MAD WORLD - sloppy presentation on DVD (1 Viewer)

[george kaplan]

quote:
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MGM is putting this movie out with perhaps the best presentation it has ever enjoyed on video, along with a documentary and an hour worth of deleted scenes for the fans and collectors, all so you can enjoy it right NOW, while you wait for the "maybe" expensive restoration project which will take at least a year, AND they do it for a rock-bottom price. Give me something instead of nothing anyday, especially when you're going to charge a low low price for it. Thank you, MGM!
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I agree. I'm not going to pass-up a $10-$15 DVD of a great film just because it's not the "Ultimate" release. I don't see any reason why studios should only release a film on DVD once. As long as the video/audio quality is good and it's OAR, I'm going to enjoy it. And if a better edition is going to be released sometime in the future, I'll look forward to that also.

I disagree, vehemently. The best this has ever looked on video is the laser disc box which has the most complete version of the film available. This current cut monstrosity is just that, a monstrosity.
Please, have fun, watch the dvd, laugh. I'll be watching the ld, seeing more of the film and laughing even harder.
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13-time NBA world champion Lakers: 1949, 1950, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1972, 1980, 1982, 1985, 1987, 1988, 2000, 2001

 

[Tino]

George
Have you compared the new anamorphically enhanced DVD version against the laserdisc version before making that claim?
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Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.

 

[Jeff Krispow]

Okay, I'm now officially confused. Some folks are stating that the DVD is missing the opening overture, but a few say it's definitely on there. What IS the real story? Here one quote, from DVDFile's review, which plainly states it's on the disc:
"Discerning fans will want to know if this DVD release properly includes the opening overture, intermission, and exit musical segments, and with one caveat these parts appear to be complete. The caveat is that the intermission is apparently different than what was heard on the Roadshow version of the film, as referenced in the documentary. Apparently in that version the audio storyline proceeded during the intermission, with police bulletins keeping the audience updated about what was presently occurring, though the action could not be seen onscreen for those few minutes."
Unless I'm interpreting this completely wrong, DVDFile says the opening overture is there on the film. Did MGM send out one early copy of IAMMMMW to reviewers, and then make some changes prior to final release? (I do have some discs where this has occurred, but nearly all of them were due to bugs in the navigation that needed to be fixed before release.) DVDFile is generally known for providing correct reviews, but they have made some minor mistakes. Can anyone positively state one way or another what is on the final release disc?
Best,
Jeff
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Jeff Krispow
Former Reviewer
http://www.laserrot.com
[email protected]

 

[John Morgan]

When I started this particular thread I tried to be as fair as possible. I bought this DVD full aware that it was to be the general release version. What prompted the thread and the term sloppiness was on my DVD the OVERTURE is NOT there, unless it's an Easter Egg I can't find.
I hit PLAY MOVIE, and that video, noisy MGM came on and then the opening credits of the film started. I just got my copy a couple of days ago from Ken Crane's, so I don't have a review copy.
Saying that, the image and sound is the best I have seen on video...and I had all of them...including the first stereo release on CED RCA disc!

 

[Jarod M]

Sorry about the misinformation about the overture in my DVDFILE review, I guess I went braindead for a second. For some reason I was equating the long credit sequence with an overture, which of course is not the same thing. I guess it never occurred to me that MGM would include the intermission and exit music but would omit the overture.

 

[Randy_M]

This is not meant to start a flame war, but I think the video on this disk is outstanding (maybe it's just my new digital widescreen)...
I never owned a laserdisc player, so I can't compare it with the ld version, but this films looks great to me...
What do others think?

 

[Robert George]

I have compared the DVD to the letterboxed laserdisc. There really is no comparison. The quality of the DVD transfer is so far above the laserdisc that no valid comparison can be made. This isn't even close.
The content of the film itself is up for debate. Some will gripe that the longer version from the LD was not used and others will find the 35mm theatrical version perfectly fine. Of course I would like to see a proper restoration (the LD was not that, BTW), but most or all of the added footage is included on the DVD as supplemental material and these clips are of much worse quality than the transferred elements used for the feature.

 

[Damin J Toell]

i'm not sure i understand some of the anger expressed towards MGM over their decision to release the shortened version on DVD. the way i see it, they had two options:
1. release the shortened version on DVD
-effect on restoration of roadshow version: will be completed in approx. 2 years.
2. not release the shortened version on DVD
-effect on restoration of roadshow version: will be completed in approx. 2 years.
in either case, the work on the roadshow version is unchanged. MGM cannot instanteously decide to release the roadshow version, and the current release has no negative effect upon the restoration. if anything, it has a positive effect: fans can show MGM their interest in the title.
and am i nuts, or did Ron's posts disappear from this thread?
DJ

 

[Eric Paddon]

You left out the third option. Release the LD version which is longer and the better version of the film. If I have to wait two years for an even better restoration, then at least let me have a DVD version of what I enjoyed on LD.

 

[John Spencer]

and am i nuts, or did Ron's posts disappear from this thread?

I hear Crawdaddy removed him for posting off-topic. They are serious about their rules here. No one is above them!

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Love kills hate.
[Edited last by John Spencer on September 17, 2001 at 11:52 PM]

 

[Dave Barth]

I too find that very puzzling. I also find it mildly concerning, from the point of view of someone who likes to read a full spectrum of opinions. Why has Ron's (statement of) opinion vanished?
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[Gavin K]

If the video quality of the dvd is so much better than the LD, then a remastering must have been done. Why remaster the shorter version when you have a longer version available? It might not be the complete roadshow version, but it was supposedly (I don't have an LD player)created with the assistance of Stanley Kramer himself. It's as close as we have now, so why revert? And before anyone says money, they already have released the longer version, so how much more could it cost to clean up the longer version than the shorter version? And if quality of the additional scenes is the problem, how about branching? And besides, the lack of the overture suggests either a quality control issue, or that the people who worked on the disc did little in the way of research to familiarize themselves with how the film should be presented. I agree with RAH that unless you saw the roadshow version and have a complete losless memory chip in your brain that noone knows exactly how the film is supposed to look, but I think that most reasonable folks would agree that the overture is a pretty important part of the picture.
I don't want to totally badmouth MGM as I love the Killer Klowns SE and am eagerly awaiting Buckaroo Banzai, which sounds fantastic, but I think they really took the easy way out on this one and deserve to be called to the table for it.
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"Wow, what a dramatic airport!"

 

[Robert Crawford]

I hear Crawdaddy removed him for posting off-topic.

Would I really do such a thing?????

Crawdaddy
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[Damin J Toell]

quote: You left out the third option. Release the LD version which is longer and the better version of the film. [/quote]
this would result in a ported non-anamorphic transfer, and MGM has taken more than enough flak over the years for doing just that. they would once again be charged with being lazy and uncaring, simply porting over LD transfers when they could and should do much better. so what did they do? the best possible new transfer with the best possible existing elements. it's a shortened version, but it's anamorphic, and i'm willing to bet that, on the whole, that will please many more DVD consumers than would a non-anamorphic LD port. MGM was in a lose-lose situation, apparently. if they did a LD port, they'd be charged with being lazy and uncaring (e.g., 'this is DVD! give me new transfers! give me anamorphic! no anamorphic no sale!') . but since they did a brand new anamorphic transfer of a shortened version, they're being charged with being lazy and uncaring (e.g., 'MGM is taking advantage of the fans by releasing a butchered version with minimum effort on their part'). personally, i'm astounded that they're being charged with employing 'minimum effort' when they decided to do a new anamorphic transfer instead of porting the LD transfer.
and, of course, the option of porting the LD transfer has the following effect on the progress of the roadshow restoration: none. so MGM are bastards for releasing anything that isn't a new restored anamorphic roadshow transfer, despite the fact that such a release is a sheer impossibility anytime soon. IMHO, i'm more than willing to buy a DVD (with a $19.95 MSRP, no less) if i'm secure in the knowledge that a re-release is literally years away. i wish all films were treated so 'poorly' by all studios: creating the currently best possible DVD release while an arduous and expensive restoration process is underway. we should all be so lucky.
DJ
[Edited last by Damin J Toell on September 18, 2001 at 03:06 AM]

 

[Ronald Epstein]

I was hoping to have removed my comments
without being noticed. You guys nabbed me!
I had a long phone conversation with MGM
yesterday afternoon.
We had the chance to air out our differences.
Actually, most of the problems we were having
were due to miscommunication.
Based on our conversation, I can tell you
that MGM has legitimate reasons why they could
not do the proper restoration on IAMMMW. They
really wanted to, but the cost to do so is
beyond reason. They are hoping, in the future,
to be able to possibly revisit the title.
I agreed to remove the comments about them
from this thread. I contacted every person
by email who's post was aeffected by the edits.
Suffice to say, I will be doing MGM reviews
in the near future.
Thanks for your support, and let's try to give
MGM the benefit of the doubt. I realize my tune
has changed in the past few hours, but the studio
did contact me and did want to straighten things
out.
Regards
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Ronald Epstein (pronounced like the English "Ronald Epstein")
Circa 2000
Home Theater Forum Administrator
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[David Lambert]

Crawdaddy - You mean "Damin", not David. Don't confuse me like that!!!

Ron, I'm glad you've worked out things with MGM. I'm glad you will get screeners again.
Are you able to pass on to us your understanding of the reasons for the delay with restoring the film? Is it still being worked on right now? Your note seems to indicate that restoration work has stopped entirely at the moment due to money.
I read the letter in another thread sent by Mr. Harris and his colleague to the LA newspaper; it was right-on. A restored copy of this film is what's needed. Here's my take on this:
As someone else posted, when this was last in theatres in the more-complete version, I was too young then to recall now exactly what I saw and how to compare to any modern release. All I know is this: My dad and I went to see it in theatres at a time right after my brother was born (1969; I must have been 4? Seems too young, but it was the 3rd time I went to a theater, I recall that much...& it was one of the few times just he and I went to a film by ourselves). We laughed our asses off. When we saw the film on tv years later, we agreed it wasn't as funny and that something had changed. We couldn't pin it down. Then, years later (1986-ish?), we caught it again with my brother in the room one Sunday morning on cable tv (probably TBS). My brother liked what he saw, but my dad and I picked it apart (much to my brother's annoyance). We could recall (at the time, memories have faded, and it was more my dad saying and me going "oh yeah") specific things that we saw that weren't there anymore.
So, all I know is that once upon a time I saw a better cut of this film. I'd like to see it again. Will MGM serve it up at ANY point in the future? Let me know; thanks,
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DAVE/Memphis

Did you want us to respect your cause? You just damned your cause.
Did you want to make us fear? You just steeled our resolve.
Did you want to tear us apart? You just brought us together.
http://www.miami.com/herald/content/...ocs/000565.htm

 

[Tino]

Kudos to you Ron for being fair and honest. I am glad to hear that you have communicated with MGM on this matter and some of your questions answered and your attitude about this matter changed. Hopefully now there will be less bashing of this DVD (by people who haven't even seen it yet) now that good reviews of it are surfacing, such as Obi's.
I will be picking up this great DVD in a few hours Ron, will you?

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Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.
[Edited last by Tino on September 18, 2001 at 05:56 AM]
[Edited last by Tino on September 18, 2001 at 05:58 AM]

 

[Tino]

David
Someone correct me if I am wrong but I believe IAMMMMW was edited down from the Roadshow version to the General Release Version shortly after it's Roadshow run in 1963.
The version you saw in 1969 was probably the version that is being released today.
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Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus.

 

[John Morgan]

Knowing full well this was going to be the general cut of the film, I bought it. It looks and sounds great. The only misstep MGM goofed on was not putting on the OVERTURE.
MGM has released more films with fine transfers for the cheapest prices around...like their Midnight series, which I hope never ends.
My fervent hope is that MGM will find more scenes and can do a proper restoration someday. I also hope the next release will include the OVERTURE.
I think the complaints they will get about the DVD about the length of the film will be from far more people than us nuts. I say this because that longer version has been the common version for years now! Isn't that the version that shows up on TCM all the time?

 

[Seth Paxton]

And it really seems clear, as I have said before, that MGM has taken the DVD = VHS and LD approach.
Meaning that they are trying to get sellable product out the door to appease consumers who simply want to own the film. They don't rip people off with this because they keep the price point down around VHS levels. $15 is extremely reasonable for a film, especially the ones that they put out as anamorphic.
This allows them to build some operating capital for "better" versions of films, SEs and restorations. Since we now see them doing this with several films, and we have rumors of others on their way, then we can believe in this effort.
In that way they are filling the market with MULTIPLE versions, or soon will. Just like VHS and LD options of the same film, except that the cheap DVDs are better than VHS and the nice DVDs are better than LD.
And actually, this happened so much with LD as well. Cheap $30-$40 versions and nice $80-$100 box sets. Heck, just the CLV vs CAV versions.
It's just that so many studios are taking the "one at a time" approach which leaves us wishing for so many other titles to be released, yet the few that do come out are usually nice SE-types. Of course, many of those studios can afford to take that approach. It's doubtful that MGM's capital allows them that option.
It's just hard to see MGM as the whipping boy when they at least respond to criticism, get product out the door, and do give some nice editions of some films. It's not like they didn't try to fix the Bond problems, many of which were slight compared to a rather large effort on so many films. (Plus, think of how MANY films are in the Bond series alone, that's a lot of money and time right there).
I used to be frustrated with them, but they are winning me over.
And Robert is right about one thing...films 2.35 and over I simply would NOT buy non-anamorphic (it's pushing it on 1.85 material). I have a projector system for a reason and I notice the extra resolution it affords, especially on wider films.
Somewhere between "MGM is the devil" and "MGM wins best SE of the year" is where you might find the IMMMMW DVD. I would say that it was firmly in the positive side.