I don't see why anybody is suppourting Dual-y Disc! (1 Viewer)

[Rachael B]

It doesn't sound like anybody is going to get 48% fewer cavaties brushing with Sony Dual-y Disc even if they brush 16x per day.

 

[Brian L]

I thought redbook was 44.1, and 48K was DVD?

But I agree completely with your point, zero added value for me.

Of course, the videos may be of value to some, but they would have to be anamorphic WS, with either DD 5.1 or DTS for me to have any interest.

BGL

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Brian,

Engineers consider sampling rates above 48k like 88.2k or 96k to be hirez.

 

[John Kotches]

Lee,

Complain to your connections at Sony for not properly supporting DualDisc with high resolution audio tracks.

So far, WB and Universal have released DualDisc with 24/96K tracks. More of the Universal discs should be coming with 24/96K in 2005, if the conversation I overheard at CES coms to fruition.

Cheers,

 

[Kevin C Brown]

Brian- I have the best "Dual Disc" version of Velvet Revolver's CD available: a Best Buy special version of the original CD that included an extra CD of covers they did. Now, ... if they had included that extra content on the official Dual Disc version, maybe it'd be worth it. But of course, they didn't.

 

[Rachael B]

John, If I was to complain to Sony or any of the others, for that matter, it'd be for daring to even make Dual-y Disc. Sony should be particularly ashamed, IMO!

 

[John Kotches]

Rachael,

It's still a business, and the majors aren't making substantive profits on SA-CD or DVD-Audio releases.

If the numbers I've heard for DualDisc are accurate, then it might be the only potentially high-resolution option that survives with the majors.

IMO, the only major that's truly supporting hi-res discs at this time is Universal Music.

Cheers,

 

[Rachael B]

John, you're right it is a business and the now 4 majors have made a mess of it for over 5 years now. It's the digital age and they mandate analog outputs, can't aggree on format/s, litigate against children and dead people:frowning: , and believe (apparently) that the DMCA (and other paid-for legeslation)gives them carte blanche to charge nebulous prices and that people should pay it and make them filthy rich. Now this!

They've made their bed, now they have to sleep in it. This industry is self-destructing because they think consumers serve them, not vice-versa. That's the nutshell as I see it.

 

[Kevin C Brown]

I don't know, but here's what I think the conclusion is that I've come to:

DVD-A and SACD never had a chance.

CD is king. The obvious trend is that the downloadable MP3 market is strong and growing. That proves to me at least, most people don't care about the difference in sound quality between MP3 and CD. So that means that most people don't care about the benefits of high res SACD and DVD-A over CD. "Most" people, not all. So that is point numero uno.

OK, so DVD-A and SACD offer multichannel sound. DPL, DPL II, DD, DTS, DD EX, DTS-ES, etc, all have shown that there definitely *is* a market for multichannel sound. For movies though. It is now obvious to me at least, that if the multichannel capability of SACD and DVD-A itself offered enough of a benefit, they would have taken off more than they have. If the record companies were making much money off of them, they'd be releasing more discs. Period. IMO, DVD-A is a stupid format anyway because it requires you to turn on you TV to listen to music. So what does that mean in a car? Out at the beach? I always thought that hybrid SACDs were the best approach, but yet still the market is so small that record companies have not been that forthcoming with offerings. So... most people don't care about the multichannel aspects of DVD-A or SACD either. "Most" but not all. That is point deux.

So where does that leaves us? Exactly where we are at. SACD and DVD-A have become niche formats, not even in the same order of magnitude of lp. (But of course, how many lps have now been released over the past 50 years or so, vs the number of SACDs and DVD-As in the past few years?)

DualDisc? I personally say that its chance is worse than that of DVD-A and SACD specifically because of all of the problems surrounding its introduction.

That's what I've come to think anyway. You simply can't sell something to people if they don't want it. You can say that awareness is lacking. OK, but how far along was DVD-V after 4 years? Or even CD? A heck of a lot further along than either DVD-A or SACD, that's fer sure.

 

[PaulDA]

I agree with your entire assessment, except for this point. All my DVD-As (10-11) start playing right after I insert them in the player. If I want to select the stereo group (when there is one), I have to turn on my TV, as the player is set to default to MCH, but otherwise, I don't need the TV to listen to my DVD-As. Any DVD-A that doesn't start playing by itself (or simply by pressing play if your player doesn't automatically start up by closing the tray) is incorrectly authored and that is a specific fault, not a general shortcoming of the format.

As for your overall impressions about where hi-res is going and public desire for it, I think you're spot on. My only hope is the independents will continue to produce hi-res for those of us who do want it. And I ain't talkin' 'bout no Dual-y Disc, neither.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

I was at Circuit City last night, and I saw more DualDiscs than I ever saw DVD-A and SACD combined, at that location.

I'd prefer the Double-Disc approach of R.E.M. and The Flaming Lips, but if DualDisc ends up being the only profitable way to get high res and surround to the masses, I'll take it.

I'm not wild about Sony's lossy-only approach, though.

 

[Rachael B]

Michael, Dual-y Disc certainly isn't the only way the 4 silly majors could make a profit on an increased, above CD-quality music disc. Remember the thread I started, what was it, "DVD-A and SACD cannot Succeed"...? Well, add Dual-y Disc to that list. It has all their problems and brings some new and far worse problems to the table. Paramount of which is that it is plainly unethical to market the product, IMO.

The notion that the majors c-a-n-n-o-t do better than Dual-y Disc sure ain't no vulcan logic!

 

[Ken_WI]

Just say NO to Dual-y Disc-o

For one thing, they sincerely HOPE the format breaks all our current hardware, so they can sell us special, crippled Dual-y Disc-o players.

For another, what about copy protection? Will I be able to exercise my Fair Use rights? Can I rip the pseudo-CD layer to uncompressed FLAC files to use in my home music system? Can I rip music video tracks off the video layer and create my own mix-DVDs? Will they even play in my computer drive? I'm betting the Big 4 have locked down the content much tighter than is capable with redbook CD or standard DVD.

If you want to see CDs disappear from the shelves, then rush out and buy these Dual-y Disc-o's. The teams of lawyers at the Big 4 will love you forever.

Maybe we should have "return parties" - buy a couple Dual-y Disc-o's, then return to the store teary-eyed and tell the manager that "this disc BROKE my $800 DVD player. Then I tired it in my car player and it's jammed in there and won't come out. Now WHO is going to PAY for this? Where is the large sign warning customers that these discs will break their players? Can you say 'lawsuit'?"

 

[Will_B]

Actually Newbury Comics is only named that because the folks who started the company originally sold comic books, FWIW.

I used to buy my music at a Coconuts store. And a Strawberries.

 

[Rachael B]

Ken, you are definitely looking at possible future timelines! Say Hay!

 

[John Kotches]

ken_wi asks:


No problems in a Dell Inspiron or IBM Thinkpad (either side) as well as a "cheapo clone" with Liteon CD burner and DVD-ROM drive. I haven't tested my wife's laptop, as I have enough machines to work with.

I've tested the discs in Panasonic, Denon, Pioneer, Meridian and Marantz players all of which have worked successfully with both sides of the media.

By the way, the first manufacturer (Lexicon) has rescinded their earlier warning, but not much has been made about this. Lexicon's RT-10 is a YARP (Yet Another Reworked Pioneer). I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see more warnings rescinded in the next few months. I also won't be surprised that this will go largely unnoticed.

Cheers,

 

[AricB]

beware cause not all Dual Discs have high res surround. Bowies Reality only has DD 5.1, and the Velvet Revolver only has "enhanced stereo", some of the others appear to like Incubus and Usher.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

I don't have but one connection but I already have. It's not just Sony offering up low rez DualDiscs.

 

[Kris Deering]

The only other company offering low rez by your definition is Universal and they will be changing their tune soon from what I've been told. Leave it to Sony to once again make it hard for the rest of the industry by releasing an inferior product. What I am even more surprised about is how they are also limiting their subsidiaries like BMG. The Usher DD will only have a Dolby Digital 5.1 track even though BMG had already released this on DVD-A with a high resolution 5.1 mix. BMG has quite a few DVD-A titles on the market right now in fact including stuff from Usher, Alicia Keys, R Kelly, Britney Spears and more.

 

[Larry Geller]

According to the back cover, it IS hi-rez stereo & 5.1, along with the DD track. The 5 Browns' DD (on RCA Red Seal) also says it's 88/24.