Finally bought FIREFLY! (1 Viewer)

[Mary_P]

The lower class people speak Chinese in this universe. It is sort of the low class language.

I would argue that point. River and Simon came from a very affluent family, and both used Chinese interspersed into their conversation. In the episode "Safe," their father uses it. (There are some outtakes of the actor who plays their father trying in vain to get the line out... can't remember if that's the version that's on the DVD, or the extended one that's online.)
In any event, pretty much everyone in the 'verse uses *some* Chinese, whether it's as swear words or endearments. I think it's just meant to represent an overall melding of the dominant cultures following the abandonment of "Earth-That-Was."
And, yes, I love Joss' use of language. It was one of the first things that hooked me into the series. I mean, c'mon -- where else are you gonna hear a line like "I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you"?
Dong ma?
Mary

 

[Paul_Scott]

And, yes, I love Joss' use of language. It was one of the first things that hooked me into the series. I mean, c'mon -- where else are you gonna hear a line like "I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you"?

Joss has always had an obvious affection for language and word play. Thats one of the reasons I fell in love with Buffy. I think one of the ways I heard someone describe the writing on that show was "this isn't the way teenagers really talk, it's the way i wished I'd talked when I was a teen."
For me, the writing is what makes Serenity (and firefly) such a pleasure to watch and re watch
"Been going on a year now and I ain't had nothing 'twixt my nethers weren't run on batteries".
Pulled out the set last night to try to get the name of the episode that has most stuck out in my mind since watching the show last year, and it's Objects In Space on the last disc. Re watched it again last night and ...WOW.
I was actually on the fence last year after I'd finished the set and was considering selling it off . I had just planned to get up to speed with the material to be able to appreciate Serenity and then try to recoup some of my investment. Very glad I kept it now.

 

[Tim Glover]

"Been going on a year now and I ain't had nothing 'twixt my nethers weren't run on batteries".

That was a great one Paul.

 

[Mary_P]

Quote:

I'll be checking out anything he does in the future.*
Mary
*P.S. I'll also be following Aaron Sorkin to any upcoming projects. I suppose that makes me a "Sorkinite nutter."

 

[Paul_Scott]

I'll be checking out anything he does in the future.*

I'm very interested to see what he does with Wonder Woman.
I get the sense that a lot of people who only know about Whedon thru suffering his more rabid fans on internet forums like this, expect WW to be in the shape of Buffy- with a lot of slang, contemporary hipster speak, and pop culture references, etc. But I'm not expecting that at all...and Firefly is the reason.
The dialogue in both properties share a lyrical, melodic nature at times(Joss plays and composes music as well which I have no doubt spills over into the syntax of his dialouge scenes)-but he gave Firefly its own very seperate and distinct color.
At least for the Amazon culture I'm expecting a consistent and unique vernacular to be used. I'll be interested to see where he builds that from.

 

[Nick Martin]

"Been going on a year now and I ain't had nothing 'twixt my nethers weren't run on batteries"

Oh, GOD! I can't know that!

 

[MatthewLouwrens]

I could stand to hear a little more.

 

[Tim Glover]

Just finished "The Message" on the last disc of the set. Wow. A really good one. Just 2 more & it's over. :frowning:...someone tell me again why/how this show got canceled?

 

[Ronald Epstein]

I actually started watching Firefly late yesterday
afternoon and soon found myself finished with the first 5 episodes.
You guys were right! This show is unbelievably good.
I hope to complete the series later today or by Friday. I just
placed an order for Sereneity on DVD.
More thoughts later.

 

[Paul_Scott]

.

that was just another typo, right?
glad to hear you're enjoying it.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

(cough!) HD-DVD

 

[Mary_P]

...nothing 'twixt my nethers...

Oh, GOD, I can't know that!

I could stand to hear a little more...

I love that whole exchange. Kaylee's line was funny, but the two that followed it were even funnier, IMHO.

It seems odd to me, but it's this very use of language that really seems to turn a lot of people off. If you read some of the negative comments in various forums, a lot of what they *don't* like about Firefly/Serenity is the unusual language. Of course, a lot of them are from people who write things like "The dialog are stoopid" who don't, apparently, mean it as irony.

And if we really start throwing "quotable 'Firefly'" back and forth, we'll be here all day....

Glad to hear the folks who are just trying it for the first time are enjoying it. Prepare for a little gear-shift when you hit the movie; because it's a stand-alone film that needed to be accessible to newcomers as well as fans, it essentially needed to compress a season and a half's worth of story-telling into "119 too-short minutes." I was amazed at how quickly Whedon introduced the main characters and set up the basic back story -- without making it boring repetition for those of us who did know the premise and characters going in.

As to why it got cancelled? The usual reason: low ratings. A lot of things I'm sure factored into that. The show's premise was a tough sell going in. Joss Whedon's name would have attracted Buffy and Angel fans but perhaps no one else. The scheduling was a joke; even those few of us who were looking for it had a hard time keeping track of when it was on. I would suggest to Fox execs that the next time they run a series with a fairly complex universe and nine central characters, they just might consider airing the pilot that sets everything up and introduces everybody -- first, not post-cancellation. I know not everyone liked the two-hour pilot, but I do, and I think it's crucial to understanding Mal's character in particular.

Also, although the "Western" part of its "sci-fi/Western" setting undoubtedly kept some production costs in check, there was still a signficant amount of CGI that would've made it more expensive to produce than some other shows Fox was airing in 2002. That was a consideration a decade earlier, when Fox renewed "The X-Files" but dumped "Brisco County." They were both getting modest ratings, but "Brisco" cost a lot more to produce, in part because of special effects, but mostly because it filmed on the Warner lot in Burbank.

BTW, if anyone's interested in further reading, the Serenity Visual Companion came out last fall and includes the entire shooting script as well as a lengthy interview with Joss Whedon, production art, etc. Really a beautifully done book. The same company is releasing two volumes of the Firefly Visual Companion later this summer. I also recommend the Serenity novelization, which does a nice job of not only translating the script into book form, but incorporates many scenes from the series where they help flesh out more of the back story that's relevant to the movie. The author even used some of the deleted scenes from the series, such as the aftermath of the Battle of Serenity Valley.

And a heads-up for those who have Cinemax: the movie starts its run there this Saturday night. Not like watching it on HD-DVD, I'm sure, nor like seeing it on the big screen, but it'll do in a pinch!

Mary

P.S. Tim -- the fans have a term for what you're heading towards, which I can't for the life of me remember! Essentially it's "Oh, no -- there's only one episode left! If I watch it, it will be over, there will be no more new!" 'Course, now you have the movie, which will, for now, be the "last episode," but still...

 

[Nick Martin]

I must admit, when I saw "Serenity" for the first time, watching that title as the camera pulled back to reveal the ship itself, with David Newman's cello melody providing a kind of 'welcome home' feel...I got pretty teary-eyed.

 

[Tim Glover]

Thanks Mary_P. Great analysis and thanks for taking the time. ...I figured it got low ratings as that's usually the only & bottom line. But this show is not really sci-fi...it's a strange drama that happens to be set in the future. Maybe it just struggled finding the right home (channel)? Regardless, it's obviously found a pretty good home with dvd. Last time I checked, the Firefly dvd ranked #11 on Amazon.com sales, and Serenity, The Movie was #13 or something.
Not bad.

 

[TheLongshot]

As to why it got cancelled? The usual reason: low ratings. A lot of things I'm sure factored into that. The show's premise was a tough sell going in. Joss Whedon's name would have attracted Buffy and Angel fans but perhaps no one else. The scheduling was a joke; even those few of us who were looking for it had a hard time keeping track of when it was on. I would suggest to Fox execs that the next time they run a series with a fairly complex universe and nine central characters, they just might consider airing the pilot that sets everything up and introduces everybody -- first, not post-cancellation. I know not everyone liked the two-hour pilot, but I do, and I think it's crucial to understanding Mal's character in particular.

Except that, the pilot wasn't particularly strong. That, I think, is one thing that fans of the show agree on. Granted, "The Train Job" wasn't much better.
I don't think the scheduling was bad either. It was consistant with most network shows. I know Jeff Kleist went on endlessly about how baseball screwed things up, but I think the playoffs only preempted one night.
What was bad about it was that it was scheduled on a friday, which is the day where shows go to die on network TV, apparently. I think X-Files was the only show that I've seen that was able to be successful on a friday.
I also think Fox's marketing of the show was rather poor. It seems like they had already decided the show was a dud and didn't really push things too hard.
Really, tho, I don't think the general public was quite ready for a Sci-Fi Western. It also doesn't help when Sci-Fi shows tend to cost a bundle, which means if you don't hit the ground running, you probably will not last long.
Jason

 

[Kevin Grey]

What was bad about it was that it was scheduled on a friday, which is the day where shows go to die on network TV, apparently. I think X-Files was the only show that I've seen that was able to be successful on a friday.

It's worth noting that Sci-Fi channel has had a lot of success with their friday night lineup. Small compared to network standards but between that and the early seasons of the X-Files, Friday night isn't necessarilly that bad if you are aiming for the "geek" audience.

 

[seanOhara]

It's worth noting that Sci-Fi channel has had a lot of success with their friday night lineup. Small compared to network standards

"Small" is generous. On a good Friday, SciFi's ratings are slightly better than Firefly's when it was canceled.

 

[TheLongshot]

It's worth noting that Sci-Fi channel has had a lot of success with their friday night lineup. Small compared to network standards but between that and the early seasons of the X-Files, Friday night isn't necessarilly that bad if you are aiming for the "geek" audience.

Note, I did say "network TV". While Sci-Fi seems to do alright there, the networks seem to have a hell of a time with it, and almost nothing there succeeds. I keep thinking of all the shows that preceded X-Files (Brisco, VR5, Strange Luck) and John Doe, all of which are genre shows and all failed.
Jason

 

[Nick Martin]

Sliders had a difficult time, and Fox seemed to stick with it for as long as they could. I enjoyed the series that replaced it the following fall of 1997 - The Visitor. Yet another short-lived sci-fi drama series. Damn I wish that was on DVD.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Two by two. Hands of blue
I am 3/4 of the way through this series, just finishing Ariel,
which I think is the best episode I have seen to date.
Also very much enjoyed Our Mrs. Reynolds and Out Of Gas.
Very much enjoying the series.
Are the non-aired episodes worth watching?