Does SACD really have a future? (1 Viewer)

[EricRWem]

I agree with Rachael 100 percent. And Brian? I'm going to have nightmares tonight thanks to that post.

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

The difference is that one player is superceded by another, where CDs are generally only three generations deep, if that (original issue, reissue, reissue). I agree that the pricing isn't out of line, and hasn't seen the increases most sectors have in pricing over time.

From an independent music producer's perspective, any of the hi-rez formats are secondary considerations, with the principle target still being CD. This stems mostly from the substantial cost to produce either m/c or hi-rez masters, especially in DSD. I'd actually place vinyl higher on the chain than hi-rez at this time.

If I were considering upgrading to a true hi-def, m/c, SACD production format, I'd be looking at a minimum investment of $70,000, and that is probably conservative. At this time, it makes no sense to spend this kind of money for the return it will generate.

 

[Paul.S]

I'm sure looking forward to a new DSD m.c. recording of the Mozart "Requiem" by Donald Runnicles and the Atlanta Symphony & Chorus which Telarc has announced for SACD release in Aug. 2005.

Wonder why Sony has not (I don't think?) released an SACD Discman? So as to have something portable via which to play all those doggone early stereo single layer SACDs . . .

-p

 

[Lee Scoggins]

I remember the first DVD players being around $1K also. As the format gains ground the hardware prices will drop like a rock.
Paul,

The ASO just signed a recording deal with DG to do a series of Golijov titles. He's a hot Argentinian composer. Telarc has a bunch of stuff with the ASO in the works as well.

 

[Kris Deering]

The price of the new HD-DVD players are really a non-issue. The technology is new and therefore will come out in a recovery mode for R&D. The same thing happened with DVD. The first progressive players were close to a grand and stayed there for quite a while. The first regular DVD players were north of $500 for quite a while too.

Since this is a pre-recorded HD based system, it is not initially geared to the mass public. The hardware and software manufacturers realize that DVD looks good enough for most people out there. They are expecting the first few years to be geared at tweaks, videophiles and early adopters, just like every new technology. Give it a few years and the market will shift and you'll see plenty of low cost options.

 

[Tom Brennan]

I would imagine that skip protection would be a factor. How much memory would be required to offer 30 seconds of skip protection with SA-CD?

 

[Danny Tse]

The internet is our friend, so all of them should be available online. Unless they're out of print.

 

[Paul.S]

The Sony D-F20 Discman I bought a coupla years ago is surprisingly impact immune. Especially with the kind of memory solution you mention engineered into a design, I don't think this is a significant enough issue for Sony to not have marketed an SACD Discman yet.

-p

 

[Danny Tse]

It comes down to whether there's a demand for portable SACD capability. For the average consumer, portable CD players (PCDP) are already passe when compared to something like the iPod. What's important to J6P is how many tracks can be compressed onto a CD. Sound quality is always an afterthought. Remember, we are dealing with people who keep putting their headphones on backwards.

That doesn't mean there isn't a good sounding PCDP out there....check out Sam Tellig's article in the current issue of "Stereophile"....for the review of the "Class D" $50.00 Sony D-EJ100 PCDP. Wait til Sam get a load of the $60.00 Sony D-NE300 PCDP with the parametric EQ; it's been causing quite a buzz on the internet sites such as head-fi.org since April 2004.

 

[Paul.S]

I guess my point is that it would IMO be a more impressive example of market leadership/format stewardship if Sony was out there proactively 'creating demand' by introducing a portable SACD player.

-p

 

[Danny Tse]

Maybe if Sony will produce a portable DVD player....with SACD playback capability. I am sure Sony is aware of certain portable DVD players from Toshiba and Panasonic sporting DVD-A playback capabilities.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Thanks Danny for the supporting numbers on title additions. Very impressive for a dead format.

 

[EricRWem]

 

[Danny Tse]

No problem at all, Lee & Eric.

I will be adding 4 new SACD titles in the sa-cd.net database. Two of them are direct-to-DSD multi-channel recordings; one of them from First Impression Music and the other from (looks to be) Hong Kong Sony.

That should bump the total up more.

BTW, here's the "unconfirmed" title list at sa-cd.net. Some of these have already been added to the total.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Check this out:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hi...es/195914.html

 

[Rachael B]

Lee, that's all fine and well, but after 5 years the average consumer stille doesn't have too many SA-CD's to pick from if they even know what an SA-CD is. B & M retailers stock few of the titles, many none. The majority of titles cost too much and are nearly always pitted against considerably cheaper Redbook editions in intentionally predatory marketing positions.

Consumers don't see Sony offering more and more titles, or leading the consumer market in any particular direction, other than back to Redbook. Consumer anxiety is high and confidence low. Does not this very thread demonstrate such, si?

 

[Lee Scoggins]

True but more importantly for a niche product the average audiophile probably has a dozen SACDs or more.

Rachael I think your comments are valuable in the context of mainstream acceptance but no one is arguing that here.

 

[Rachael B]

Lee, if Sony doesn't provide players or drives SA-CD won't even be a so-called niche product. How long? Enquiring minds want to know. Sony keeps it's customers and potential customers in the dark. Even audiophiles are hessitant or unwilling to jump in, in many cases. Sony & Philips are playing the market like they're marionettes. Limiting supply of software and keeping prices high. The whole market is hanging by their strings.

IMO, there is no argument for hi-rez audio formats unless they're for the whole market. That's what people expect, not a so-called niche market. Niche-market, IMO, is a buzz word for quantity restricted, artifically high-priced, price-gouging format in my book.

People are tired of format roulette and price-gouging...and uncertainty. We're taking about 12 cm plastic discs here and no format, no matter how good, is worth 20+ dollars or Euro's. I was on Amazon U.K. last night and some of the SA-CD's were over 20 Pounds Sterling! No wonder SA-CD is floundering there too!

My quess, since Sony is so mum with us consumers, is that they have a casual disintrest in SA-CD. Their actions say so, anyways...

 

[Martin Rendall]

I'm one of those people who appreciates SACD and DVD-A, not for their improved resolution, but for the generally much better production/mastering/whatever effort which goes into making them shine. For the most part, that work could equally go into regular CD, to produce an equally stellar product.

The exception is that I really enjoy a nice multichannel recording - but regular old DVD music seems to sound pretty good to my wooden ears. Anybody actually think that the SACD or DVD-A format would produce a better sounding recording than the DTS version of "And All That Could Have Been" by NIN? Perhaps, marginally, but I wouldn't hear the difference.

So where does that leave me? Wondering why there's so little music on SACD or DVD-A which I even remotely like. Why my collection now grows at a rate of about 4 discs per year. Why do I think that both formats are dead, to me at least?

While I really enjoy DSOTM on SACD, I also really enjoy Underworld's live DVD. Do you think I'll ever be able to enjoy Underworld on SACD? God, I hope so. But I'm not holding my breath.

Yes, I am obviously confused. I would prefer to be able to find and enjoy music I actually listen to on SACD or DVD-A. I would be happy because I would know that it is more transparent rendering, and that the extra effort to make a good recording shine has been made. I'd also be happy to have such quality shine on regular CD, but we all know that's not going to happen. At least with hi-rez, there's the hope. Rapidly diminishing hope.

Martin.

 

[Lee Scoggins]

Martin,

I think you would be happy if you liked jazz or classical music. Right now there is more music to buy than I can afford in both those genres.

I suspect that some new format in the future may bring hirez to mainstream America, but for now I'm very happy with getting some great remasters and current stuff in SACD.