to slash prices to sell its HD DVD machines. A Toshiba pullout would signal the almost certain defeat of HD DVD to Blu-ray.

On Friday, Wal-Mart Stores Inc., the largest U.S. retailer, said it will sell only Blu-ray DVDs and hardware and no longer carry HD DVD offerings.

The announcement came five days after Netflix Inc. said it will cease carrying rentals in HD DVD. Several major U.S. retailers have made similar decisions, including Target Corp. and Blockbuster Inc."

 

[Steve...O]

Not necessarily. Only those households that don't have cable or satellite will be affected and even then a simple, and government subsized, converter box will allow them to continue using their TVs. I've seen varying percentages, but it is clear that the great majority of households (upwards of 90%) will not be affected in 2009 because they already have cable/satellite.

I hate to generalize but the 10% that don't have cable/satellite currently probably aren't the ones who typically are going to want the latest & greatest in technology simply because they either don't have the finanical resources or because it just isn't one of their priorities.

Sales of TVs may well go up but that will be due to factors other than the 2009 conversion.

 

[Robert Crawford]

Even with that said, I wonder how many people will buy new televisions because they didn't know that as long as they have cable or the satellite they'll be okay? Just last week, I informed a couple of people at work that a new television wasn't necessary who were getting ready to buy new televisions later this year due to the 2009 mandate.

 

[Dennis Nicholls]

I guess I'm one of those lackeys. I have two HDTV sets: a Samsung RPTV and an Optoma FPTV, both with ATSC tuners. I watch so little "television" that cable or DTV has limited appeal to me. But here in Boise the broadcast towers are at the top of one of the Rockies at about 5,000 ft above valley level and I have a clear LOS from my house to the transmission antenna.

However, I still may get one of the cheap-o ATSC boxes through the program.
www.dtv2009.gov I'd just use it to supply OTA broadcast audio for my garage for when I'm working on the car or the like.

 

[Marc Colella]

There's a lot of misinformation on the TV/Digital/HD front.

I don't know how many times I've heard people say that in 2009 everything will switch over to HD and that without an HDTV you won't catch anything. I've heard that from friends, co-workers, forums and home theatre salespeople who weren't even trying to make a sale.

I've had to inform many people that buying an HDTV doesn't automatically make everything they're watching HD. A few of those people had their HDTV hooked up through composite, so they weren't even taking advantage of what DVD had to offer (nevermind HD).

There's just too much confusion in this market - even amongst those who are tech-savy.

The only thing that can be counted on is that most people are buying flat panel HDTVs simply because it's an upgrade in size and it's looks sexy. Quality only comes into play when they're upgrading from an old TV set. If quality were a concern, the majority of TVs on store shelves would be rear-projection.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I agree, a lot of misinformation has confuse the buying public and has contributed to the slowness of accepting HDM. I hope with only one HDM format, the industry including retailers and studios can do a better job of educating the general public.

 

[Demise]

I can only speak for myself, but my objection to Mr. Hunt isn't what he did, but the way he chose to do it. If you admire him and wish to voice your support, that's fine. You might want to consider that others perceive his actions in a very different light. In my opinion, Mr. Hunt has been a very divisive force over the last year, and the home theater/film enthusiast community is the worse for it.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Well, since my original post was referring to consumers who don't appreciate the subtle improvements of transparent audio and video encoding, I certainly hope that's *NOT* what he meant.

Yes, of course eventually HD DVD consumers will need to go blu. But you even had HD DVD lived another 20 years, they'd have needed to buy a BD player to watch HDM from Disney, Fox, MGM, Lionsgate etc.

 

[JasonTil]

I would politely disagree, the home theater community is better off for the stand that Mr. Hunt took, much as it is far better off for the stand that he took in 1998-99 against the Divx format.

I don't seem to remember much criticism of Mr. Hunt for taking that stand.

 

[MatthewA]

This "war" isn't over yet. The battle of HDM is won, but BD vs. DVD remains to be fought.

 

[Maxpower1987]

This is very true, but you will start to see some real marketing dollars poured into Blu-ray now that HD DVD has gone not just from Sony and Panasonic, from retailers, studios and other CE manufacturers.

There are also other things planned to make the Blu-ray version of a home-theater release more desirable than the DVD by giving Blu-ray a special edition release of day and date movies that DVD won't receive.

 

[Robert Crawford]

It's a war I don't think BD will win because of so many cost factors beyond the MSRP of equipment and software. How can the studios justify the cost of getting the film elements and transfers ready of thousands of catalog titles for HDM releases?

Do they just release new titles and select catalog ones onto HDM and leave the rest to SD DVD? If so, what criteria do they use to determine which catalog titles make the cut for HDM releases? Do they also release those new titles and select catalog titles to SD DVD or are they Blu-ray (only) releases. So many questions need to be answered and the mass market will be the one determining some of those answers. This is not to say that Blu-ray won't make a significant market penetration, but it won't be in my opinion as penetrating as it has been for SD DVD.

 

[Maxpower1987]

I can't see how you could come to that conclusion, there has been a real push to get to a single format which is the best case scenario in this war so content providers and consumers don't feel the need to shy away for fear of getting burned.

Bill has led the way on thedigitalbits for the pursuit to attain a single format with the least consumers being hurt by the war. Unfortunately for a lot of people and enthusiasts it meant that they had to listen to him promote Blu-ray ahead of HD DVD, but in the end it has helped lead to a favourable outcome.

 

[Marc Colella]

But will that really affect the average consumer? Home Theatre and film nuts might jump to BD because of a movie having a Special Edition release, but how many of the average consumers will do that? It's one thing for them to spend $5 more on a Special Edition DVD release for the extras (which a high percentage of the average consumer don't care about the extras), but it's another thing for them to spend all this extra money on adopting a new format just to get it.

Plus, you just know the studios aren't going to turn down the opportunity to double-dip with a SE on DVD down the road anyways. The market is simply too large for them to ignore the extra sales.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

It's the opposite. HTF is a place where we care about transparent audio and video presentation and things like OAR, and bonus features come second (not to say that they aren't important to many here). The Walmart shopper tends to value special-features first, and part of the drive behind BD/HD DVD has been to push these "value added" features as a way to help motivate the non-videophile/audiophile community to get interested.

 

[Robert Crawford]

Let's cease with the Bill Hunt talk! All of the major parties in this format war did what they had to do for whatever reason(s). The internet community also did what they had to do for their own reason(s). However, with that being said, the corporate entities still decided the future of HDM with a lot of help from their retailer partners. IMO, it didn't matter what Bill, HTF, AVS, DVD Talk or any other HT forum said about the forum war because the corporations determined their own fate in this war while using the internet community as a tool to their own benefit.

The war is almost officially over with, if many of us care about the future of HDM then we need to stop with backbiting about past comments and actions by focusing our attention on what may happen tomorrow. Furthermore, I think the real battle ahead isn't Blu-ray versus SD DVD. To me, the real battle is going to be HDM/SD DVD versus Downloads. Those of us that want software media that we can have in our hand and play as often as we desire should be concern about that battle and not the one that has been fought with that outcome determined by multi-billion dollar corporations.






Crawdaddy

 

[Robert Crawford]

Choosing between HDM and SD isn't the fight that lies ahead. It's disc media versus downloads. I won't speak for the rest of the HTF Administrators, but I have no interest in downloading my movies.

 

[Marc Colella]

I think the HTF should be format neutral between HDM and SD. There's no need to try to turn people off of DVD in favor of HDM. DVD still does a great job at providing a theatre experience, even if the audio/video are a notch below HDM. While this is a Home Theater Forum, it's all about the movies afterall. The majority of the posts are in the SD DVD section of the forum, and that's what has kept HTF thriving.

A few friends/co-workers asked me if HDDVD/BD was "worth it", and based on their viewing habits, the amount of money they need to invest, and general interest in films I turned them away from both formats and told them to stick to DVD. It's about what works best for the individual. What is right for me isn't necessarily right for someone else. I find it's best to stay neutral in that regard.

 

[Clinton McClure]

Here, here. Say no to downloads!

 

[DaViD Boulet]

If HTF's mission is to support the most faithful reproduction of film in the home environment, then by definition HDM best satisfies that goal.

Now, by not being "format neutral" between HD and SD doesn't mean that SD is "bad" and that it should be discouraged. However, we should be able to state plainly that HD is *better* and should be *encouraged*. There's a difference. Just like we can all agree that anamorphic DVD is better than non-anamorphic widescreen DVD, we shouldn't have to walk on egg shells or thought of as elitists for suggesting that 1080p better reproduces the film experience than 480p.

Naturally, the compromised quality of downloads should not even be on our radar of support.