Buffy the Vampire Slayer - The Series Challenge (1 Viewer)

[Jay_B!]

with the Firefly talk... check the DVD out. Fox aired the episodes out of order and any Joss fan knows how serialized his shows are, you could not air Buffy or Angel episodes out of order, and the same thing applies to Firefly. Watching the episodes in order, it's a fantastic show. I like it better than Angel though not as much as Buffy.

 

[Nick Martin]

Yeah, yeah, I know - not much of an ANGEL fan...

 

[Jay_B!]

Angel was good for his time, but I LOVED "Spuffy". Not just the season 6 stuff (I won't go into detail since I know how defensive people are with Buffy spoilers even if it's been five years) but I thought James and Sarah had phenomenal chemistry together either as lovers or mortal enemies. I think Spike and Willow both almost singlehandedly kept the show afloat despite such additions as Dawn and Riley.

 

[Nick Martin]

Even after all these years, I still can't stand Buffy herself, but genuinely liked all the other main characters.

 

[Jay_B!]

yes, I am with you. I loved her in the Sunnydale High/Angel seasons but once it was time for college, I ended up liking her less and less, it was characters like Spike, Willow and Anya that kept me excited about the show in the latter seasons and kept me loving it.

One of my friends even once said (will be in spoiler-space since I know how defensive people get when it comes to Buffy spoilers from five years ago)
after Buffy died at the end of season 5, the show would've been good enough on it's own merit with Anya, Willow, Spike, Xander and Tara carrying it without Buffy.

 

[TravisR]

What's funny is that the purpose (for lack of a better word) of this thread hasn't really started yet and there's already two pages. There's a lotta love for Buffy.

 

[Jay_B!]

that's right, so much for "I dismiss Buffy as crap because it's crap" from another thread

 

[Nick Martin]

I completely agree with that spoiler.

What I didn't like about her was that she seemed so selfish, and there was so much emphasis on making the audience care about her...I didn't. She had her moments, where I did care, and I did like her, but very few.

That whole thing were she basically exclaimed that she's better than everyone else in, at least I think the episode was "Conversations With Dead People", where she spoke to that Wolfram & Hart tool Knox, I mean, er, old friend and fellow soldier of Mal and Zoe's, I mean er, uh, that vampire (Jonathan Woodward), yeah that's it!

Ugh.

Angel, however - unlike some here - was someone I deeply cared about, and rooted for. He wasn't handled in the same way - writers making the audience care - I just did. I understood him. In many ways (the socially awkward ways, not the evil mass murderer ways...not totally anyway) I could relate to him.

 

[Kevin Grey]

I agree, at least for the later years of Buffy (starting around S4). Just found her relatively unlikable compared to the other characters. I've been feeling the same away about Meredith Grey on Grey's Anatomy.

Great thread! I won't actually be joining in the viewing since I just marathoned both series last summer but I'll be very interested (and plan to participate) in the discussion.

 

[Ocean Phoenix]

It wasn't until I was watching re-runs that I realized what a bitch Buffy became over the course of the show and started to hate her and wish her friends would get more screentime than she did. I think the first time it hit me was in the episode "Fool For Love", with Buffy's last words to Spike. No matter what he did to her, he didn't deserve that. I felt so sorry for him thinking about how he'd already spent 100 or so years feeling bad over someone saying those words to him, and Buffy cruelly repeated them to exploit those feelings he had. It's cool to see that people noticed the same things about Buffy that I did.

I hated the way Buffy treated a lot of people (mostly Riley, but Spike in that episode, and her friends in other episodes) and now, thanks to the observations in this thread, I realize that the changes in her character are another reason I don't much care for seasons 5 to 7. I'd rather just watch the first four and pretend that 5 to 7 never happened, with the exception of a few awesome episodes like "The Replacement" and "The Body".

 

[Nick Martin]

I must admit, I'm not used to people agreeing with me on this subject.

 

[Scott-S]

LOL, Count me in as someone who thought Buffy was the the second worst charactor on the show. (Dawn was the worst)

She got worse each season while the other scoobies got better.

 

[Ocean Phoenix]

 

[ethanTo]

I am in, to start this week. Will people who have watched the later seasons (I gave up on the 'college years') be careful about what they say in the thread, or hide allusions to later developments in spoiler boxes? Ex. "Oh I really liked Cordelia's character in this episode, it is a shame she dies in season 5!!!!" (Not that that happened, just an example)

The discussion will be on this board?

On a sidenote, I have not seen much of seasons 4-7 or any of Angel really, but I really did not care for the Spike character, which was another one of the big turn-offs after Angel split and took Cordelia (who I really enjoyed) with him, and Spike become a bigger character. I thought he was extremely annoying and did not understand why he was so popular, but I'm hoping he will grow on me when I get there this time around. I liked the Buffy character a lot, but again, I've not seen the later ones. As far as Dawn, I was not watching when she was introduced, and only heard about it, but it sounded like such a 'jump the shark' staple : THE NEW KID ON THE BLOCK. So I already have an innate bias against her from the get-go, but I will try to keep an open mind. Hehe

 

[Jeff#]

I thought Buffy was terrific, and not just because she was hot (although I did like her better in the miniskirts she frequently wore in the first 2 years) but more importantly because she had done it all and seen in all....in the space of just 7 years!! All of the major characters had gone through their share of changes, and grew as the writing and concepts improved over the years. But none had changed as much as Buffy and Spike! Buffy was one of the few humans (well, superhumans -- she was a slayer) to die and come back -- TWICE!

As Buffy's responsibilities increased, she had to get tougher in order to survive. First she had to go up against a goddess (Glory) whose strength was greater than her own. And she had to take care and protect Dawn, particularly after Joyce's untimely death.

When Buffy died saving Dawn (and the world...again) at the end of the 5th season, and her friends brought her back when the show moved to UPN in the 2 hour sixth-season premiere, Buffy was slightly different (that's why Spike could punch her without the chip in his head inducing pain). I don't believe that's why they had a secret affair, although Spike enjoyed beating Buffy up even more than she beat him.

Yet a resurrected Buffy was just as adept as she had been before her interdimensional death. She prevailed in the end of the series and overcame the last in a long series of obstacles because she had the determination of a leader. And history has proven that the best leaders have to stay focused. They can be bitchy at times too, and Buffy was not without her own personal flaws and doubts.

Even Faith didn't feel comfortable taking over for Buffy when her friends rejected her near the end of the 7th season before the big battle. That all changed in the next episode or two, since even your followers can come around when they realize you're under a lot of pressure to make difficult decisions. Buffy was not the only chosen one / Slayer, but she set a few examples for all of the others who were (or could be).

 

[Scott-S]

All along I thought the Dawn Charactor would have been fine if she would have "done her job" and jumped instead of Buffy. Then, have everyone not even remember her after she saves the world.

But, guess there is nothing we can do about it now. LOL

 

[Jay_B!]

 

[ethanTo]

I clicked it. LOL

Curiosity got the best of me. Damn

Anyways, that's why I was asking, it was, after all, years ago. Either way, just a thought for consideration

 

[Duncan_N]

I'll be up for trying to keep up with this challenge. I re-watch the odd episode now and again but not viewed the series as a whole since it was broadcast.

Will be interesting to see if it's as cohesive and enjoyable second time round.

 

[Holadem]

Jay, that was TOTALLY unnecessary. Sure, no one forced Ethan to read the spoiler, but I really cannot figure out what you thought that passage was gonna accomplish. It's not like he was asking to know, so WTF?!

--
H