"Jonny Quest" And "The Jetsons" -- Two Personal DVD Reviews (1 Viewer)

[David Von Pein]

Another thought along this line .....

You'd think that the more sophisticated DVD-Video format would at the *least* include "automatic" Chapter Stops. Good heavens, even an el-cheapo DVD-R disc that you record on yourself contains an auto chapter break every 5 minutes.

 

[Deb Walsh]

Actually, auto chapter stops are generated on the Panasonic hard drive DVD-R units only when you dub in real-time. If you do high-speed, either you have to put in the chapter stops manually prior to burning the disc from hard drive to disc, or do without the stops. I imagine the non-hard drive units auto-generate chapter stops, since there's no intermediate step.

So it's possible that the high-speed duplication process doesn't automatically render chapter stops - these may have to be manually established in the master. And based on the reviews I've read on TVShowsonDVD.com it sounds like the intelligent use of chapter stops is far from an industry standard.

 

[David Von Pein]

Thanks for the Chapter Stop 101 class, Deb. Interesting stuff.

And you're correct re. "Panasonic" machines. I know the Panny DVD Recorders do this "auto 5-minute chapter break" thing (but only in "real time", as you say). But I just assumed all other recorders do this as well. Perhaps not though.

 

[Jeff_HR]

JQ is piling up more & more negatives. :frowning:

 

[David Von Pein]

Well, unfortunately, here's another one .......

Also in the "Po-Ho" episode: Just as 'Race' comes up out of the water (as the "fake God"), you should be able to hear the sounds of water splashing as Race pops up. But this water sound has, too, been muted. There is, instead, dead silence, when we should be hearing the water splashing around.

My guess on this muting is: Since it takes place at very nearly the same moment as the other two dialog edits, I'm just thinking maybe the technician in charge of "muting" (aka: "mutilating" ) hit the "kill audio" switch too soon, thereby muting only the sound of the splashing.

However, this "splashing" sound CAN be heard, still, on the Spanish Track of
the DVD. Weird.

Well, at least all of these needless and ridiculous "edits" are confined to just the one episode. (Let's hope.)

 

[David Von Pein]

Side Note on the "Ignorant Savages" line being cut out ..... Seems to me a "double standard" is (somewhat) in effect regarding this edit. Because several other times during the "Po-Ho" episode, the Indians are referred to as just simply "Savages"...and yet these remarks are not edited out.

Which means it wasn't the word "Savages" by itself that bothered the super-sensitive moron @ WB Home Video (or whoever it was) who approved these edits -- it must have been the word "Ignorant" along with it that bothered him/her/them/it to the point of an edit.

Seems to me that they'd want to go all the way here, and take out every reference to "Savages" (which I'm glad they didn't, or that episode would really be a chopped-up mess, with mouths speaking no words right & left). At least on the "Ignorant" edit, we can't see Race on screen. He says it while the camera is looking elsewhere.

 

[TonyD]

i just popped mine in to watch the first ep and the first thing i saw was orbity on the title card, and thought huh?
i couldnt finfd the whole card but here is the shot with orbity hanging from the back of the jetsons flying car.

also are these in production order or aired order. like the flintstones set.

if aired does anyone have a production order list like provided in the flintsones thread?

one more thing the sound in the first ep is very scratchy.

 

[Jeff_HR]

Would it be too much to ask that we the people be allowed to do our own editing for content? Put a sticker on the set saying there is some potentially objectionable content at this point in these episodes. This censorship makes me wonder about other releases down the line from WB.

 

[Deb Walsh]

Just curious - who is the intended audience for these releases? Baby Boomers, or kids? I'm thinking maybe the fact that these are kid-friendly purchases affected some of these editing decisions, unfortunate though they may be.

 

[Jeff_HR]

On the assumption that JQ was aimed at kids during its original telecast, then why did Hanna-Barbera allow the so-called offensive language to be telecast in the first place? They must have thought it was OK then. And the TV Network censor must have thought it was OK. But it supposedly is not OK now. Save me from the PC Police!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Jeff_HR]

I'm very, very glad that these episodes look so good.

 

[Carlos Garcia]

You mean we won't be getting uncensored Warner classics like "Bugs Bunny Nips The Nips", "All This And Rabbitt Stew" or "Coal Black and de Sebben Dwarfs"?

 

[David Von Pein]

True. With J.R. Ewing spouting "slut", "bastard", "tramp", etc., in nearly every Dallas episode....the censors *could* have a hey-day there.

If they censor J.R. ... well ... I'll be ........


..... not very happy. :frowning:

 

[Thomas Newton]

I take it that you haven't used your microscope to examine the outside of the box.

If you did that, you would probably discover, in very tiny letters, the phrase "Disc packaging by Dr. Zin".

 

[Jeff Krispow]

Greetings…

I was actually just going to post some of my own thoughts about the set, typed it all up, and just about to post it, when I suddenly found this thread here. I don't know why it didn't turn up in my search before, but, well, we all know this happens occasionally.

Anyway, rather than start a new thread, I'm just going to plop my entire message in here in full. Most of what I wrote has already been stated in this thread, but I am covering some of it in more detail — specifically with regard to the title card and improper end credits issues.

I know some folks here don't think it's really a big deal that the original end title sequences have been removed and replaced for all but two episodes, but it IS a problem. Especially when it exists in a supposedly restored archival collection… These problems only occurred after Turner purchased the HB library in 1994… prior to that, all the end credits were as they should be. So no, it's not a minor thing, it's Turner and/or Warner not knowing what they are doing. And if they can do this without a second thought, what changes might be made on future "Golden Collection" titles…?

Still, I think it's an awesome set, and I'm glad I bought it. But it could — and should — have been transferred INTACT.

Anyway, I'm just repeating myself… here's my full message (which I'm frnakly just too tired to re-edit just now).

Oh… and TonyD… these episodes are presented in their original broadcast order (not production order). Oh, and here's the link to a decent Jonny Quest Episode Guide, complete with production numbers, broadcast order and broadcast dates. Just as an FYI, that guide (and most JQ guides) contain one mistake. Ep. #15, "Turu the Terrible" was originally broadcast on Thursday, December 24, 1964 — not the 25th as listed. At the time, the show had just changed from a Friday broadcast slot to a new Thursday broadcast slot starting with Ep. #15 — TV Guide "thought" the new Thursday slot started with Ep. #16 (it didn't), and thus printed the wrong date. So if you're keep track of the original broadcast dates, make sure you make this change.

Ep. #1-14 — ABC-TV, Fridays, 7:30pm ET
Ep. #15-24 — ABC-TV, Thursdays, 7:30pm ET

=================================

Hi Folks,

Of all the Hanna Barbera cartoon sets released thus far, the one I've been waiting for the most was the JONNY QUEST set (the original 1964-1965 season only, not the horrendous re-envisioned later series or TV Movies). This was one of my favorite cartoons when I was growing up, and is still a major favorite today for me after nearly 40 years.

I picked up the set this past Tuesday, but was unable to delve into any of the episodes until today. I started watching, and a huge smile grew across my face — this was by far the best I've ever seen JONNY QUEST look. The quality is absolutely fantastic, and will certainly not disappoint anyone! This DVD set is an oustanding package, and the episodes look about more perfect than I could have ever hoped for!

However, I was still a bit wary… mainly due to some skeletons in the closet from JONNY QUEST's past. Back around 1994, Hanna Barbera's library was sold to the Cartoon Network as many of you are aware. Unfortunately, this change of ownership created some issues with the series when it began to be rebroadcast by the new owners. Apparently the folks who put the new syndication packages together were not overly familiar with the library or the print materials in storage, and thus quite a few of the episodes had some "problems" when shown over the past decade or so.

The first issue was somewhat minor, but annoying just the same. Several episodes no longer featured their original title cards. For whatever reason, some of these were now missing, or were replaced with newly-made (at the time) recreations. Back when Hanna Barbera still owned and rebroadcast the series, this wasn't an issue — the titles card were all there as expected, even for the VHS and LD releases.

Thankfully, I checked all the episodes, and I'm happy to report that all the original title cards appear to have been properly restored!!! Yup, as far as I can tell, they are all there and intact — none of them are mysteriously missing, and there are none of the "recreated" title cards the Cartoon Network used during the 1990s. Awesome!


And that brings us to the second issue, which was definitely not a minor issue, but a major annoyance. For whatever reason, 9 of the episodes in the Cartoon Network package were missing their original ending credits. Instead of using their original credits, those 9 episodes instead used the end credits from ep. #11, "Skull and Double Crossbones." All the JONNY QUEST fans knew that this problem existed, yet Cartoon Network did nothing to rectify the situation. Ever time the series was rebroadcast on Cartoon Network (or Turner's other stations, i.e. TNT and TBS), the episodes contained the wrong end credits.

But surely, since this DVD set was a part of the highly-touted Hanna-Barbera Golden Collection, featuring fully restored cartoons, this wouldn't be an issue. I mean, obviously it was Warner's intention to restored these cartoon to their best possible shape, and they DID restored all the original title cards!!! What could go wrong…?

So, when I checked the end credits for all the episodes, guess what I discovered?

Do I really need to tell you? I'm sure you've already figured it out, considering the title of my thread here…

That's right. Warner blew it.

Warner blew it BIG TIME.

For the Cartoon Network reruns, 9 episodes featured the wrong end credits. For this DVD set, 24 out of the 26 episodes DO NOT HAVE THEIR CORRECT END CREDITS!!! That's right, folks, Warner's glorious "restoration" of the series made this problem even worse than before! The end result of this haphazard "restoration" — whether done on purpose, or simply an "oversight" — really lowers the overall quality of this "Golden Collection." It also is the equivalent of Warner pissing all over the fabulous artisans who created JONNY QUEST in the first place. And if Warner doesn't care enough to ensure that these end credits are correct, than what else might they be neglecting on other current or future Hanna-Barbera — or Looney Tunes – sets?

So let me say this again so it sinks in…

24 out of the 26 episodes presented on this DVD do not have their original ending creduits! Only two of the episodes retain thir correct original ending credits: "Pursuit of the Po-Ho" (ep. #4) and "Double Danger" (ep. #9). What Warner did was take the end credit sequence from "Pursuit of the Po-Ho" and tacked in onto the end of every single other episode (except for ep. #9, of course). This goes far beyond being a simple "mistake" or "oversight" — since every episode (except one) has the same credit sequence, this was obviously done on purpose for some unknown reason.

For many shows, the end credits are exactly the same from episode-to-episode. But that was NOT the case for JONNY QUEST. While the background animation was the same, the actual written credits were different for every single episode. Since a different set of personnel worked on each episode, the production specifically created a new set of end credits for each episode so that the correct artisans would receive their full and proper credit.

Judging from the way Warner reused the same end credit sequence, it now appears that the episode "Double Danger" was created by one production team, and the other 25 episodes were all created by a completely different production team consisting of the same 20 or so people. Apparently they were all written by the same one person, all the voices were done by the same few people, and all the episodes were drawn by the same three or so people.

But what about all the other people who actually DID work on these episodes? The writers, artists, layout artists, background artists, voice-artist talent and everyone else are being cheated out of their proper credits. This is so wrong on many levels, and is also disrespectful and unfair to all the artisans involved in creating this wonderful series. Further, this might also cause serious problems with some of the actor or artisan unions/guilds — Warner has essentially given the credit for individual episodes to people who didn't actually work on them, and some of these folks likely have specifically contractually obligated credits that must appear on the episode or else…!

But you know what the absolute WORST credit offense is? Thanks to Warner's tampering, creator Doug Wildey is no longer created on the episodes — without Wildey, we wouldn't even have a JONNY QUEST. On every episode, Wildey had one of two credits: either a "Supervising Art Director: Doug Wildey" credit, or a "Based Upon An Idea Created By Doug Wildey" credit, accompanied by his usual, cool standard "signature logo." Originally, Wildey's credit appeared on every episode but one — "Pursuit of the Po-Ho" (ep. #4) — where it was left off by a mistake. But since Warner used the end credit sequence from "Pursuit of the Po-Ho" (complete with missing Wildey credit) to replace all the other end credit sequences, it's as if Wildey had never worked on the show. Thankfully, however, as I mentioned earlier, a single other episode escaped Warner's end-credit-replacement-wrath — "Double Danger" (ep. #9) — so at least Wildey and a few other lucky staff members get the recognition they properly deserve. But even so, 95% of the production crew are getting royally screwed out of their original credits…

As a whole, the DVD package and episode quality/content is fantastic, and was as perfect as one could ever hope. And it WOULD have been the perfect set if Warner didn't taint it with their end credit mangling. The whole marketing philosophy behind Warner's "Golden Collection" series sets as "fully restored, archival quality" collection is suspect — if Warner feels that removing and replacing all the original credits is not a problem, then what other compromises will they make without hesitation on future sets?

One thing's for sure, had the folks at Hanna-Barbera still owned this series, this problem would NEVER have happened. (Remember, it only occurred after the series was bought out by Cartoon Network). The least they could have done was to have a couple of the HB folks consult on the project, to ensure that the episodes were properly restored. One of the best people would have been Lance Falk… he's interviewed in one of the supplementary featurettes and for good reason. Aside from Wildey, Lance probably knows far more about JONNY QUEST than any other human alive — and by this point, I believe he knows more than Wildey. Lance and I go waaaaay back — we know each other from our much younger geekier days, and he was even there when I first met my wife (we just celebrated our 10th Anniversary yesterday). Anyway, trust me when I say that he KNOWS JONNY QUEST — it's his all-time favorite show. It's because of his love for this show that he pursued the animation business, went to work for Hanna Barbera, became in charge of the entire JONNY QUEST archive, and eventually went on to both write and produce numerous cartoons over the years, including the 1990 JQ series (not the 1986 "2nd Season" disaster or the two TV movies… bleech!). He KNOWS Jonny Quest better than anyone else, and he'd never have let this happen if he was involved. I need to pop Lance an email and see if he knows what happened with this…

Had Warner sought Lance's help, they could have also created one of the best JQ supplementary galleries ever… and likely one of the best for any animated show. Since Lance is in contact with nearly everyone still around who was involved in the show, and through his other contacts, he could have helped Warner create a still-frame gallery containing thousands of model sheets, storyboards, drawings, artwork, cels, photos, toys, you name it. Oh well.

Back from my days in the industry, I still know a lot of people at the various home video companies, and I help out whenever possible to inform them of problematic DVD titles and attempt to get such issues resolved with corrected, repressed titles. (Most recently, I got the message over to Columbia TriStar about the severely-distorted geometry present with their EATING RAOUL transfer — which they are now fully aware and are working on correcting.) But as far as Warner Bros. go, pretty much everyone I knew has moved onto other jobs or studios, so there's no real technicians or home video execs I can discuss this matter with. Hopefully Warner might read this message and realize the huge mistake that exists with these end credits, or maybe someone else here can get the word across.

For those of you who have already purchased the set — or for those of you considering it — I'm sorry to have been the bearer of bad news. When we purchase a DVD set, we expect it to contain the film or series in its originally, intact version, especially when the set is considered to be a "archival collection". After all, isn't that what we pay our hard-earned money for. Hopefully something can be done about this — Warner needs to ensure that the proper end credit sequences are reinstated for every episode, and repress and exchange these sets. After all, if they refuse to acknowledge and/or correct such an obvious mistake, how can we be assured that future "Golden Collection" sets will not suffer a similar fate with compromised material or restorations?

'Nuff said.

 

[Jeff_HR]

And the beat goes on. :frowning:

 

[TonyD]

 

[David Von Pein]

Tony.......

Just to clarify (since this thread serves a dual
"Jonny Quest / Jetsons" purpose) ----

The Jonny Quest DVD set has the episodes in Broadcast (Air Date) Order.

The Jetsons DVD set has the eps. in Production Order. *

* = That is, if TV-Tome's Guide is accurate, which I'm not entirely sure about (because that site's "Prod. Numbers" also do not match perfectly with the DVD order of appearance either. Which means, if Tome is accurately reporting the "Production Number" data, that the DVDs are in NEITHER Air Date order OR Film Date order. It could be they're just thrown on the discs in random fashion (other than the first few shows on Disc 1).

To be honest, I couldn't care less about "Prod. vs. Air Order". As long as the eps. are there, either is OK. (Although, IMO, presenting a TV series in Air Date chronology makes by far the most sense.)

http://www.tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet...3/The_Jetsons/

 

[Jay Pennington]

Regarding chapter stops, I agree they should, like, BE there.

It's such a no-brainer for broadcasted material. A chapter stop at every commercial break. How hard is that?

 

[Scott Hamilton]

Sorry WB no sale here...

It is becoming all to comman for TV DVD sets to be edited. I am at the point now I wait aleast 2 weeks before I purchase a set (if at all) check the net and sure enough I have been finding problems which equals No Sale...