Homeland Season 2

Discussion in 'TV Shows' started by mattCR, Aug 17, 2012.

  1. Patrick_S

    Patrick_S Producer
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    I'm amazed that people are surprised the end game is to terminate Brody. Of course that is the only ending that makes sense. He simply cannot be allowed to live.
     
  2. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Executive Producer

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    I agree. I'm not so convinced that the actual end game will end of Brody dead, but it's only common sense that the CIA would terminate him as soon as his value had ended. Quinn is apparently an American James Bond, trained to kill for God and country.
    I definitely agree with the consensus here that Brody's playing his own game, and it's probably occurred to him that he's only alive as long as he's useful. Honestly, his best bet for survival would be to walk into the nearest television station and confess everything for the entire world to see. If nothing else, it would ensure him a public trial.
     
  3. Mikah Cerucco

    Mikah Cerucco Cinematographer

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    I can only assume this is entertainment rules and that it isn't really that popular that we expect our government agencies to snuff out people who aren't imminent threats without trials and hide it from the American public.
    Hopefully we don't forget that the police department, military, CIA, NSA, legal system, congress, and white house are all there to serve the people. Bad Things happen when we treat them as rulers and the people as peons who can't handle the truth.
    I'm not in favor of killing Brody. Use him if you can. If not, try him and sentence him. The killing allows maintaining the public's faith in its armed forces and a "hero", but it also allows the Issa bombing to stay secret -- and I'd say more the later than the former. I don't see any reason we as viewers should be behind this.
     
  4. mattCR

    mattCR Executive Producer
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    I think there would be a lot of back and forth. I think that the situation became one wherein they feel compelled to kill Brody because of the real fear that if he achieves real political power (Vice Presidency) then there is no going back. Worse, they are now "in too far" explaining that they knew he was a terrorist who tried to bomb the vice president would cause a huge series of public testimony, recrimination and political infighting that would dwarf any trial of Brody... and since Brody in the end didn't pull the trigger, he would be able to easily say "I was a horrifically wounded war vet who was confused and brainwashed; in the end, my love of country meant I couldn't do it.." and all they would have is suspicion and accusations.
    That to me is what is great of this series.. everyone is painted into neat corners and yet, there are always exit strategies for all of them.
     
  5. Lou Sytsma

    Lou Sytsma Producer

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    Do we really think the show is going to terminate Brody? It came damn close in this episode and from a story telling perspective it makes sense but Brody and Carrie are the big draw of the show. Can't see it going forward without either of them.
     
  6. MarkMel

    MarkMel Screenwriter

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    He'll probably end up publicly saving the Pres. Become a big hero and they won't be able to kill him, for a while anyway. He could always have a car accident or heart attack later on.
     
  7. mattCR

    mattCR Executive Producer
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    It's really rare that a show gets to a point where the tension is so high you almost feel like you need to jump to your feet and go "WTF!" This episode had two of those moments; that moment in the Hotel, and then again, when he was making the trade for the code to kill Walden.. holy cow.

    The speech Nazir gives Carrie "we can wait you out, 100 years, 200 years, 300 years.. we're OK, we'll keep coming.." is one of the most terrifying damn speeches I've heard in any series, hell in most movies.. and the way it's delivered is just so brutal because he delivers it flat, not fanatical, just as a point of fact.

    Most grueling episode of the season for me, but this season has been one of a lot of winning eps, as far as I'm concerned.

    Damn.
     
  8. Michael_K_Sr

    Michael_K_Sr Screenwriter

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    I've tried to hold off saying it, but I'm afraid the show has pretty much jumped the shark at this point. Reprogramming a pacemaker remotely to kill the VP? I thought I was back watching 24. One of the problems I've had with this season is that Carrie's illness has pretty much been swept under the rug. Last season we were always left wondering if she was going to melt down at any moment. This season she's pretty much turned into a CIA superwoman. I suppose the last two episodes might be able to bring some sort of redemption to the season, but I am not terribly optimistic.
     
  9. Joe_H

    Joe_H Screenwriter

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    I have to admit, while watching this episode, I half wanted to see Carrie captured for long enough that any medication she might be on to wear off.
    The plot in this one might have been a little out there, but I can't say that I cared one iota, it was completely gripping the whole time.
    Though, to nitpick just a little bit, having first let Quinn survive and now Galvez is up and running... That's the type of thing that can become dangerous later if it feels like there are no consequences to things as dramatic as the scene in the tailor's shop.
     
  10. mattCR

    mattCR Executive Producer
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    Just so it can be said from someone who knows.. Pacemakers are, in fact, externally programmable and can be read out. Working in the medical community the normal method really is to get close to the person, and then you get a read out which tells you stuff like battery level and allows you to make changes in case they go into surgery or are having problems.

    Now, how they'd broadcast that from far away, you're right, that's a lark.. unless it turns out that he has someone inside the CIA who was there or could be part of the plan. We don't know.

    I'm not sure how you feel Carrie's illness has went away; we've had several episodes where she's been weirdly unhinged (banging Brody recently, just running out into the highway). I kind of liked the non-24 hours moment of the terrorist being smart enough to check up on her and foil any idea at an escape, instead tying her up a second time to make sure she couldn't easily move.
     
  11. Adam Lenhardt

    Adam Lenhardt Executive Producer

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    Yes. This season isn't anywhere near as frighteningly plausible as the first season was at its best, but it easily reaches those suspenseful heights.
    I really appreciated that speech. Most movies have terrorists that seem to exist to twirl their mustaches. They're evil so the good guys can stop them. They're full of obvious character defects. Nazir is calm, emotive, intelligent, patient. He believes what he believes absolutely, and he doesn't have to chew scenery to prove it to anybody. In other words, he was allowed to be a real human being. When we forget that terrorists are real human beings, we forget what makes them so powerful and so dangerous.
    Might that not be explained by weeks of electroshock therapy and a carefully controlled drug regimen prescribed by a licensed physician in a clinical setting? I'm seeing this raised a lot as an issue, and I don't understand it because from where I'm sitting there's every reason in the world for her mental illness not to be at the forefront this season. That being said, as Matt just pointed out, she's done a lot of things that a non-bipolar person wouldn't do. Most recently, running back into the warehouse where Nazir was holding her.
    I agree. Galvez was a minor character to begin with. The only possible reason I can see for them to have resurrected him is if he turns out to be Nazir's mole with the CIA. The episode certainly foreshadowed that point.
    Nazir's computer guy appeared to be typing from within a closet somewhere. Perhaps he was in the Naval Observatory somewhere?
     
  12. ScottH

    ScottH Producer

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    Have to agree this episode was pretty ridiculous. I couldn't stop laughing at the FBI's most wanted terrorist making Brody swear that he'd give him the code. I half expected someone like Will Ferrell to show up and offer a pinky swear.
     
  13. Mikah Cerucco

    Mikah Cerucco Cinematographer

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    http://www.webpronews.com/pacemaker-hack-can-be-used-to-kill-people-with-electric-shock-2012-10
    The scene with Abu Nazir accepting Brody's promise wasn't perfect. I don't know if I blame the acting, writing, or directing. It was passable at best. You have to absolutely believe Brody promising on Issa's soul is something both Brody and Nazir would find inviolate. You also have to believe Nazir has no other options if Brody doesn't come through for him. And finally, you have to believe that Nazir actually does have feelings for Brody, believes Brody is truly Muslim, and wants Brody on his cause's side. I think those things are true, but I don't think they were perfectly encapsulated in that scene.
     
  14. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    It is me, or is this show turning into "24"?
     
  15. Michael_K_Sr

    Michael_K_Sr Screenwriter

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    Kinda feels that way.
     
  16. Hanson

    Hanson Producer

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  17. Steve Tannehill

    Steve Tannehill Ambassador

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    This video is currently unavailable...
     
  18. Hanson

    Hanson Producer

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    It's working now.
     
  19. mattCR

    mattCR Executive Producer
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    The scene in the car tonight was fantastic. I admit, I kept waiting for a bullet to wiz in and kill his wife, and I'm glad that didn't happen that way. But I really liked everything they said back and forth to each other; her feeling horrible that she just couldn't relate to him and didn't know how to handle her feelings, him feeling the same.. I thought that was a great bit of writing. I think for the kids, seeing him break down in the hotel was the first time that it really clicked with them that this wasn't a joke and that he was going through something horrific, all over again.

    I get the feeling you're going to have a lot of the daughter feeling as though she's responsible for the split, but damn.

    I have NO idea where this goes from here. None at all. Best way to enter a finale.

    On a side issue: who the hell got in charge of Showtime's programming? Because they promo'd at least four shows that I thought: yeah, I'll watch that. I know I'm in for Shameless, which I think is one of the better scripted comedies on TV, but "Masters of Sex" (a period piece about the work of Masters & Johnson), and "Ray Donovan" both seem to have home run casts with a great setup, and they both look damn good. Whoever is running the acquisitions department at Showtime is doing a damn good job.
     
  20. Joe_H

    Joe_H Screenwriter

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    I didn't mind last week's episode so much, but I personally thought last night was the worst of the series with the exception of a few key scenes (the car thing, Brody crying over Nazir's death, etc.)
    The actual killing of Nazir felt pretty anti-climactic too, but I wonder if that was intentional as to mirror Carrie's feeling now that they got this giant presence that she'd been tracking for something like a decade.
    I have no idea where next week's episode is heading either, but in my case, that concerns me slightly. There don't seem to be enough threads still left for them to fill a 50 minute episode. While I've enjoyed this season more than many, I do hope something huge happens that will force a shakeup in the third season.
     

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