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Does speaker wire honestly make a difference? (1 Viewer)

Sonnie Parker

Second Unit
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Dec 11, 2001
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409
Check out Lowes 6awg E51583 wire... there's been quite a lot of rave about it over the years. Bound for Sound has some good user comments about it. I was amazed at what some folks are comparing it to... some very high dollar wire. It really doesn't look as big as it sounds, although it is. I initially thought overkill but tried it anyway. I honestly can't say it makes a huge difference but I sho ain't lacking in wire size. Btw... if you read the user comments... it ain't .27 foot anymore.
 

DarrenAlan

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Jul 23, 2002
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There is one consideration many overlook: Oxidation. Those beautiful-looking 12 ga. wires @ Home Depot might be bright and shiny when you get them home, but after a year or two, maybe three, they start to look green and feel sort of "greasy." Which is definitely NOT good for sound as oxidized copper, unlike oxidized silver, is a much worse conductor than unoxidized copper and will affect the sound. I know from a very early pair of Monster cables that were gorgeous to begin with but that I eventually was forced to toss, albeit reluctantly.

So the type of coating on the wire can make a difference, as will the terminations.
 

Arthur S

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Interesting point Darren

I just wonder: if you give yourself say an extra foot, you can cut off an inch at the end every 2-3 years.
 

Dick Boneske

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Dec 31, 2004
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London Lawson asked "Why do people get so worked up over such an insignificant thing as speaker wire?" Arthur S gave one very good answer in that people who manufacture and sell specialty speaker wires get a fat pocket book.

It always amazes me that when this subject subject comes up, the suggestion of a comparison to prove or disprove cable differences is ignored by so many. There are many ways to test cables for yourself--a DPDT switch to alternate lengths of two different wires while listening to a single speaker---placing two speakers adjacent to each other with two different wires providing a mono signal and alternating speakers with the amplifier balance control--and many other methods.

If it wasn't for the ridiculous amount of money some of these wires cost, these discussions would be wasted. However, many of us are annoyed by people being duped into spending hundreds of dollars on speaker wires when it would be so simple to FIND OUT FOR THEMSELVES IF ZIP CORD IS INFERIOR TO $$$$Wires.
 

Jongyoon Lee

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Hey Dick,

Have you done a cable test on your own? Care to post the equipments used, and the result of the test?
 

Dick Boneske

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Dec 31, 2004
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Yes, I compared 16 gage white lamp cord to 12 gage monster speaker wire---25 foot lengths of each. I used a mono source to one speaker with a DPDT slide switch. One end of each wire set was tied to one of my Infinity Quantum 2's. The other end was connected to a terminal strip wired to the DPDT switch. The center terminals of the DPDT switch were connected to one channel of a Hafler DH500 amplifier. The amplifier was fed a mono signal from a Dynaco PAS-3 preamp with the balance control turned to the left channel so only one speaker had any output. I used a Sony CD player to feed the signal to the preamp.

With this setup, at fairly high volume, I switched the DPDT slide switch to alternate the two cables. No difference could be heard by the three of us that participated in the test. One of the people had some "oxygen free copper" coaxial wires we used in the test setup. We also tried 14 gage Romex house wire. Similar results--no difference could be heard.

Based on that simple test, if I tried some exotic they sounded different from any of the above, I would conclude the exotic cables were distorting the signal.

Does this make any sense?
 

Jongyoon Lee

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You mean you had a setup of a Sony CD player of unknown model, some vintage preamp and power amp connected to $5 DPDT switch, and then compared $10 lamp cord with $20 monster cable connected to a vintage speaker? I can't tell if you are being serious or cynical..
 

John_RO

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I always use 14 gauge Home Depot wire. They have never become "greasy" or turned green. Best bang for the buck.
 

Dick Boneske

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Mr. Lee,

You completely missed the point!! I had suggested that comparing the performance of different wires can be done very inexpensively and easily. All the hype over very expensive wires can be tested in your system. Or, do you just take the salesperson's word and pay your money, go home and hook up the wires and marvel at how great they sound when you don't have a basis for comparison.

Would it have mattered if I had used a state-of-the-art amp and preamp and a megabucks SACD player with a $100 switch? If speaker wires are of any significance, wouldn't differences have shown up with the equipment used in the test?

I wanted to listen to some B&W 800's or 801's a few years ago at a local audio store and the salesman refused to demonstrate them until he replaced the last salesperson's wires with his favorite. In my opinion, he took the LEAST significant thing in the entire system to be demonstrated and made the speaker wires the focus of the demo. If I had bought the speakers and his "favorite" wires, you can bet his commission on the wires would have been greater than that on the speakers.
 

Adam

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Nov 3, 1998
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139
This is a hard one for me to pass up.

First off let me say I love wire. Especially Fat heavy gauge wire, with really nice shiney terminations.
htf_images_smilies_yum.gif
I guess that is why I became an electrical engineer. I think with speaker wire you need a good quality oxygen free wire. You don't have to pay alot for this, there are many monster cable knock offs. But as long as the gauge of the wire is suited to the length of the run it shouldn't make a difference. There are wires that can change the sound of your sytem by introducing capacitive and inductive characteristics. This doesn't mean that some speakers wouldn't benefit from changes in these characteristics. It is an effective way of taming overly bright speakers by matching the right high end cables to the speakers. But you could also do this with an equilizer.

I do think that biwiring can make a difference also, if your speakers are capable of being biwired. This seperates the runs of wire for high and low frequencies. Ooh more wire, did I say I love wire. ;)

Adam.
 

Chu Gai

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As an electrical engineer I'm sure you could calculate how much inductance one would need to effect a change of the magnitude that would render an audible difference.

BTW, how do the frequencies know which wire to take?
 

SethH

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Dec 17, 2003
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I think his point is that all the frequencies are traveling over both sets of wires, so if the crossover is separating them, there's no difference in how it travels to the crossover.
 

Jongyoon Lee

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Understood. Frequencies don't "travel" or "hear" or "know" what to do. It boils down to the type of the load applied to the amplifier, the signal generated from the amplifier given the load, and how the signal is translated to audible sound.
 

Dick Boneske

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Dec 31, 2004
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Theories about how some wires are superior or inferior don't answer the question. There have been countless articles written and discussions like this one. What matters is what you hear!!

Again, I remind you, we all have the ability to compare speaker wires in our audio or home theater systems by setting up an A/B test with a simple DPDT switch.

Why are we so willing to part with our money for something as simple as speaker wires? Comparing different wires directly is so easy compared to other components---so why not do it and save a lot of money to spend on other components that actually sound different from each other--especially speakers. Speakers are always the least accurate link in a sound system.
 

Jongyoon Lee

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Because it's mind boggling when you actually hear the first time the exact same system in the same room with different speaker wires sounding different. That's why I've asked you if you have done any test on your own.
 

Dick Boneske

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Mr. Lee,

Thanks for the response. The test I performed was done with vintage equipment and done informally. However, it made me believe that the blind listening tests were valid that showed no statisical differences when listeners were asked to compare various wires.

I, too, have changed a single component--amplifier, CD player, phonograph cartridge, etc., and thought I heard a huge difference. Some days, my system sounds much different without any changes than the day before. Don't you think it's possible that you heard a big differnce in speaker wires because you expected to hear that difference? Or, don't you think it's possible that some of the exotic wires DO color the signal to make them sound different from conventional wires? While some may prefer this colored sound, it detracts from the accuracy of your sound system just as vacuum tube amplifiers do(and I love that sound)--but that's another subject.

Do you remember the green marking pens and cryogenic freezers for conditioning CD's to make them sound better? Now we have little plastic bridges for speaker wires to keep them off the floor to make the system sound more "open" and $100+ audio grade 120 volt wall outlets. It puzzles me why people don't question these devices when it is so simple to do so.
 

Jongyoon Lee

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Dec 3, 2002
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I believe they are questioned constantly. Those that do not provide the "enhancement" that they claim would soon go out of the business. There are suckers in each part of the world, but I don't think there are enough of them to sustain certain business model that involves false advertising and improper marketing for years and years.
 

Chu Gai

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Jun 29, 2001
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What 2 speaker wires and lengths did you find led to this sonic difference? And as far as a business model that involves false (erroneous?) advertising and improper marketing, apart from the audio area there are plenty of examples that keep on going. For example, faith healing, homeopathic stuff, astrology, psychic abilities, nutritional miracle cures like for shortness, memory, etc., chiropractors, miracle diet aids, magnets, and the list goes on.
The high-end in particular is populated by incompetence and this is promulgated by a host of review sites like 6moons, enjoythemusic, postitve whatever and self-appointed experts who wouldn't be able to stand anything remotely resembling a peer review. The design incompetence can be so abysmal that we may thank our lucky stars they don't design hospital devices.
 

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