*** Official HP 1080p md5880n/md6580n discussion thread *** (1 Viewer)

[John Alvarez]

Any new news? I'm interested in this set. What type of DVD player should you use with it?

 

[John S]

Oh, yeah.. Don't leave us to much in the dark here.



Any word? I'd think you would have a new display by now.

 

[Steve Berger]

They're probably trying to find a dealer with one still in stock that they can buy back for parts or exchange.

John, I figured the back might still be partially removed after the servicer checked it out so a quick look might be easy.

 

[John Alvarez]

I know of a place in Miami that has several of these units so finding one in stock shouldn't be an issue. I just wonder if this is a one in a million chance he got. I'm considering buying this set in Miami then bringing it up to St. Augustine. Now I'm wondering if I test it in Miamia before bringing it up? If it needs service do I deal directly with HP or the store I got it from?

 

[Steve Berger]

The big question will be "will they have repair parts when my set is out of warranty?" Customers are suing Gateway (another PC company who made a foray into "Consumer Electronics") because they would not sell repair parts to legitimate TV repair shops and it turned out that they had NO repair parts at all when they forced customers to send their large Plasma TVs in for service.

I would ask the very pointed questions before purchase, "Who is your authorized servicer and what is his experience on TV repair?" and the unanswerable "Will you have repair parts in 3 years?". TVs break in many more ways than PCs and have no off-the-shelf parts.

Non-traditional companies have a very poor track record on support for traditional consumer electronic products. My son, a PC tech, (zero qualifications on TV) would be called for service on HP TVs before I would (a TV shop owner with 34 years experience).

 

[RAF]

UPDATE

Sorry for the delay in responding but things began to move quickly in the past few days. Late yesterday (Day #37 for those still keeping count) a replacement unit arrived and I'm happy to report that it appears to be working perfectly right out of the box. I quickly connected it to my HD Dish 1080i source material (the best I have right now) and was amazed at how good this picture looked. It easily beat both my Panasonic 37" HD Plasma and my Runco CL-710 when viewing HD content (as it should, since they are 720p units). And that's not any disgrace to the Panasonic and the Runco since they both produce what I consider to be excellent pictures.

HP will be sending a team over to pick up the old set next week to take it to their labs (so they claim.) In the meantime I'll be spending at least the next couple of days integrating the HP MD5880n into my home theater. With two HD displays (including the Runco CL-710 FP) I want to make sure that all sources get to all displays. In order to accomplish this I've recently purchased a DVD0 iScan VP30 HD scaler/switcher. Not only will this give me a hub for all my video sources (I still prefer to pass all audio through my Lexicon MC-8, thus avoiding any HDMI audio issues) but the VP30 will allow me to scale everything externally to 1080p for the HP and 720p for the Runco so that each display is handling its native resolution directly. This seems to be the best way to connect these things.

And within the week I will take delivery on my new laptop (Dell M170) which, with its DVI output and graphics card (NVidia 7800 Ultra) has the ability to provide me with 1080p source material immediately. This will let me check out the HP's ability to handle native (not upscaled) 1080p input directly prior to the release of Blu-ray.

As to which DVD player I would use with the HP MD5880n, if I didn't already have a $2000 scaler (the VP30) then I would look at one of the upscaling units. If we weren't so close to HD DVD release (in both formats) then I might also consider such a unit, if only for its digital output. But since the VP30 is such a capable scaler a new DVD player isn't a top priority with me right now for SD DVD so I haven't researched them thoroughly.

Note also that HP has just reduced the price of the MD sets by $500. My only caveat would be that if you decide to get this set, with its outstanding picture, that you make very sure that the dealer you get it from is equipped to handle exchanges themselves in the event that you get a problem unit. If you get a good set you will be extremely pleased, but if you have to deal with HP's technical support to get a replacement prepare yourself for a very frustrating experience. This can all be avoided by the careful choice of a vendor.

More information later when I've had time to run the set through all its paces with all my new equipment and connections.

Bring on Blu-ray!

 

[John S]

Yeah!!! At least you finally have a working display!!!!


Thanks for filling us still interested in for sure.

 

[Parker Clack]

RAF:

Glad to hear they finally got you taken care of and I look forward to your webside being updated with new pictures of the new set and more.

Stay tuned folks. The Demented Video Dude is in the house.

 

[RAF]

Well, it's going to take a bit of time before I update my website since I want to complete the installation of everything before making the site changes. Not only is the HP MD5880n in the house, but I've also started incorporating the outboard DVDO iScan VP-30 1080p scaler/hub. In summary, at this point as good as the images on the HP are, the outboard scaling of the VP-30 makes them even better. This scaler should satisfy even the most finicky user who likes to get his/her picture "just right" in every aspect (pun intended).

I also have a Velodyne SMS-1 (digital Subwoofer Management system) that I want to add to the HT. It's been sitting around almost a month and the reason I didn't attend to it before this is because it uses an on-screen display to help you equalize the room. Without the HP it would have been a tedious process.

Finally, my new Dell M170 just arrived and this portable has the graphic capability to provide native 1080p content to put the HP through its paces as both a 1080p display and a computer monitor.

But eventually I'll not only update the HT pages but I'll also post a complete review of the HP MD5880n for those who want a more complete analysis.

The "Reader's Digest" version is this: It seems to be a tremendous set with just about the best picture you can get at present. It easily bests my Panasonic 37" Plasma and my Runco CL-710 DLP FP, but that's not really a surprise because they are both 720p units. However, as good as HP's units are, you have to be aware that their technical support, if you have a major problem like I did with a DOA set, is not a pleasant experience. All one has to do is read through this thread to get a rough idea of what I went through. In the final analysis I found it worth fighting for since it's the only real option right now for 1080p input - which is more important than many people think! It's not just all about 1080p sources!

Let me quote something I wrote in answer to this 1080p issue elsewhere (since I think it also belongs on my "home" forum as well)


In conclusion, if you want one of the best sets currently available you should consider the HP MD5880n or MD6580n but only if you can find a dealer who will provide you with a replacement in the event of a faulty unit. If you have to rely on HP technical support to provide timely replacements you are likely in for a rude awakening. 37 days to get me a replacement unit was not an acceptable performance. And based on what I've said here, if you want to get a 1080p set you should really get one with 1080p input. At the moment, that's a very short list of displays but the situation is bound to change over the next few months, assuming that "Vaporware" doesn't rear its ugly head.

 

[RAF]

Some more observations as I assemble all the new components:

I'm glad that my replacement set is working out so beautifully so far despite the horrendous service experience. Each day I find new things about this set that I like. The picture is, of course, stunning and right out of the box it required very little adjustment to get all the settings correct (using the usual DVDs including the surprisingly helpful ISF/Monster DVD which gets to 90-95% of where the AVIA and Joe Kane discs get with a very easy interface. Great for quick tweaks). And the combination of my 5880 with my DVDO VP30 gives me amazing flexibility.

Today I connected my laptop PC directly to the HP MD5880n (a very capable top of the line Dell M170 running WinXP Media Edition 2005 with an NVidia 7800 GTX Ultra card) and viewed some native 1080p WMVHD material -- the 1080p version of Step Into Liquid. Jaw dropping! And yes, the INFO display verified that the HDMI2 input was accepting 1080p. Those who dismiss lack of 1080p native input capability as something trivial "because there just isn't any 1080p source material" just don't get it.

I even did some A/B comparison with the "regular" DVD of this same title - 480i upscaled to 1080p through the VP30. While this upscaled disc looked better than a "normal" disc, it still wasn't as nice as the native 1080p version. While I'm not planning to use the laptop connected to the 5880 on a regular basis it does give me a preview of things to come in a few (?) months with Blu-ray, etc. And with well over 3000 SD DVDs I've already justified the cost of my VP30 since it definitely makes them look better with upscaling. Without the 1080p input capability of the HP MD sets a lot of this would not be possible.

More to come...

 

[John Alvarez]

The internal scaler doesn't look as good? If I didn't get the external scaler what player would you reccomend in the sub 500 range?

 

[RAF]

Well, I wouldn't expect the scaler in a $3500 TV to be as good as an external $2000 scaler. There's no way that a display manufacturer is going to devote well over half the cost of the unit to scaling. There wouldn't be much money left for all the other components of the set. My comment that the internal scaler of the HP is not as good as the external DVD0 iScan VP30 is not a knock on the HP. It scales very well as a standalone unit. At no time did I say that the HP scaler produces a bad picture at all. It produces a great picture. However, for those who wish to raise the bar even more to an exceptional picture the 1080p native input of the HP allows one to add an external scaler if desired.

As to players in the sub $500 range that scale standard DVDs the one with the most buzz appears to be the OPPO Digital OPDV971H which is under $200. Here's a review of this unit and if you Google it you will find tons of information and discussion about it. Quite interesting.

 

[RAF]

The Insanity Continues...

Well, after 45 days they finally came and got my DOA original HP MD5880n, but even that didn't go without incident. Over the past few days I received several calls from some company called "Decision One" (I believe they repair computers) that someone would be picking up my set today (Wednesday) between 8 a.m. and 12 noon to ship it back to Hewlett Packard. Around 9 a.m. I received a call from a Decision One technician who said that he was coming over to coordinate the exchange and to set up the TV that was being delivered. I informed him that no exchange or set up was involved since I had received my replacement a week ago and all that was going to happen was for the old set to leave my premises. The technician seemed surprised but said he'd be over at 10 a.m. to "coordinate the paperwork" since the trucker would be there by then.

At 10 a.m. the technician arrived and, of course, no trucker and no box. After a few phone calls he found out that nobody could find the trucker even though they were supposed to be there at that moment according to the dispatcher. The technician spent about a half hour with me marvelling at the great HD picture on my working 5880. His comment, "I've never seen one of these sets before" didn't exactly instill in me any confidence regarding his ability to provide setup or service had that been required. Luckily, that wasn't necessary. At about 10:30 the technician told me he had another appointment scheduled about 15 miles away at 11 so he would have to leave. A final call to the trucking dispatcher verified that the trucker was missing in action so the technician left for his next appointment. He told me that since I appeared to know what I was doing just to sign any paperwork if and when the truckers appeared.

Fifteen minutes later a truck pulled up with two workers and an empty HP MD5880n box. They had no idea that a technician was supposed to meet them and said that nobody had contacted them all morning. They brought the empty box into my garage (where the technician and I had placed the faulty set) and then attempted to get the set packaged up. This was hilarious. Although the box was the right size the packing inserts were in no way able to accommodate the MD5880n. It was worse than trying to solve Rubik's Cube or a 6 star Sudoku! Finally the truckers said, "Screw This! You're just returning the set to HP, right?" I told them that this was the plan. They then proceeded to place the set in the box and used some of the packaging material to loosely hold it in place as they slid the top of the box over the set and onto the base of the box and the skid. They then loaded the skid onto the truck and mumbled something about wrapping it up tightly back at the warehouse before shipping it back to HP. I signed and dated the receipt and off they went.

Wait. There's more.

About an hour later, as the clock struck 12, the doorbell rang and when I answered a man in a pickup van said he was there to pick up some sort of TV for HP. I said it was already picked up and asked him if he had a box with him. Of course he didn't. When I mentioned that "Decision One" had picked up the set he commented that this was probably a case of some secretary placing the pickup order twice. He then put my entire predicament into perspective when he said, "At HP the left hand doesn't know that the right hand is doing." Truer words were never spoken. This should be on the front page of the manual!

And now the kicker. As I was sitting at the computer writing the second paragraph of this account the phone rang. It was the original technician from CompUSA (the guy who was supposed to come on January 4th.) He was calling to inform me that the light engine had arrived and that he wanted to come over and install it in my TV. As soon as I stopped laughing I told him that if he hurried he might be able to catch the truck with the faulty set. It sure wouldn't be too difficult to repair the set since it was only loosely packed in the carton. However I told him to be careful to avoid some guy in a pickup van (with no box) who was looking for a TV to pick up and who, therefore, might not be paying too close attention to the road!

We both had a good laugh when I filled him in on the day's events. I thanked him for his perseverance in this matter. After all, the repairman was just trying to do his job and wasn't responsible for this massive screwup. He told me that this happens all the time since the people who schedule these things don't coordinate them very well and that very often he has to make several calls and trips before an issue gets resolved. I believe that Mr. Pickup Van had said it more succinctly with his "Left Hand/Right Hand" comment.

So what's the moral of this story? Today's events just prove to me that it is imperative that if you are looking to get one of these HP sets that you must align yourself with a dealer who is equipped to handle any exchanges without any middlemen involved. If you get a good set (probably much better than a 50-50 chance) you will be extremely pleased. But if you run into a lemon, as I did, you need a "Plan B" since the alternative is frightening.

Caveat emptor!

 

[John S]

Well was there any doubt the conclusion would go something like this????






Really amazing set of events over the entire time period.

 

[Adam Gregorich]

Would http://www.hpshopping.com be a good place for people to buy? It sounds like service aside, you are very happy with the quality of the set.

 

[RAF]

Actually, Adam, the replacement set came from hpshopping.com. I would have purchased the set from them if it had been in stock at the time I ordered.

I actually purchased the stand from them and it came quickly with no problems. My only concern would be that since HP dealt with my replacement (and all the crazy things that transpired) I just wonder whether you are going to get any better cooperation from hpshopping.com than from hp directly. Some people have reported good experiences with hpshopping.com (regarding replacements) but some others say that recently there have been delays.

I would think that TVA offers a member discount to HTF members but I'm not sure how their returns have been going. To me the safest method would be if you're lucky enough to have a store in your area where you can actually walk in and try to find out if that store will honor any replacements without having to get HP involved. Some bigger stores with inventory might, but mom & pop stores probably not.

And I'm not sure how Superbowl week plays into all this (traditionally a week where big ticket sets are flying out the doors as people rush to get ready for Sunday.)

 

[John Alvarez]

I wasn't implying that at all....Sorry....:b
I'm glad you finally have this resolved. I will definetly check into the exchange policy wherever I get it from.
Thanks for all of the info.

 

[RAF]

No need to apologize, John. I wasn't aiming my comments directly at you but just trying to clarify things a bit regarding my position on the great picture that these HP 1080p sets offer since I felt that maybe my original words were a little vague on why I added an external scaler.

The HP set does a great job on its own and an external scaler isn't a requirement. My point was that it becomes a viable option with 1080p input capability. The initial reason that I purchased the DVDO iScan VP30 was for its digital hub capabilities since I have so many sources and it would tax even the generous inputs on the HP. The fact that it is a better scaler than the HP is a bonus. Besides, the tremendous flexibility the VP30 offers (I'm still learning some of the capabilities of this unit such as test patterns, offsets, aspect control, etc. etc.) means that it will serve me well even if I eventually move it to another display.

Good luck with your pursuit of an HP 1080p set. Let us know how things turn out.

p.s.

John, as I was researching the latest "under $500" scaling DVD players to answer your question I came across the OPPO unit. I liked what I read so much (especially since I was in the market for a secondary DVD player) that I just purchased one and it should arrive next week. Under $200 with two digital cables (an HDMI/HDMI one and a DVI/HDMI one - about 5-6' long each). Hard price to beat for such features. While the scaling possibilities of the unit are not that important to me since I have the VP30, I like the fact that it has digital output (my other DVD players don't) so that should yield some improvement when the signal goes through the VP30. And the OPPO has one of the highest ratings ever received in a DVD player - especially if you use the Digital output. Check it out to see if it fits your needs. The ideal thing would be to get a DVD player with 480i digital output (or an SDI connector) since that would bypass all the electronics within the player and let the scaler do all the work. OPPO is rumored to be coming out with a stripped down model that doesn't scale as much but does have 480i digital output (the ideal signal from an SD DVD since that's the native format on the disc) and I might be looking at that model when it leaves the vaporware stage. But that's a subject for another section of the forum.

 

[Parker Clack]

I know that TV Authority would work with you with no hitches if you had to return your unit. I would email either Neil, Jason or Kirk at TVA and talk to them about this.

RAF:

So how does the fact that the unit has its inputs in the front panel work out? Does it make it easier to plug everything in? Does it have a track along the side that you pull the cables through to plug into the front of the unit or what? Could you post some pictures on how those cables get plugged in, etc?

 

[RAF]

This is the easiest big set I've ever owned to access all the input jacks. The only wire coming out of the back is the power cord. All other jacks are accessed by a fold down panel in the front. There is access from below the jacks to feed all the cables from the stand (you wouldn't place this set directly on the floor.) I purchased the HP stand (I generally recommend that people purchase the stand designed for the set since you don't have to worry about fit, weight, stability, etc.) It's very sturdy and well made. This stand has holes that mate perfectly with the access panel from below and more gasketed holes in the back so you can route all the wires to your equipment that way. Everything dresses extremely nicely and conveniently. And when you want to plug something in temporarily (like my 1080p source laptop) you just fold down the front access panel. Think of it like those front panels on some TVs that let you attach a camcorder, etc. Then extend it to 2 1080p HDMI inputs, and a slew of component, S-Video, Composite, Cable and Antenna inputs. Excellent!

As to pictures, etc. When I finally set up my review I'll be sure to include pictures. I'm not sure I'll get to it today, Superbowl Sunday.