M&K 350 vs SVS PB12

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by John Menoni, Feb 15, 2005.

  1. John Menoni

    John Menoni Stunt Coordinator

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    I already have an M&K system including the 350 sub and the base is pretty impressive in my room. I do have a love for unbelievable bass. I was considering switching to SVS to add more thump at lower frequencies. I was told that some M&K owners use the SVS as a second sub and it suplements the system very well. If anyone can confirm that I would appreciate it. Also, to all those SVS fans out there. Is the performance from the PB12 and the PB 12ultra 2 that much different? The Ultra 2 is more than twice the price. I might be open to spending the extra dough if it's worth it. Ultimately I would love to recreate the feeling I felt when I saw Star Wars AOTC in the Ziegfeld theater in NYC. When the ship was landing in the beginning, I thought my fillings were going to come out. It was awesome! My system has great bass but I would love to equal that kind of power.

    Thank You,

    John Menoni
     
  2. Axu R

    Axu R Agent

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    I can imagine they are very different. That is in a big room and high levels, of course.
     
  3. steve nn

    steve nn Cinematographer

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    What size room are you in John?
     
  4. SteveCallas

    SteveCallas Second Unit

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    I think you are comparing a single plus driver to 2 ultra drivers - the pb12 ultra 2 would definitely perform a lot better. A closer comparison would be the pb12 plus 2 and the pb12 ultra 2.
     
  5. John Menoni

    John Menoni Stunt Coordinator

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    The size room I am using for my HT is 23 1/2 ft long. The seating area is very narrow in the middle part because my furnace room juts out. My ceilings in my basement are only 6 1/2 ft and jut down even lower in certain areas. It is far from a perfect room for a HT, but it is going to have to do until I retire in a beautiful home with a dedicated room. [​IMG] I have narrowed my decision to either a SVS PB12-plus/2 sub or the M&K 350. I already have one M&K 350 and it was suggested in another thread that instead of getting another 350 to look at an SVS subs. After reading the reviews, I can't help but to consider the SVS. The PB12 plus 2 does seem like a monster with two 12 inch drivers and 900 watts. If it plays the real low frequencies at higher decibels than the 350, maybe it will be worth it to go with the SVS. Thanks for all the help.
     
  6. Chris Quinn

    Chris Quinn Screenwriter

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    Another 350 will only get you louder but not any lower.
     
  7. Eric Ha

    Eric Ha Stunt Coordinator

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    A PB12Plus/2 will more than fill that space with bass. My room is 24'x19'x8' and I can get nowhere near the limit of this sub's ability before I start worrying about my house! I would have been fine with a single driver model, but it's nice to have extra headroom just in case.
     
  8. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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    having owned and heard several M&k's, I'd say go with the SVS. The dual 25-31cs+ setup I heard stopped the caca out of the M&K 350 I heard. That said I know several folks with them and are quite satisfied(the m&K) so its a case of you just wanting more. Alot of people don't need/want more.
     
  9. Elinor

    Elinor Supporting Actor

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    >"Alot of people don't need/want more."

    I am one of those happy M&K owners, but I have had the sub for 7+ years. I don't think SVS was even around when I bought mine ... at least they weren't taken very seriously then.

    I can't imagine needing more than my MX-200 can put out, but my standards are flat response, tight performance, musicality. If you just want mo' bass, and don't care about how flat the response it, then what difference does it really make?

    I think those high-end SVS subs might be worth a look some day, but they would have to be something very very special to get me to abandon M&K.
     
  10. Lee-c

    Lee-c Second Unit

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    Elinor: Perhaps you are not aware, but SVS subs do provide extremely flat accurate freq.
    responses, as well as more bass and deeper bass (at powerful SPL levels) than most anything
    available for anywhere near the cost. You can check out the many reviews to verify that. [​IMG]
     
  11. Elinor

    Elinor Supporting Actor

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    Lee, I don't mean the sub itself, I mean his overall system performance. If you want "more bass" you either have a room eq problem, or a serious underperformer, or you want a room response that is unnaturally hot in the low end. That's where I interpret the OP as coming from.

    I'm sure good SVS subs are quite flat.
     
  12. John Menoni

    John Menoni Stunt Coordinator

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    Thank you everyone for the great input.

    Shane, I am one of those people that wants more![​IMG] That is why I am leaning toward the SVS.

    Elinor, like you I am an M&K enthusiast. I heard their system at a HT store and I was hooked. right there I said that no matter how long it takes, I was getting an M&K 150 system. I have had my 350 for 3 years now and I love it. However if the SVS is going to give me more performance for the same or lesser price, I might have to go with them for my second sub. As Chris stated above, the M&K will only make it louder. The SVS will go lower.

    Eric, just curious. What speaker setup do you have besides the SVS sub? SOmeone told me that the SVS compliments the M&K 150 system very well. I would love to confirm this from someone that actually has that kind of set up.

    Again, thanks everyone. [​IMG]
     
  13. Elinor

    Elinor Supporting Actor

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    I see John. My M&K goes down to about 15 Hz, I assumed yours did too. I don't know of any make that surpasses that.
     
  14. Eric Ha

    Eric Ha Stunt Coordinator

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    I am now running Adire 281 mains and center. My SVS is basically flat to 16hz in the 20hz tune. If I wanted to go lower, I would tune it to the 16hz tune, which I think gets you flat to around 12hz! From the HomeTheater magazine review of the M&K MX-350, it didn't appear to go nearly that deep.


    Close-miked response of the MX-350 THX subwoofer, normalized to 40 Hz, shows the -3dB points are at 48 Hz on the bottom and 134 Hz on the top, with the Bass-EQ and crossover switches set to "THX" position. The -6dB point is at 29 Hz. With the Bass-EQ switch set to the "extended" position, the -3dB point drops to 23 Hz at the expense of output capability.—AJ
     
  15. Lee-c

    Lee-c Second Unit

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    The question is: How loud at 15Hz, and with what distortion level to get that volume?

    John: You'll have to decide how low and loud you want your sub to be able to go in your room.
    Then look for one that will deliver that, preferably with a low distortion level (so the bass is cleaner).

    If you want Star Wars (I'm a big fan, too [​IMG] ) to sound as it was intended at a high volume level,
    let's say -5dB (which is *very* loud) in a Dolby Digital calibrated stereo system, then
    a PB2-Plus (two Plus drivers) should be plenty, especially if the sub is located fairly close
    to the listening position. In fact, the PB2-Plus should be able to handle full 00dB Reference Level
    in most rooms. How far from your seat would the sub be sitting?
     
  16. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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    Plenty do nowadays. I would be surprised if yours actually hit 15 at a level you could hear it. Just firing up Titan AE I can tell that the M&K lacks in alot of areas where the SVS doesn't. The #'s bear this out too. There is another sub out there that makes the claims that it is flat to 8hz or so(Bag End IIRC), and it can't really do that audibally iirc. There was a big fuss over it. I believe REL made a similar claim that didn't hold up either.

    As I said I've heard my friend system eq'd to the max with dual MX200's and Dual 25-31cs+ setup I heard CRUSHED IT. It wasn't even close. Watching several different movies at the difference places makes it more obvious.

    As I said, it doesn't mean that the M&K is bad, I like their subs, they just don't go loud and low like the SVS setups I've heard.
     
  17. Elinor

    Elinor Supporting Actor

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    I'm always a bit skeptical of hyperbole ("such and such CRUSHED IT") but since I haven't heard the SVS setup I concede it's possible. Though I'm not sure what "CRUSHED IT" means?

    "As I said I've heard my friend system eq'd to the max with dual MX200's and Dual 25-31cs+ setup" ... sorry, perhaps I'm being obtuse. If both systems are eq'd and the room response is flat, how can either system "crush" the other??? Flat is flat. If one system produced more bass then it was hot or the other was not flat. Am I crazy here?

    I don't know anyone who can actually HEAR 15 Hz ... I thought 20 Hz was the threshold for most of us mere mortals, and too many rock concerts eroded my hearing a bit. Still, my SPL meter reads about -3db at 15 Hz.

    What exactly are we talking about? Having a setup where all frequencies, across the spectrum are equivalent (this is what flat means to me) or having a system where there's so much bass that small children suffer lung collapse? I'm being a bit flip here, but I don't think I'm really understanding what the goal is here.
     
  18. Eric Ha

    Eric Ha Stunt Coordinator

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    You would when you felt it. That's the goal. Sub 20hz exists, and experiencing it is a joy. :)
     
  19. Elinor

    Elinor Supporting Actor

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    I know that Eric. I was responding to Shane's comment, "I would be surprised if yours actually hit 15 at a level you could hear it."
     
  20. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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