Darren Aronofsky's sci-fi epic "The Fountain" set to go

Discussion in 'Movies' started by Vickie_M, Jul 25, 2002.

  1. JohnRice

    JohnRice Lead Actor

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    Chris, just in case there was any confusion, I also prefer if Future Tom is just in the book, for the same reasons. Plus, the late scenes where Tom says "bye" to Izzi, plants the seed (a symbolic gesture) and then tells her "everything is OK" all seem to support this.
     
  2. Chris Atkins

    Chris Atkins Producer

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    I prefer it too, but I do think the film leaves it very ambigious. And, even if future Tom is real, at least he had peace at the final moment.
     
  3. Chuck Mayer

    Chuck Mayer Lead Actor

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    I think the film leaves it ambiguous...but I wouldn't say very ambiguous. Again, the film language makes it clear the past is Izzy's book and the present is Future Tom's memories.

    I would even argue that it taking Future Tom hundreds of years to accept it *is* thematic. Humans STILL don't accept it, so it is no stretch to see someone who has an obsessive personality take it to such an extreme. I disagree with John; I don't see a huge difference between it taking 1 year and it taking 500 years...Tom hasn't progressed in that time, so it doesn't matter either way. It's not a narrative story, but a symbolic one.
     
  4. JediFonger

    JediFonger Producer

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  5. TonyD

    TonyD Who do we think I am?
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    saw it a couple weeks ago.
    thought it was an amzing visual feature.

    at first i was thinking the bubble was the future tom but thnking about it i can't connect it to the present tom because of the tree.

    i dont know what tree it was.
    was it the tree of life, that was used to heal the monkey or was it aa tree he planted above izzi's grave.

    i thought it was the tree of life, looked just like it after it was rejuvinated at the end.

    but the little hairs responding to touch seems to imply it is izzi.
     
  6. Rich Malloy

    Rich Malloy Producer

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    It's the "tree of life", at least as Izzi describes it in her part of the story. It also becomes a metaphor for Izzi herself in Tom's portion of the story. And, in both instances, it's a metaphor for the element derived from the tree that "real Tom" is testing for a cancer treatment (and, by the way, wasn't there some similar derivative that was being tested for breast cancer in the last decade... Tamoxifen maybe?).

    And I think this brings us back to (John's?) insight that this is a fairly simple, even mushy tale that's made glorious in the telling. All that imagery, rife with meaning, unified in a meta-narrative written by the two lovers. It's "the story of us" but somehow both poetic and emotionally true (and I hate even to allude to Reiner's tacky bit of maudlin sentimentality in the context of this film, so forgive me...).
     
  7. Jefferson Morris

    Jefferson Morris Supporting Actor

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  8. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    Depending on how far away it was from earth, if Xibalba went supernova in present Tom's time, then it went supernova a long time ago (its light finally reaching Tom in 2006).
     
  9. Chuck Mayer

    Chuck Mayer Lead Actor

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    I'd say more than a crack...especially since it's the interpretation the writer/director himself believes, according to interviews. The last scene could all be in his head as Future Tom [​IMG] Who knows? There is absolutely evidence to support both of these interpretations and more...I don't think it leans in any particular direction. I think it's a mistake to try and minimize the other interpretations as well. The entire film, past, present, and future are heavily symbolic. Trying to find the "what's real" is a narrative exercise.
    YMMV,
    Chuck
     
  10. Steve Kuester

    Steve Kuester Second Unit

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    As for the tree in the buble, I really didn't think there was any question about it. It's the tree he planted over Izzy's grave. Izzy mentioned to Tom that the Mayans did this so the deceased would become part of the tree and live forever (or something to that effect). Future Tom then takes the tree (Izzy) to Xibalba so that "Together they can live forever".

    Whether or not this was Tom's ending to Izzy's book or an actual event 500 years from now, I leave up to those who can write more coherently than I.
     
  11. JohnRice

    JohnRice Lead Actor

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    That's exactly what I think of it all.
    I also tend to agree with what Steve added. Tom plants the seed on Izzi's grave and the tree which grows, as mentioned earlier in the movie by Izzi herself, plus the scene of Tomas becoming "immortal" all builds on this whole "earth to earth, ashes to ashes" concept of immortality.
     
  12. TonyD

    TonyD Who do we think I am?
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    how was eating the bark of that tree keeping him, alive for 5 hundred years?
     
  13. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    I think the idea being that the tree was the tree of immortality (from South America or wherever that was found from his research) which combined with Izzie provided future Tom with the substenance he needed for his ride into the cosmos.
     
  14. Steve Kuester

    Steve Kuester Second Unit

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    Right. The seed he planted over Izzy's grave was from the Tree of Life found in South America.
     
  15. JediFonger

    JediFonger Producer

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    does this mean the tree going to silbulba (lol star wars episode i) has grown from izzy's grave?
     
  16. Michael:M

    Michael:M Supporting Actor

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    Great discussion. My two and a half cents:

    1. I think Aranofsky meant for "future" Tom to actually be "present Tom" - in that it's the only storyline that's unfolding to us as it happens. Everything else is remembered or invented. I think there are a lot of visual cues which support this take, among other things.

    2. My preferred interpretation (and what I go with) is that "future Tom" is Tommy's written or imagined end to Izzy's story. I like this because, frankly, it's a bit more hopeful. I also think it's strongly supported by the very last shots, where Tom says goodbye to Izzy and plants a tree on her grave.

    3. On subsequent viewings, it's very apparent that the spaceship tree is the tree from Guatemala, not the tree from Izzy's grave. On my first viewing, I thought the tree was Izzy, somehow, not just symbolically, but I don't think that anymore.

    4. As Chuck and others point out, specific interpretations don't matter all that much, as the main point of the film remains unchanged.

    Wonderful, moving film. One of my favorites of all time.
     
  17. Jason Harbaugh

    Jason Harbaugh Cinematographer

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    I thought the tree was definitely Izzy's because of the constant showing of the fine hairs on the tree reacting to Tom and cutting back to similar shots of Tom touching Izzy's hairs on her neck and body. Let alone there was a fade transition from one of the branches to Izzy's legs. Had it been a single event, I would say coincidence, but they did it over and over and over again so there is no doubt in my mind. The tree in the bubble is Izzy.

    Was really let down by this film. Just didn't care for it. Very good performances though, just glad I rented it instead going with a blind buy.
     
  18. TonyD

    TonyD Who do we think I am?
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    how did the magic tree get combined with izzi
     
  19. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    Could have have a small sample of the tree planted above Izzie's grave.
     
  20. Jefferson Morris

    Jefferson Morris Supporting Actor

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